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BigTed3

2012-13 Habs Lines

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Does anyone have Gomez coming back and centering a line in the top six?

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Does anyone have Gomez coming back and centering a line in the top six?

Id personally like to see how Eller would do on the #2lw spot which would see Gomez centre the 3rd line. If they want Eller to stick to centre I'd try Gomez on the #2lw spot but I'd like to see DD ad Pleks centre the top 2 lines

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Id personally like to see how Eller would do on the #2lw spot which would see Gomez centre the 3rd line. If they want Eller to stick to centre I'd try Gomez on the #2lw spot but I'd like to see DD ad Pleks centre the top 2 lines

Fair enough. I'm wondering if what we would look like with Eller on the wing and Tomas centering a shutdown line.

Max Pacioretty - David Desharnais - Erik Cole

Lars Eller - Scott Gomez - Brian Gionta

Rene Bourque - Tomas Plekanec - Travis Moen

Brandon Prust - Petteri Nokelainen - Colby Armstrong

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Fair enough. I'm wondering if what we would look like with Eller on the wing and Tomas centering a shutdown line.

Max Pacioretty - David Desharnais - Erik Cole

Lars Eller - Scott Gomez - Brian Gionta

Rene Bourque - Tomas Plekanec - Travis Moen

Brandon Prust - Petteri Nokelainen - Colby Armstrong

I think it'd work but after putting Pleks with everyone but Price last year we should try giving him some offensive talent and see what he can do. I just don't want to cater to Gomez after his play last year, IMO he should be blessed to be in MTL at all

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If Gomez is going to be here next year, either play him at wing on the Eller line, or use him on the Plekanec line if Bourque can't get it done (either at center or wing -- Tomas isn't a stellar face-off man so I don't have a huge problem with moving him to the wing). What I DON'T want is for us to bounce Eller around the lineup to accommodate Gomez. We need to know where we stand with Eller this season. He should be locked in as our third-line center and not moved arbitrarily to the wing just because we're trying to get some minimal return on a $7 million cap hit.

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Fair enough. I'm wondering if what we would look like with Eller on the wing and Tomas centering a shutdown line.

Max Pacioretty - David Desharnais - Erik Cole

Lars Eller - Scott Gomez - Brian Gionta

Rene Bourque - Tomas Plekanec - Travis Moen

Brandon Prust - Petteri Nokelainen - Colby Armstrong

Plekanec is TOO good to be on the shutdown line. It's a waste of his offensive talents. Our best bet is if Eller and our 4th line can shoulder more of that load.

I also disagree with the idea of using Pacioretty on Tomas's line. Pacioretty is probably our worst forward from a defensive standpoint, and moreover, he's a goalscorer. Don't saddle him with two-way responsibilities that he can't handle, don't take away his OZone time, let Bourque or one of the kids ride shotgun with Tomas and Brian and let Patches loose on the top line where his prime function is to score or set up his linemates to score.

I think if Pacioretty is going to be on Plekanec's line, we need to see a shift in Tomas' responsibilities. If we had someone else to shut down the opposing team's top lines, we could let him loose in a more offensive role.

Edited by dwdemonwolf
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Plekanec is TOO good to be on the shutdown line. It's a waste of his offensive talents. Our best bet is if Eller and our 4th line can shoulder more of that load.

Agreed on Plekanec, and Gomez has no business being on a 2nd line.

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Plekanec centered Patches and Cole for a whooping two games last year, and they accounted for 4 goals in that span.

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The quality and depth of analysis on this thread is quite intimidating...but I like this line making game way too much to stay out of it LOL. So here I go...

Bourque/Eller- Plekanec- Gionta

Pacioretty- Desharnais- Cole

Eller/Bourque- Gomez/Eller- Moen

Prust- Armstrong

White, Leblanc, Gallagher.

Markov- Emelin

Subban- Jorges

Diaz- Boullion

Kabarle

Tinordi.

Price

Huet?

[/boredom]

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The quality and depth of analysis on this thread is quite intimidating...but I like this line making game way too much to stay out of it LOL. So here I go...

Bourque/Eller- Plekanec- Gionta

Pacioretty- Desharnais- Cole

Eller/Bourque- Gomez/Eller- Moen

Prust- Armstrong

White, Leblanc, Gallagher.

Markov- Emelin

Subban- Jorges

Diaz- Boullion

Kabarle

Tinordi.

Price

Huet?

