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Habs Lines 2011-12


WinnipegJet

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Well, let's look at it a different way:

Is David Desharnais an NHL calibre player that you want to see in a Habs uniform for one full season?

Is DD capable of being a 4th line player?

What situation would use his skills and help the team?

IMO, Lars Eller when healthy should be a full-time Center. He needs to play and Andrei Kostitsyn needs to play with him. The question is who plays with them. What does the line lack? I would say a distributor. David Desharnais fits that role.

Is he an ideal LW? Absolutely not but I think he would help the team more as an undersized 3rd line winger than an undersized underutilized 4th line center. Eller and Ak's size could compensate for him.

I agree. Neither Eller nor Desharnais deserve to play limited 4th line time. Desharnais is obviously the better 'current' player right now, but Eller showed some major flashes at the end of last year lol. I'd like to see a line of AK-Eller-Desharnais. That'd be an exciting line to watch.

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Well, let's look at it a different way:

Is David Desharnais an NHL calibre player that you want to see in a Habs uniform for one full season?

Is DD capable of being a 4th line player?

What situation would use his skills and help the team?

IMO, Lars Eller when healthy should be a full-time Center. He needs to play and Andrei Kostitsyn needs to play with him. The question is who plays with them. What does the line lack? I would say a distributor. David Desharnais fits that role.

Is he an ideal LW? Absolutely not but I think he would help the team more as an undersized 3rd line winger than an undersized underutilized 4th line center. Eller and Ak's size could compensate for him.

yes i agree completely on everything, and i just made a post about us trying to sign john madden to fill that 4th line center role

like i said in there, i like the idea of DD rounding out a third scoring line when needs be if not all the time, and i dont like the idea of having 2 rookies for centers in the bottom 6

id like to see

cammi pleks cole

patches gomez gionta

dd eller ak

moen madden white

with moen and dd as the 2 interchangable parts

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I dont think that DD - Eller - AK line would be good defensively. I think their combined five on five minus would be dreadful. DD isn't big enough to be a winger as his cycle game is limited to puck control behind the net. Eventually he is just going to get crushed on a repeated basis.

With the roster right now Darche would be a better fit. He is bigger and durable and willing to push down the boards and when it comes down to it, he will be harder to knock off the puck in more offensive areas, where DD is certainly limited. However if I had it my way, Fredrick Sjostorm would be playing with Eller and AK.

DD is good to start the year as a fourth line centre and should see more time on special teams due to his face off ability.

Here's my choice for lines:

Paciorietty - Gomez - Gionta

Cole - Plekanec - Cammalleri

Darche - Eller - Kostitsyn

Moen - Desharnias - White

Really, when it comes down to it, there needs to be some more depth on defence and offence. A couple of third or fourth liners, who would certainly come cheap at this point would fill out the lines much better. I really don't see any issue with taking a chance on a guy like Ryan Carter from Florida. Plays hard and is a true 3rd/4th liner who would come close to league min.

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I listed the center first.

Pleks - Cammi - Cole

Gomez - Gionta - Max Pac

DD - Kostitsyn - Darche

White - Weber - Moen

I would not be afraid to move Gomez to the third line and move DD up to the 2nd line if the 2nd line does not start the season strong within 5 games. Given the serious injury to Max Pac I would even consider putting Kostitsyn on the 2nd line in the hope that DD and Max Pac can play like they did in the AHL. While Kostistyn could give the 2nd line a strong winger.

I believe Eller is currently injuried.

Subban - Gorges

Markov - Yemelin

Spacek - Gill

Price

Budaj

spares: Diaz, Eller who is currently recovering from shoulder surgery, UFA forward for 3rd or 4th line or possibly some rookie like Trotter, Kristo, Engqvist

I think Montreal still has some cap space. Even more if Spacek or Gomez contracts are handled by PG via a trade or buyout.

