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Michael Ryder


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One problem I have with Ryder is that I'm not sure he has the footspeed to keep up with the rest of the team. Cammalleri had a great shot like Ryder, but he could also wheel down the ice when needed to. In Ryder's case, I'm not sure I see a lot value in his playing with Plekanec and Galchenyuk or Deharnais and Pacioretty. Those players turn defensive situations into offensive ones rather quickly, and with one of our biggest assets being team speed, it's nice to have full lines that can turn 2-on-2's into 3-on-2's and give us odd-man rushes. Yes, Ryder will likely bring something to the PP and yes, he provides a bit more net presence than a guy like Cammalleri, but all in all, I'm just not sure he's a good fit for the system we play and the complement of players already in our top 9.

Agreed on the speed aspect for now at least. I seem to remember him as being a faster skater... so far it does look at times as though he has lost a step. It could also be uncertainty on his part. But speed isn't everything... even on a team that doe use speed to its advantage. Having a player coming late that has a good shot may be what is needed on a line if that player is complimented by the right combo up front. Maybe if Bourque was back and playing as he had before his injury things might look different for Ryder as the third man in. We still need to give it time I think.

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Hey, a player who posts 3 assists during a transition period / slump is fine in my book. He may not be scoring himself, but he's aiding in other players scoring.

Classic Ryder, been watching him alot in Dallas the last two years. He'll go three-four games without a point and then get 10 in the next five.

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Wasn't overly impressed with his performance despite the 3 assists. I believe they were all second assists, and I don't recall him doing anything overly skilled to make those plays. I'm still willing to give him time to get adjusted, so that's not a knock on what he can do to help us, but I think those points are a bit misleading. Ryder's not a great skater and he's not great defensively. He's here to score goals, and that's what the measuring stick will be at the end of the year that determines whether we re-sign him or not.

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His offense has been steady since leaving Montreal, but as you said BT, he's not a strong skater or good defensively.

I feel Cole was better defensively and he was a strong, fast, skater that often drew penalties.

Ryder is still getting use to his new team, so he does deserve a grace period, but i feel that period is slowly coming to an end. It's time for him to start producing. On paper and looking at it as a business move, it was a good move, but i feel Dallas may get more out of cole than we are going to get from Ryder-that's just my gutt feeling.

With RB out, we're in desprate need of size in our top 6 and Ryder doesn't have size or a physical player. I'd rather let him walk and hav MB pick up something in the off season either through FA or trade. So far the FA market isn't looking very good for this summer. We may luck out with the cap going down, i know some teams are right up against the cap as is, they may be willing to let go of a few players to get under cap. With Gomez' buyout and with Cole's salary off the books, we'll probably be in a good situation to take another teams cap.

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Wasn't overly impressed with his performance despite the 3 assists. I believe they were all second assists, and I don't recall him doing anything overly skilled to make those plays. I'm still willing to give him time to get adjusted, so that's not a knock on what he can do to help us, but I think those points are a bit misleading. Ryder's not a great skater and he's not great defensively. He's here to score goals, and that's what the measuring stick will be at the end of the year that determines whether we re-sign him or not.

I think your blank statement regarding Ryder's 3 assists does not do his work on those plays justice. He started those plays leading towards goals and that IMO required skill.

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I think your blank statement regarding Ryder's 3 assists does not do his work on those plays justice. He started those plays leading towards goals and that IMO required skill.

- All his assists were "second assists"

- On the Plekanec goal, he went crashing into the boards and hit the puck without knowing where it was going. He actually doesn't know that it's gone to Galchenyuk behind the net because he's looking around for it while the play is going on.

- On the second goal, he makes a 10 foot pass back to the point to Subban. The play then goes Subban to Markov back to Subban, so Ryder has very little to do with the scoring play.

- On the third goal, he makes a nice little saucer pass back to the point, but the goal is mostly created by Subban's shot and Gionta's work on the rebound.

As I said, it's not a knock on Ryder. I think he played an average game, and I'll give him some credit for his pass on the 3rd goal. But he did nothing special on the first two and watching his game as a whole, he didn't play in a way that would suggest he deserved to have a multi-point night. Good on him for picking up those points because sometimes you get the opposite and have a great game and can't buy a point, but in this case, I simply see the 3 point total as misleading when it comes to interpeting the actual strength of his play.

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- All his assists were "second assists"

- On the Plekanec goal, he went crashing into the boards and hit the puck without knowing where it was going. He actually doesn't know that it's gone to Galchenyuk behind the net because he's looking around for it while the play is going on.

- On the second goal, he makes a 10 foot pass back to the point to Subban. The play then goes Subban to Markov back to Subban, so Ryder has very little to do with the scoring play.

- On the third goal, he makes a nice little saucer pass back to the point, but the goal is mostly created by Subban's shot and Gionta's work on the rebound.