[/boredom]

Huet? were did he come from? What about Budaj signed for the upcoming season. I guess Huet and Budaj can split the workload of the 10 games Carey will let them play... :P

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2013-2014: This is what I foresee as the template we're driving towards.

Pacioretty - Desharnais - Cole

Hopefully this is legit for a couple of seasons, I'm skeptical.

Eller - Galchenyuk - Leblanc

The reason why I want Eller and Leblanc getting experience on the wings in 2012.

Bourque - Plekanec - Gionta

As an actual checking/2 way veteran line, there would be few better in the league.

Prust - White - Moen

Looks like this is the 4th line for a while.

Spare: Dumont, Schultz

Gorges - Subban

Our number 1 duo for the near future.

Markov - Emelin

One of them needs to be bumped eventually.

Beaulieu - Tinordi

Let them get chemistry and make mistakes together.

Spare: St-Denis

Price

Franchise.

Desjardins

AHL: Gallagher, Dumont

Some genius cap work/trades drops Kaberle, Gomez. Bouillon, Armstrong, Budaj walk.

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As it stands barring a trade...

Pacioretty-Desharnais-Cole...

Why change a successful combination to start the season

Plekanec-Gomez-Gionta...

I know, I know! Remember when Pacioretty was doing so well with Gomez and Gionta before the hit by that big thug Chara from Boston... speed was what made that line dangerous IMO. Plekanec can skate, he has a better shot than Gomez and played the wing as a pro before (besides he could still take the face-offs if need be, then slide over to the left side wing). A last chance for Gomez to redeem something if there is something to be redeemed.

Prust-Eller-Bourque...

With what we are paying these guys they should be together. Eller is a right-hand center while Bourque, though a left-hand shot, had his better seasons playing right wing (like Cole he may be better there). The line would definitely have size with an element of toughness and some scoring ability.

Moen-Nokelainen-Armstrong/White...

I would like to see what Noky at 6'1" 202LBS., could do with a regular 4th line shift. A former 1st rounder (16th overall) that has good speed and an edge to his game (as do many Finns). He is a better and faster skater than White and does possess relative skill. White had played more right-wing I think. Moen and Armstrong represent toughness and size with an ability to play defensively and add occasional scoring.

Spares: many possibilities in Hamilton

Defense is where some uncertainty could lie at this point. The addition of another lefty in Bouillon to the mix complicates things for me at least. Gorges had played the right side but other than that the team is thin there with only Subban as a true right-D (unless Diaz and Weber are still in the mix somehow... spares?).

Left side if set could be Markov, Gorges, Kaberle... where we go from there is anyone's guess. And IMO, defense is the area that MB should look to change via a trade if he can.

Of course things could change if any or all of Gomez, Kaberle and Bourque were moved. But I have my doubts at this point.

Edited by Habs_Hockey_Nutz
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As it stands barring a trade...

Pacioretty-Desharnais-Cole...

Why change a successful combination to start the season

Plekanec-Gomez-Gionta...

I know, I know! Remember when Pacioretty was doing so well with Gomez and Gionta before the hit by that big thug Chara from Boston... speed was what made that line dangerous IMO. Plekanec can skate, he has a better shot than Gomez and played the wing as a pro before (besides he could still take the face-offs if need be, then slide over to the left side wing). A last chance for Gomez to redeem something if there is something to be redeemed.

Prust-Eller-Bourque...

With what we are paying these guys they should be together. Eller is a right-hand center while Bourque, though a left-hand shot, had his better seasons playing right wing (like Cole he may be better there). The line would definitely have size with an element of toughness and some scoring ability.

Moen-Nokelainen-Armstrong/White...

I would like to see what Noky at 6'1" 202LBS., could do with a regular 4th line shift. A former 1st rounder (16th overall) that has good speed and an edge to his game (as do many Finns). He is a better and faster skater than White and does possess relative skill. White had played more right-wing I think. Moen and Armstrong represent toughness and size with an ability to play defensively and add occasional scoring.

Spares: many possibilities in Hamilton

Defense is where some uncertainty could lie at this point. The addition of another lefty in Bouillon to the mix complicates things for me at least. Gorges had played the right side but other than that the team is thin there with only Subban as a true right-D (unless Diaz and Weber are still in the mix somehow... spares?).

Left side if set could be Markov, Gorges, Kaberle... where we go from there is anyone's guess. And IMO, defense is the area that MB should look to change via a trade if he can.

Of course things could change if any or all of Gomez, Kaberle and Bourque were moved. But I have my doubts at this point.