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We all know what lines we would like to see,but you are forgetting JM is our coach,so what you would like and what you will get are two different things,it will be interesting to see what happens,but I have an idea Cole will be with Gio and Gomez,not what I want but that's what I can see JM doing trying to fix Gomez,I would rather see DD on the second line.The actual quote from Patches about DD was he was the best player he had played with on any level,that's a bit different from the best player in Hamilton.I know you don't like comparisons to StLouis Weeps because he is a rare talent but I think DD is also a rare talent,maybe not in the same way but he has the same kind of guts and heart and that will always make him special.

GO HABS GO :lol: :lol:

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If I were Jacques, on opening day:

Michael Cammalleri - Tomas Plekanec - Brian Gionta

Max Pacioretty - David Desharnais - Erik Cole

Travis Moen - Lars Eller - Andrei Kostitsyn

Mathieu Darche - Scott Gomez - Ryan White

Aaron Palushaj - Brian Willsie

Andrei Markov - Jaroslav Spacek

Hal Gill - P.K. Subban

Josh Gorges - Yannick Weber

Paul Mara

Carey Price

Peter Budaj

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If I were Jacques, on opening day:

Michael Cammalleri - Tomas Plekanec - Brian Gionta

Max Pacioretty - David Desharnais - Erik Cole

Travis Moen - Lars Eller - Andrei Kostitsyn

Mathieu Darche - Scott Gomez - Ryan White

Aaron Palushaj - Brian Willsie

Andrei Markov - Jaroslav Spacek

Hal Gill - P.K. Subban

Josh Gorges - Yannick Weber

Paul Mara

Carey Price

Peter Budaj

Eller is injured to start the year and I don't think putting Gomez on the 4th line right away is a good idea. Play him on the second with Pacioretty and Gionta and see how they mesh. Cole, as much as he isn't necessarily a first liner, would be better off on the first line with Plekanec and Cammalleri. Will give Pleks more passing options and free up some perimeter for Cammalleri to snipe from - with Cole right on the doorstep for rebounds.

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Eller is injured to start the year and I don't think putting Gomez on the 4th line right away is a good idea. Play him on the second with Pacioretty and Gionta and see how they mesh. Cole, as much as he isn't necessarily a first liner, would be better off on the first line with Plekanec and Cammalleri. Will give Pleks more passing options and free up some perimeter for Cammalleri to snipe from - with Cole right on the doorstep for rebounds.

I hear what you're saying, but it's not like Patches/Gomez/Gionta are a new unit. They've been together before and it hasn't seemed to help Gomez at all. I think both Pacioretty and Gionta need to get away from Gomez. Then again, I think anyone wearing a Habs uniform needs to get away from Gomez. I was a little hesitant to have three small guys on the top line (or any line, for that matter) but I thought, with the two-way play of Gionta and Plekanec in last year's playoffs, it could work - especially with Markov and his quick transition game back. I wasn't aware of Eller's injury; I hope he isn't out for too long. In the meantime, I would put Gomez in his spot (though having Gomez and AKost on the same line scares me) and replace Gomez with White on the fourth line with Palushaj playing the right wing. Hopefully Gomez can show himself to be a top-six forward again but my patience is wearing thin.

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I hear what you're saying, but it's not like Patches/Gomez/Gionta are a new unit. They've been together before and it hasn't seemed to help Gomez at all. I think both Pacioretty and Gionta need to get away from Gomez. Then again, I think anyone wearing a Habs uniform needs to get away from Gomez. I was a little hesitant to have three small guys on the top line (or any line, for that matter) but I thought, with the two-way play of Gionta and Plekanec in last year's playoffs, it could work - especially with Markov and his quick transition game back. I wasn't aware of Eller's injury; I hope he isn't out for too long. In the meantime, I would put Gomez in his spot (though having Gomez and AKost on the same line scares me) and replace Gomez with White on the fourth line with Palushaj playing the right wing. Hopefully Gomez can show himself to be a top-six forward again but my patience is wearing thin.