As I said, it's not a knock on Ryder. I think he played an average game, and I'll give him some credit for his pass on the 3rd goal. But he did nothing special on the first two and watching his game as a whole, he didn't play in a way that would suggest he deserved to have a multi-point night. Good on him for picking up those points because sometimes you get the opposite and have a great game and can't buy a point, but in this case, I simply see the 3 point total as misleading when it comes to interpeting the actual strength of his play.

Deserved? Whatever... none of the goals that were scored are scored if he didn't do what he did.

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I have to agree with HHN here. While secondary assists are not as direct to the scoring chance as primary assists are, it's a team game. The scoring chance would not have happened without his passes.

I am still waiting to actually notice him out there, I hope he has adjusted back to playing for the Habs. It's time to light it up.

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I have to agree with HHN here. While secondary assists are not as direct to the scoring chance as primary assists are, it's a team game. The scoring chance would not have happened without his passes.

I am still waiting to actually notice him out there, I hope he has adjusted back to playing for the Habs. It's time to light it up.

Thanks for the assist. Then again... he has been hard to miss out there playing with Plekanec and on the powerplay. He needs to score no doubt, but he has to be in a positon to shoot.

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Yeah, I don't really see why we're suddenly rating assists now. Plenty of good players get chintzy second assists. It's part of the game. We can't selectively choose to downgrade Ryder's assists. If we do that, we have to start rating everyone's assists.

A lot of NHL teams do actually, they'll never admit it but a lot of teams are starting to use advanced metrics, and while it's not entirely "advanced", a lot of teams take the 2nd assists out of a player's point total and then see how it goes. The Alex Tanguay problem really, dude hits 70 pts all the time but it's a lot of lame 2nd assists.

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Ryder did not have a great night... starting the game on his off-wing didn't help. He killed a man-advantage with an intereference call by the refs and didn't see much ice-time thereafter. Coach said he didn't like his game.

Pacioretty did the same thing and his line was mostly invisible but he continued to play. I wonder if the coach liked their game.

And so it begins... a tough spot for Ryder on a new team IMO. He has to pick-it up a notch, no doubt.

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A lot of NHL teams do actually, they'll never admit it but a lot of teams are starting to use advanced metrics, and while it's not entirely "advanced", a lot of teams take the 2nd assists out of a player's point total and then see how it goes. The Alex Tanguay problem really, dude hits 70 pts all the time but it's a lot of lame 2nd assists.

Good point, and if we're going to do it, let's do it, but let's not pick on one player and cherrypick his assists for quality.

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A lot of NHL teams do actually, they'll never admit it but a lot of teams are starting to use advanced metrics, and while it's not entirely "advanced", a lot of teams take the 2nd assists out of a player's point total and then see how it goes. The Alex Tanguay problem really, dude hits 70 pts all the time but it's a lot of lame 2nd assists.

It's kind of hard to tell how useful a second assist can be, though. Take Tanguay as an example: maybe he does in fact get lots of lame second assists, but the fact that he's consistently getting those high point totals year in and year out still tells you something. I'm not sure what, exactly, but it's something :P. Maybe he's seen as a threat on the ice and so his opponents overplay him and leave his teammates open. Maybe it's not even so much that they see him as a threat as it is that he makes some kind of move that draws them out towards him. Like I said, I don't really know, but there's got to be a reason why someone like Tanguay is always getting big point totals while some other players with similar minutes in similar situations aren't. It's not as easily quantifiable as a goal or a beauty first assist that leads to a tip-in, but I don't think it's something that can be discounted.

In Ryder's case you've got to respect his shot and have someone out there right on him. Maybe that alone is enough to open up some ice for everyone else on the PP. In any case though, obviously it would still be nice to see him pot some goals0

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Guest habs1952

A lot of NHL teams do actually, they'll never admit it but a lot of teams are starting to use advanced metrics, and while it's not entirely "advanced", a lot of teams take the 2nd assists out of a player's point total and then see how it goes. The Alex Tanguay problem really, dude hits 70 pts all the time but it's a lot of lame 2nd assists.

True, a lot of second assists are lame but on the other hand a lot come from great plays or taking a hit to make a play. It's not like it's always the goalie stopping the puck behind the net and one pass later the team scores. A lot of 'lame' goals are scored too. Should they be discounted?

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True, a lot of second assists are lame but on the other hand a lot come from great plays or taking a hit to make a play. It's not like it's always the goalie stopping the puck behind the net and one pass later the team scores. A lot of 'lame' goals are scored too. Should they be discounted?

What I mean is if we're comparing a center who scored 20G-35 1sts and 15 2nds to a guy who scored 20G-25 1sts and 25 2nds it should be obvious the guy with more 1st assists is the better player. It doesn't mean that all the 2nd assists are useless plays, but compared to goals or 1st assists it can be a lot more chintzy. A guy with higher totals of 1st assists can probably continue that, 2nd assists aren't really as predictable and aren't as repeatable.

As for Ryder, even if they're 2nd assists it still counts and I don't think they're completely worthless, just that obviously they aren't as important as 3 goals for example. But I'm not worried about him, he's always been a pretty streaky guy and I think we'll see some PP production pretty soon.

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