Your 2nd line will be outscored, outplayed, outsized and finally thrown out of the rink from the top opposition combinations. If there is any chance of Gomez coming back (cross my fingers he won't) and we try to create more than one scoring line, then the lines should, in my opinion look something like this:

Eller-Plekanec-Cole

Pacioretty-Desharnais-Bourque

Prust-Gomez-Gionta

Moen-White-Armstrong

If we have to reunite last years top line due to low production, i would do:

Pacioretty-Desharnais-Cole

Bourque-Plekanec-Gionta

Moen-Eller-Prust

White-Gomez-Armstrong

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Your 2nd line will be outscored, outplayed, outsized and finally thrown out of the rink from the top opposition combinations. If there is any chance of Gomez coming back (cross my fingers he won't) and we try to create more than one scoring line, then the lines should, in my opinion look something like this:

Eller-Plekanec-Cole

Pacioretty-Desharnais-Bourque

Prust-Gomez-Gionta

Moen-White-Armstrong

If we have to reunite last years top line due to low production, i would do:

Pacioretty-Desharnais-Cole

Bourque-Plekanec-Gionta

Moen-Eller-Prust

White-Gomez-Armstrong

Oh my! So negative... but your opinion. Why pray-tell was Pacioretty-Gomez-Gionta doing so well at the time? IMO Plekanec can hold his own as well as Pacioretty did and the speed factor still remains. And yet you seem comfortable with Bourque-Plekanec-Gionta... go figure! Personally I think your line combinations (trying to convert Eller to a top line left wing when he plays much better at center, and having White center a 4th line even though he has rarely played there from what I understand, makes me question your logic (which you haven't explained). The Gomez factor seems to way heavily on your assessment... but using him as you seem to want to does not help the team and most likely hurts it more IMO. But, to each his own.

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Oh my! So negative... but your opinion. Why pray-tell was Pacioretty-Gomez-Gionta doing so well at the time? IMO Plekanec can hold his own as well as Pacioretty did and the speed factor still remains. And yet you seem comfortable with Bourque-Plekanec-Gionta... go figure! Personally I think your line combinations (trying to convert Eller to a top line left wing when he plays much better at center, and having White center a 4th line even though he has rarely played there from what I understand, makes me question your logic (which you haven't explained). The Gomez factor seems to way heavily on your assessment... but using him as you seem to want to does not help the team and most likely hurts it more IMO. But, to each his own.

Keep Gomez at the 2nd line center spot, in your Habs version, IMO...Maybe we should wonder...Scotty, is that you??? :P

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Say we sign Semin you wouldn't put him on the top line cause those spots are filled,

Patches DD Cole

Semin Eller Gionta

Bourque Plekanec Armstrong (if anyone can get points out of them it's plekanec)

then idc about the 4h line

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I don't know why there is a sudden movement to play Tomas on the third line, to me that's absolutely insane. Understand: there are only so many quality minutes to go around, and if you are using Plekanec as a third-line center, he's getting way less total ice time in all situations, which means his production will drop and his ability to contribute will be limited. I like Eller but he hasn't proven AT ALL that he's ready to do what Tomas is currently doing.

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I don't know why there is a sudden movement to play Tomas on the third line, to me that's absolutely insane. Understand: there are only so many quality minutes to go around, and if you are using Plekanec as a third-line center, he's getting way less total ice time in all situations, which means his production will drop and his ability to contribute will be limited. I like Eller but he hasn't proven AT ALL that he's ready to do what Tomas is currently doing.

lol it was just a thought

But eller needs more ice time with better line mates to prove anything

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Keep Gomez at the 2nd line center spot, in your Habs version, IMO...Maybe we should wonder...Scotty, is that you??? :P

Here's the thing which leads me to believe that 'Scotty', if he does play for the Habs in 2012-13, is still best suited for a role as the designated number two center... He is not a standout defensive player, penalty killer, great checker/forechecker, tough guy or gritty winger with a great shot. The bottom six seems to me to be a place where you want those strengths. He can still skate, carry the puck and pass if he has someone that can compliment him in an offensive role... and that means, IMO, top six.

So why did he have success with Pacioretty and Gionta? His role was offensive (just as Desharnais' was last season).

Further to the discussion... Eller has proven one thing, as far as I'm concerned... he plays his best as a centerman with other players of his size and stature. That is why I would see him playing between Prust and Bourque on the third line... where both Bourque (RW) and Prust (LW) are playing positions they are likely best at.