i dont have the stats in front of me to back it up but im sure you are wrong, when patches was with gomez and gionta gomez put up the bulk of his points on the year. that was the only time he was scoring

i can almost guarantee that will be the line to start the year

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I hear what you're saying, but it's not like Patches/Gomez/Gionta are a new unit. They've been together before and it hasn't seemed to help Gomez at all. I think both Pacioretty and Gionta need to get away from Gomez. Then again, I think anyone wearing a Habs uniform needs to get away from Gomez. I was a little hesitant to have three small guys on the top line (or any line, for that matter) but I thought, with the two-way play of Gionta and Plekanec in last year's playoffs, it could work - especially with Markov and his quick transition game back. I wasn't aware of Eller's injury; I hope he isn't out for too long. In the meantime, I would put Gomez in his spot (though having Gomez and AKost on the same line scares me) and replace Gomez with White on the fourth line with Palushaj playing the right wing. Hopefully Gomez can show himself to be a top-six forward again but my patience is wearing thin.

When he played with Pacioretty he was at a point per game pace I think

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Source? I don't remember hearing Eller was injured.

Eller hurt his shoulder after a check from Adam McQuaid in the playoffs. Most of the media outlets (H I/O, RDS...) have reported his rehab will take 4-6 months, and it is expected that he will likely miss the first couple of weeks of the season as he gets back into game shape.

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Michael Cammalleri - Tomas Plekanec - Erik Cole

Max Pacioretty - Scott Gomez - Brian Gionta

Andrei Kostitsyn - Lars Eller - Steve Bernier (Gives the habs a very big line with lots of physical play with potential to score.)

Darche/White - David Desharnais - Travis Moen

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The lines I feel should start if everyones healthy

Cammalleri - plekanec - cole (legit 1st line)

Paches - gomez - gionta (damn good 2nd line)

Ak - eller - moen (big energy line potential scoring)

White - dd - darche (2 fast rookies, vet presance not afraid to crash the net)

I think you have to keep white and dd together both are so fast and if dd rubs off on white we could see some goals. I think darche is the better player to put with them because darche has had to work above and behond to get where he is today.

It mostly all is dependant on what gomez does this year. If he plays as good as he can we will be serious contenders

Def

Markov - subban

gill - gorges

Spacek - webber/yemelin

I really don't like our defense after the top 2. We have some serious holes there and I think we are 1 top 4 dman away from being set. Markov and subban are a legit top 2 subbans year with gill has made him a lot more defensive and he is more then capable of playing against the top lines.

Gill and gorges are the perfect 3rd pairing but right now we have 2 3rd pairing d pairs. Unless yamelin can come over and play top 4 hockey we beTter make some trades and soon

Goalies a given

Price should play 65-70 games with the bulk being before christmas

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The lines I feel should start if everyones healthy

Cammalleri - plekanec - cole (legit 1st line)

Paches - gomez - gionta (damn good 2nd line)

Ak - eller - moen (big energy line potential scoring)

White - dd - darche (2 fast rookies, vet presance not afraid to crash the net)

I think you have to keep white and dd together both are so fast and if dd rubs off on white we could see some goals. I think darche is the better player to put with them because darche has had to work above and behond to get where he is today.

It mostly all is dependant on what gomez does this year. If he plays as good as he can we will be serious contenders

Def

Markov - subban

gill - gorges

Spacek - webber/yemelin

I really don't like our defense after the top 2. We have some serious holes there and I think we are 1 top 4 dman away from being set. Markov and subban are a legit top 2 subbans year with gill has made him a lot more defensive and he is more then capable of playing against the top lines.

Gill and gorges are the perfect 3rd pairing but right now we have 2 3rd pairing d pairs. Unless yamelin can come over and play top 4 hockey we beTter make some trades and soon

Goalies a given

Price should play 65-70 games with the bulk being before christmas

That sounds about right.

