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The diffrence being Johan had a mlimited no-trade, whereas Peavy is mainly saying Dodgers or Braves get it done.

Exactly, so it's even sillier to play hardball and isolate the only couple of teams that could really get it done. Of the list Peavy gave (originally) only the Braves and Dodgers really have what it takes to do the deal in their system, and the Cubs could conceivably work out a 3 way deal.

At the end of the day, the Cubs went out and signed Dempster and might end up signing the Big Unit still, the Dodgers are going to make offers to CC and he apparently wants to play out West, as for the Braves, well if they wait till all the good SS's are signed then I don't know if we're going to be willing to move Yunel, atleast we'd value him higher.

So if they're not careful here the market could dry up a bit on them, I thought Peavy's value was really before the UFA market opened, if the Braves miss out on all the UFAs they want, they could end up crawling back, the Dodgers could get more involved if they miss out on CC too, but we'll see.

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Padres general manager Kevin Towers said Wednesday night he might have identified a third team that would facilitate sending the standout pitcher to the Cubs, who don’t possess the depth in prospects or big league-ready talent to meet the Padres’ asking price.

This should be done within the week before the Winter Meetings kick off but I'm not even a fan of any of these teams or their rivals and its getting annoying.

MLB.com's Mark Bowman chatted with A.J. Burnett's agent, Darek Braunecker. Braunecker is confident he can get a five-year deal for Burnett, though a fifth year is not necessarily a requirement. A four-year deal is possible if the average annual value is significantly higher. My feeling: why pay Burnett $72MM over four years if you could get that fifth year for a marginal $8MM?

The Braves and Burnett still have mutual interest, and Braunecker characterized talks as positive. Bowman also talked to Chipper Jones, who had kind words for Burnett. Bowman believes Jones will feel more comfortable about finishing his career with the Braves if they sign Burnett.

I've watched Burnett for a while now roy and all I can tell you is cross your fingers that you don't get him. While he can be that good he really is just average, his BABIP and K/BB tells lies to his command troubles and mental breakdowns not to mention his delivery plus his stuff are factors to his numerous numerous long-term injuries.

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Well 5 years for AJ is ludicrous, personally like I said a few pages back, if we really want to contend again I'd scrap it down and start rebuilding. I love Chipper (like a little girl), but he's almost better off in the AL where he can DH when he needs to anyway.

We're going to start a cycle of mediocrity if we spend big money on guys like Burnett and Garland and keep Hampton. We're not going to build the team of the 90s through free agency.

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Well 5 years for AJ is ludicrous, personally like I said a few pages back, if we really want to contend again I'd scrap it down and start rebuilding. I love Chipper (like a little girl), but he's almost better off in the AL where he can DH when he needs to anyway.

We're going to start a cycle of mediocrity if we spend big money on guys like Burnett and Garland and keep Hampton. We're not going to build the team of the 90s through free agency.

Garland is just terrible, AJ is decent but Garland is spitable.

Personally I'm against rebuilding, the goal of a team year in and year out is to win games and to start the season thinking you can't win is just stupid IMO.

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Braves Aquire Vazquez

The White Sox, who will receive as many as three players in return, may also send left-handed reliever Boone Logan to the Braves as part of the deal. Infielder Brent Lillibridge is expected to be in the deal along with a young starting pitcher and possibly Class A catcher Tyler Flowers. Left-hander Jo-Jo Reyes was among the pitchers under discussion, but is not in the trade, sources said.

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I thought Flowers was one of the kid's that Wren refused to deal for Peavy so it's kind of surprising. I liked the idea of moving Wren who had a great fall league showing so his value is relatively high but I just don't understand the rumors that he was a roadblock in the Peavy deal...

I don't mind Vazquez, moving to the NL will definitely help him, but he's still a 3 guy IMO.

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His K/BB makes me excited in ways I can't describe on a public forum, a big knock is his HR allowed, hee could be a topline pitcher if could keep the ball in the damn park, I'm not sure what kind a park Turner Field is, (pitchers or hitters) but in US Cellular, a hitters park, but in 627.7 innings he allowed 77 homers, thats 1 homer every 8 .15 innings which in English, is pretty bad.

Otherwise his stuff is great, deadly change and piles a lot of K's, I'll agree not a savior though, but your GM said he wants 2 pitchers so this fills one hole and I guess Burnett would be the final piece he would want, good luck with that rotation if it comes true.