Playing Moen as the 4th line left-wing is not really a detriment to what other aspects he can bring to the ice... like the penalty kill and defensive play... while Armstrong is a natural right-wing with size. You can question the choice of Nokelainen at center, but did he really get the opportunity to play regular minutes for a sustained period of time last season?

Now back to Plekanec... He has played left-wing at a professional level, he can skate has a better shot than Gomez and can be quite effective along the boards. He still could take face-offs if need be. Giving Tomas a chance to play in an offensive role and easing him away from that of the designated leader of the checking corps against other team's top lines, does two things IMO... it makes the Habs offense more dangerous and allows others the chance to take on the role of shutdown players.

That's it for now ;)

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Pacioretty-Desharnais-Cole

Bourque/LL-Plekanec-Gionta

Moen-Eller-Avtsin

Prust-White-Armstrong

I know most people here will think i'm an idiot for thinking this but Avtsin brings size and skill, if he can create a chemistry with Eller It could be a good 3rd line

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But eller needs more ice time with better line mates to prove anything

He'll definitely have better linemates this year even on the third line: one of Gomez or Bourque on one wing, and Armstrong, Moen, or Prust on the other. That's fine in a third-line capacity. What Eller needs to do is demonstrate that he has a future as a top-six center in this league, and in order to do that, he has to elevate his puck distribution. He can score, we know that, but can he throw up 40-50 assists per year? So far, I haven't seen the vision from him that normally goes hand in hand with those stats. If he can elevate his assist total this season, he'll have taken the next step in his development. If he can't, next season I turn him into a two-way second-line winger and cut bait on Lars as a center project.

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He'll definitely have better linemates this year even on the third line: one of Gomez or Bourque on one wing, and Armstrong, Moen, or Prust on the other. That's fine in a third-line capacity. What Eller needs to do is demonstrate that he has a future as a top-six center in this league, and in order to do that, he has to elevate his puck distribution. He can score, we know that, but can he throw up 40-50 assists per year? So far, I haven't seen the vision from him that normally goes hand in hand with those stats. If he can elevate his assist total this season, he'll have taken the next step in his development. If he can't, next season I turn him into a two-way second-line winger and cut bait on Lars as a center project.

Fair Enough

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With Gomez:

Two and a half men

Eller Plekanec Gionta

As detailed above speed works with Gionta. Size does too. Eller has both. As I said above I want to see Lars on the wing for at least 10 games because I eventually see him paired with Galchenyuk in the top 6.

Bourque Gomez Armstrong

The raiders of the lost scoring ark. Either Colby's motivation is contagious or this will be float city.

Moen White Prust

'Nuff said.

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With are without Gomez this lineup needs work but this how i see it being :

Pacman- DD- Cole

Bourque- Pleks - Gomez

Armstrong - Eller - Gionta

Moen- White/ Noks- Prust

I think the first 3 lines are offensive lines mostly but Pleks line will have some defensive starts. If chemistry ends with that first line move Cole to the second.

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As it stands barring a trade...

Pacioretty-Desharnais-Cole...

Why change a successful combination to start the season

Plekanec-Gomez-Gionta...

I know, I know! Remember when Pacioretty was doing so well with Gomez and Gionta before the hit by that big thug Chara from Boston... speed was what made that line dangerous IMO. Plekanec can skate, he has a better shot than Gomez and played the wing as a pro before (besides he could still take the face-offs if need be, then slide over to the left side wing). A last chance for Gomez to redeem something if there is something to be redeemed.

Prust-Eller-Bourque...

With what we are paying these guys they should be together. Eller is a right-hand center while Bourque, though a left-hand shot, had his better seasons playing right wing (like Cole he may be better there). The line would definitely have size with an element of toughness and some scoring ability.

Moen-Nokelainen-Armstrong/White...

I would like to see what Noky at 6'1" 202LBS., could do with a regular 4th line shift. A former 1st rounder (16th overall) that has good speed and an edge to his game (as do many Finns). He is a better and faster skater than White and does possess relative skill. White had played more right-wing I think. Moen and Armstrong represent toughness and size with an ability to play defensively and add occasional scoring.

I really like those lines, especially your new second line. Giving Gomez two responsible veterans as wingers might be exactly what the doctor ordered in order to maximize his value on the ice. While not very imposing physically, our new 'Little Three' should have enough experience to find open ice and make things happen offensively.

I'd probably swap Armstrong and Prust though, as I feel Colby has slightly more offensive upside, having one 20+ goal season under his belt already. The new fourth line looks good too and can actually play hockey. Nice :)

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