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Love this thread.

Markov-Subban seems to be a recurring theme that I deeply disagree with. It doesnt make sense to put your 2 puck movers together and then your 2 defensive stoppers together, 1 of each has, is and will be the classic method to form a D pair. Just because PK is right handed doesnt mean he should be next to Markov.

Also, everybody wants to stick DD on the 4th line. If the habs have to choose(they don't) between Eller and DD for 4th line duty, Lars is far better suited for it. Putting DD with Moen and White for example is like delivering pizza to a bulimic. It's a waste of quality stuff.

I am going to skip along to when Eller is healthy:

Cammalleri - Plekanec - Cole

Still, have a feeling JM will play him with GG but Cole prefers RW and he deserves to play with Pleks to maximize his ability to succeed.

Pacioretty - Gomez - Gionta

This will be tried out again, worked well previously, JM wants to construct a solid top 9.

Desharnais - Eller - Kostitsyn

Eller may end up on the wing if DD is better on draws, the key is to look at the composite skills here: Slick distributor, good forechecking/cycling player, strong shooter. This has the makings of a productive line.

Darche - White - Moen

An honest, ol' fashioned canadian grind line. None of these 3 have great hands but they can all hit, play physical and as a line provide the kind of energy/puck possesion shifts every team needs. Again, if you place DD here and swap him for any of the 3, you minimize the offense on line 3 and the "grind" of line 4. Doesn't make sense.

Markov - Gorges

Played together before, both will be rusty, both will work hard to get into shape and their games compliment each other.

Gill - Subban

Worked well at the end, is the only reason Gill was re-signed.

Emelin - Weber

This is for when eller comes back. My feeling is the habs will play 11 forwards and 7 defenceman until Lars is back during which time Weber will become a surprising presence on the PP and will carve his name into the lineup at the expense of Spacek. This line looks young and shaky on occasion, Spacek gets rotated in frequently.

Price

Should be limited to 60 games this year.

Budaj

Proves all he needed was a defence corps and a goalie coach.

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Love this thread.

Markov-Subban seems to be a recurring theme that I deeply disagree with. It doesnt make sense to put your 2 puck movers together and then your 2 defensive stoppers together, 1 of each has, is and will be the classic method to form a D pair. Just because PK is right handed doesnt mean he should be next to Markov.

Also, everybody wants to stick DD on the 4th line. If the habs have to choose(they don't) between Eller and DD for 4th line duty, Lars is far better suited for it. Putting DD with Moen and White for example is like delivering pizza to a bulimic. It's a waste of quality stuff.

I am going to skip along to when Eller is healthy:

Cammalleri - Plekanec - Cole

Still, have a feeling JM will play him with GG but Cole prefers RW and he deserves to play with Pleks to maximize his ability to succeed.

Pacioretty - Gomez - Gionta

This will be tried out again, worked well previously, JM wants to construct a solid top 9.

Desharnais - Eller - Kostitsyn

Eller may end up on the wing if DD is better on draws, the key is to look at the composite skills here: Slick distributor, good forechecking/cycling player, strong shooter. This has the makings of a productive line.

Darche - White - Moen

An honest, ol' fashioned canadian grind line. None of these 3 have great hands but they can all hit, play physical and as a line provide the kind of energy/puck possesion shifts every team needs. Again, if you place DD here and swap him for any of the 3, you minimize the offense on line 3 and the "grind" of line 4. Doesn't make sense.

Markov - Gorges

Played together before, both will be rusty, both will work hard to get into shape and their games compliment each other.

Gill - Subban

Worked well at the end, is the only reason Gill was re-signed.

Emelin - Weber

This is for when eller comes back. My feeling is the habs will play 11 forwards and 7 defenceman until Lars is back during which time Weber will become a surprising presence on the PP and will carve his name into the lineup at the expense of Spacek. This line looks young and shaky on occasion, Spacek gets rotated in frequently.