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Khalil Greene is going to St. Louis.

They gave up 2 minor league relievers, from what I've read... but their names haven't been released yet. They're saying that neither of the pitchers were on the major league roster at the end of the year though.

*crosses fingers* Depending on who they gave up, this might be a good gamble for the Cards... although, Greene DID only hit .213 in something like 105 games last season. Not the kind of numbers I want to see from a middle IFer.

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Khalil Greene is going to St. Louis.

They gave up 2 minor league relievers, from what I've read... but their names haven't been released yet. They're saying that neither of the pitchers were on the major league roster at the end of the year though.

*crosses fingers* Depending on who they gave up, this might be a good gamble for the Cards... although, Greene DID only hit .213 in something like 105 games last season. Not the kind of numbers I want to see from a middle IFer.

He strikes out a TON, and he doesn't walk very much. He has some pop, I think he hit 27 homers in 07 and had like 45 doubles that year while playing half his games at Petco so it's reasonable to think that he could get back around those numbers again if he's healthy and his head is in the right place, but he'll still have low average and an awful on base.

He's good - very good with the glove I think so he's likely an upgrade over what St Louis has had recently. There are better options though I think.

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He strikes out a TON, and he doesn't walk very much. He has some pop, I think he hit 27 homers in 07 and had like 45 doubles that year while playing half his games at Petco so it's reasonable to think that he could get back around those numbers again if he's healthy and his head is in the right place, but he'll still have low average and an awful on base.

He's good - very good with the glove I think so he's likely an upgrade over what St Louis has had recently. There are better options though I think.

I would contest, he was abov-average, but over the last few years his defense has declined.

His Plus-Minus

2006:+13

2007: +7

2008: (Not available to the public but it was +7 or less)

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He strikes out a TON, and he doesn't walk very much. He has some pop, I think he hit 27 homers in 07 and had like 45 doubles that year while playing half his games at Petco so it's reasonable to think that he could get back around those numbers again if he's healthy and his head is in the right place, but he'll still have low average and an awful on base.

He's good - very good with the glove I think so he's likely an upgrade over what St Louis has had recently. There are better options though I think.

There's always better options... but for some reason, my St. Louis Cardinals hate to sign them. They hate to spend money... I'm hoping that they'll make up for this by getting a second baseman that doesn't make Cardinal Nation want to barf, and a reliable, consistent starting pitcher.

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K-Rod a Met

3 years 37 mil, with a vesting 14 mil option for an extra year, not sure if its team or player or with any sort of performance requirements.

Good money, not th 14-15 mil that K-Rod was hoping for, but this was his best bet as the Mets said they were going to sign the first closer who said they were ready to sign, not wait until January.

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I don't even think hes worth that, closers are very overrated IMO and shouldn't be paid the same or more than starters who can pitch over double their innings, no matter how, "clutch" they are.

I agree that closers aren't used to their full potential, I like the idea of an "ace reliever" who pitches in big spots, whenever, rather than a guy racking up saves by getting 3 outs in a 5-2 ballgame.

Still though, with the number of saves the Mets blew it absolutely needed to be addressed, they needed a guy back there.

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I agree that closers aren't used to their full potential, I like the idea of an "ace reliever" who pitches in big spots, whenever, rather than a guy racking up saves by getting 3 outs in a 5-2 ballgame.

Still though, with the number of saves the Mets blew it absolutely needed to be addressed, they needed a guy back there.

I prefer to see the closers used for 2 innings, but thats just me.

The average relievers pitches around what 70-75 innings a year? Why can't they stretch their arm out and double that, starters pitch it all the time.

I understand it may be on consecutive days or whatever, but its the same amount of innings.

Mets just bought a guy who got a lot of saves, not a guy who can really pitch, the Jays are probably begging to get rid of a better closer (Ryan) for less money and less term.

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I don't even think hes worth that, closers are very overrated IMO and shouldn't be paid the same or more than starters who can pitch over double their innings, no matter how, "clutch" they are.

I disagree... closers can, in theory, make or break a season. Take the Phillies and Lidge for example. Not one blown save, and it helped lead them to the championship. Now on the other end of the spectrum, look at last years Cardinals. They blew 31 saves... with those extra 31 wins, they theoretically would have finished 117-45. That's insane. (Of course I'm not taking into account the game that they blew, yet went on to win in extra innings...). I don't believe closers are overrated... I would have given anything for the Cards to get 117 wins last season :P

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