Price

Should be limited to 60 games this year.

Budaj

Proves all he needed was a defence corps and a goalie coach.

Beautiful, outstanding logic lol

I agree with your lines. However, I still think DD is 'currently' the better center. That's just a detail though!

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Beautiful, outstanding logic lol

I agree with your lines. However, I still think DD is 'currently' the better center. That's just a detail though!

I would go with:

Pacioretty-Plekanec-Cole

Cammalari-Gomez-Gionta

Kostitsyn-Eller-Darche ** Kostitsyn-Prospal-Zherdev **

Moen-Desharnais-White ** Darche - Desharnais - White **

Markov-Gorges ** Markov- Radek Martinek **

Gill-Subban

Yemelin-Weber ** Gorges-Weber or Yemlin- Gorges **

Spacek

Price

Budaj

I feel that Cammy fits better with Gomez and Gionta, so we have a line with speed passing an a couple of snipers too!

Max and Pleks and Cole seems to fit better giving us a tough big line that will be hard to play against. AK can fit into Max's spot if needed as he did in later part of last year. AK likes to hit too so he would be a good piece for this line.

Eller was better at the end of the season but I still feel he should have played in the AHL. I do not believe he will develop as well here in the NHL and would be better off with a year of seasoning in the AHL. I would like to get someone like Prospal (UFA) to play 3rd line for us @ $ 1 m a season. Prospal had 23 points in 29 games and could fill in on the top or second line if needed, something ELler could not do. Then there is Zherdev (UFA)who I believe could be a top line right wing and at 26 has shown in previous seasons that he can get the job done and for $2 m or less a season is a bargain. On our 3rd line we would have 1st line talent and that would help us win more battles and address and improve our scoring.

Radek Martinek (UFA) is a good defensive shut down right shot dman who is used to 1st line minutes (23 minutes a game). Makes good passes and has a good shot from the point. Would give us some depth at d. He made $ 1.9 m last year and for that or less he could be cheap insurance. Could spell off with Gorges on the 1st line and play the beginning of the season as Gorges right knee injury may not be fully healed for the start of the season. With Martinek Gorges could play 3rd line left or right dman position if the Yemelin Weber combo is not effective. Martinek just gives us more options and for the money is a solid addition.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I am going to be rather bold here(assuming everyone is healthy at opening night):

Pacioretty-Plekanec-Cammalleri:

I really think that the Pleky-Cammy combo needs a big body to dig the puck out of the corners, hit opposition, and feed the snipers. This could also benefit the chemistry in the PP (1st unit).

Kostitsyn-Eller-Cole:

Very aggressive and gritty line that can matchup well to high hitting opposition lines, keep up with them, and be aware defensevly. I can imagine this line developing great chemistry.

Gomez-Desharnais-Gionta:

Small speedy line that would create havoc to bottom line opposition defenders. Put Gomez at wing for a change, without seperating him from the captain. This may pain out to be the most productive line. Suggesting them as the 2nd PP unit.

Moen-White-Darche:

Gritty, old fashioned shutdown line, with limited ice time.

Markov-Emelin:

An offensive defensemen paired with a stay at home player that can be used in the PP as 1st unit. Lets hope Markov can mentor Emelin through difficult situations and develope some Russian chemistry.

Subban-Gorges:

An offensive defensemen paired with a stay at home player that can be used in the PP as 2nd unit. Gorges is capable of covering Subban when he pinches.

Weber-Gill:

An offensive defensemen paired with a stay at home player. Lets hope Gill can mentor and develope Weber the way he did Subban last year. Keep Spacek as the 7th D in case of injuries.

The whole philosophy is that we have to role effectivly all lines to be able to keep our players fresh and healthy for the long run. Teams that have won the Cup resently have had depth in all lines, making difficult matchups for the opponents. Don't forget how effective was the Bruins in the playoffs with their 3-4 lines.

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I'm happy about our forwards corps this season, but very concerned about our defense, which looks to be weaker on paper than last year's unit.

1: Markov

2: Subban

3: ??

4: ??

5: Gill, Gorges

6: Spacek, Yemelin, Diaz, Weber

If this group suffers any injuries at all, we are going to have a very hard time winning games unless Carey stands on his head, because it is already a thin group with a deficit of top-four d-men and too many 5-6 guys who are either too old (Gill, Spacek) or too young / unseasoned (Yemelin, Weber, Diaz).

Frankly, I'm not impressed.

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I'm happy about our forwards corps this season, but very concerned about our defense, which looks to be weaker on paper than last year's unit.

1: Markov

2: Subban

3: ??

4: ??

5: Gill, Gorges

6: Spacek, Yemelin, Diaz, Weber

If this group suffers any injuries at all, we are going to have a very hard time winning games unless Carey stands on his head, because it is already a thin group with a deficit of top-four d-men and too many 5-6 guys who are either too old (Gill, Spacek) or too young / unseasoned (Yemelin, Weber, Diaz).

Frankly, I'm not impressed.

Doesn't look great... I agree :(

But, the Habs could go with 8 d-men in the line-up right off the bat... see where it goes from there.

I know its outside the box to think this way, but it could be a benefit all around for the team and the players IMO. Ice time could be managed in-game and/or substitutes could still be available during the season or if injuries occur.

And if the Habs would be willing to add one or two experienced right-hand d-men (even 5th/6th) then it could be better still. There still are some available out there that could come on the cheap IMO. Staios and Boynton for example. I'm thinking that the defense could work for one more season with a tweak like that.

I'm seriously thinking about this for the starting line-up for the Habs...

Cammalleri-Plekanec-Cole

Paciortetty-Gomez-Gionta

Moen-Desharnais(Eller)-Kostitsyn

Yemelin-White(Desharnais)-Weber

Darche, Engqvist (as a call-up until Eller can be worked back into the line-up)

Markov-Subban

Gorges-Boynton

Gill/Spacek-Staios

Diaz (as a call-up or to replace Weber in the line-up if he turns out to be the better option)

In this scenario it is obvious that both Markov and Subban would be the most utilized of the bunch. Gorges and Gill could still get most time killing penalties. As the game progresses, and as needed, both Weber and Yemelin could help out on the "D" when the bench gets shortened for the 4th line and to spot the older d-men that could be wearing down. It gives the Habs 4 lefties and 4 right-hand shots to work with.

I'd say it is worth a try for one more year.

Then again if the Habs could get their hands on the likes of one Shea Weber... I'd think differently. ;)

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I'm happy about our forwards corps this season, but very concerned about our defense, which looks to be weaker on paper than last year's unit.

1: Markov

2: Subban

3: ??

4: ??

5: Gill, Gorges

6: Spacek, Yemelin, Diaz, Weber

If this group suffers any injuries at all, we are going to have a very hard time winning games unless Carey stands on his head, because it is already a thin group with a deficit of top-four d-men and too many 5-6 guys who are either too old (Gill, Spacek) or too young / unseasoned (Yemelin, Weber, Diaz).

Frankly, I'm not impressed.

Weeps.........here I'll fix it for you...........

1: Markov

2: Subban

3: Cap Space

4: Cap Space

5: Gill, Gorges

6: Spacek, Yemelin, Diaz, Weber

There.......how does that look. Those bolded guys are good and if the Habs get rid of Gomez and Spacek they'd have more of those guys.

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LOL, nice one, and I get your point, but cap space can't make a good first pass out of the zone. ;) At some point, we need to use that cap space productively to acquire or sign legitimate top-four defensemen in or close to their physical prime. That said, rebuilding the D wasn't going to be an overnight job. Most likely, we'll be in a better position to fix our blue line next summer.

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