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2016-17 Habs Lines


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so there it is

http://www.hockeyinsideout.com/news/qa-with-michel-therrien-coach-denies-making-negative-comment-about-max-pacioretty

as I expected Shaw is the 2nd line winger . No way they would bring him here to play of the 4 th line

During a morning interview with TSN Radio 690’s Tony Marinaro, Therrien said his plan heading into the season is for his first two lines to look like this: Alex Galchenyuk at centre between Max Pacioretty and Brendan Gallagher, and Tomas Plekanec at centre between newcomers Andrew Shaw and Alexander Radulov

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so there it is

http://www.hockeyinsideout.com/news/qa-with-michel-therrien-coach-denies-making-negative-comment-about-max-pacioretty

as I expected Shaw is the 2nd line winger . No way they would bring him here to play of the 4 th line

During a morning interview with TSN Radio 690’s Tony Marinaro, Therrien said his plan heading into the season is for his first two lines to look like this: Alex Galchenyuk at centre between Max Pacioretty and Brendan Gallagher, and Tomas Plekanec at centre between newcomers Andrew Shaw and Alexander Radulov

Mt changes lines more often then i go to the bathroom. I wouldn't expect any line of his to last any length of time.. I fully expect DD to be in the mix after the first loss.

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Mt changes lines more often then i go to the bathroom. I wouldn't expect any line of his to last any length of time.. I fully expect DD to be in the mix after the first loss.

It's the most predictable thing in the NHL today. Other teams probably have it on their board: press whatever line Pacioretty's on, and by the second half of the game he'll be tied to Desharnais and they'll be down to one usable line.

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Shaw should be nowhere near the top 6. Pacioretty, Gallagher, Galchenyuk, and Radulov should be in that group. Plekanec is there somewhat by default, but ideally you find another center to be your 2C. And otherwise, the last winger spot should be between the likes of McCarron, Hudon, or Lehkonen. We don't need pluggers playing in scoring roles. That has never worked over the long term, and to think it will again shows a real lack of understanding of the game and failure to learn from past mistakes.

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Plekanec is there somewhat by default, but ideally you find another center to be your 2C.

Do you mean through a trade? Because I don't think there's anyone else in the Habs' system right now that's better than Plekanec. Hudon is a good player and McCarron looks promising but to me it's a pretty hard sell to displace Plekanec from a top 6 role for them. To me the issue is Danault and Mitchell as your 3C and 4C, I'd rather see a Hudon-McCarron-Carr line or something like that than two grinding lines.

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Do you mean through a trade? Because I don't think there's anyone else in the Habs' system right now that's better than Plekanec. Hudon is a good player and McCarron looks promising but to me it's a pretty hard sell to displace Plekanec from a top 6 role for them. To me the issue is Danault and Mitchell as your 3C and 4C, I'd rather see a Hudon-McCarron-Carr line or something like that than two grinding lines.

With Eller in the fold, you could have left Plekanec on the 2nd line. Without Eller, I personally don't feel comfortable turning over the tough minutes to Danault. Bergevin seems to think Danault has shown great things already and I disagree with that. He's been a good skater and he's been a smart player, but his offensive skill and scoring touch have been woeful and being a good shutdown center requires a little bit more savvy and experience. So ideally, that role falls to Plekanec, who would likely still contribute some offence from that position and still get minutes but do so taking on tougher defensive responsibilities and with linemates like Carr or Andrighetto or Shaw rather than true top 6 wingers.

If Plekanec is given the role of "2C" I worry that we'll see wingers like Gallagher or Radulov paired with him and given roles that limit their offensive potential. We saw this happen to Pacioretty last year: two years ago, he was being touted as a possible Selke finalist on the basis of his +/- (a useless stat) when stronger defensive players like Plekanec and Eller weren't being given their dues. So what happens last season? Pacioretty gets paired with Plekanec and looks awful, producing one of the worst defensive performances I've seen in a long time from a top 6 player. Out of position, bad penalties, lazy backchecks (the Colorado game where Subban was thrown under the bus being the prime example)... Pacioretty simply couldn't handle the defensive responsibility that was given to a Plekanec or an Eller. I'd rather see the likes of Pacman, Gallagher, and Radulov and maybe a Hudon or McCarron or Lehkonen play in the top 6 in more strictly offensive roles.

However, as it stands, I agree with you that I'm not sure we have someone ready to be that 2C just yet, hence the comment that Plekanec is probably still in that role by default. Not because it best serves our team to have him there but because we have limited options. I don't love McCarron as a center. I would much prefer to see him as a top 6 RW, playing alongside Pacioretty and Galchenyuk. I think he would create a lot of room for those two, do the dirty work, and create havoc in front for both of those players to get off their great shots. It would permit you to use Radulov as the 2nd line LW opposite Gallagher. The problem is whether you put Plekanec at the 2C and call it a day (but have questions about your 3rd line) or leave Plekanec as the 3C and fish for an offensive center (but does that then up being DD or Hudon or a guy via trade or someone else?). For example

Pacioretty-Galchenyuk-McCarron

Radulov-Plekanec-Gallagher

Shaw-Danault-Carr

Andrighetto-Mitchell-Flynn

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Shaw should be nowhere near the top 6. Pacioretty, Gallagher, Galchenyuk, and Radulov should be in that group. Plekanec is there somewhat by default, but ideally you find another center to be your 2C. And otherwise, the last winger spot should be between the likes of McCarron, Hudon, or Lehkonen. We don't need pluggers playing in scoring roles. That has never worked over the long term, and to think it will again shows a real lack of understanding of the game and failure to learn from past mistakes.

Thing is though, we're building a big, tough, gritty team that can beat the opposition with brute force.

To see a better example in action look at the USA team at the world cup. In many cases they picked gritty players over skilled ones because this way they could dominate other more skilled teams, physically.

Oh wait...

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Thing is though, we're building a big, tough, gritty team that can beat the opposition with brute force.

To see a better example in action look at the USA team at the world cup. In many cases they picked gritty players over skilled ones because this way they could dominate other more skilled teams, physically.

Oh wait...

Well, they did dominate the other teams physically,,,,, so there's that. :mellow:

Another lonnnnnnnnng season, I fear. :(

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Thing is though, we're building a big, tough, gritty team that can beat the opposition with brute force.

To see a better example in action look at the USA team at the world cup. In many cases they picked gritty players over skilled ones because this way they could dominate other more skilled teams, physically.

Oh wait...

Right. Much better than going with youth, speed, and skill, like Team North America. Despite not having an all-star goalie like Carey (which is usually impossible to win without), that team only managed two wins in three games against world-class caliber players.

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Right. Much better than going with youth, speed, and skill, like Team North America. Despite not having an all-star goalie like Carey (which is usually impossible to win without), that team only managed two wins in three games against world-class caliber players.

Speed and skill,,,,,,,,Canada,,, 2-0,,, 10GF, 2GA

Grit and truculence,,,U.S.A.,,,,,,0-2,,, 2GF, 7GA.

Habs line-up,,,,, :unsure:

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you guy's are a laugh!

IT's the Montreal Canadiens, they were a joke last year :D

http://www.hockeyinsideout.com/news/artturi-lehkonen-gets-chance-to-skate-on-no-1-line-in-first-canadiens-scrimmage

Speaking of lines …............YES "DD "

The Canadiens’ first two lines appear to already be set with Pacioretty-Galchenyuk-Gallagher as the No. 1 trio and Tomas Plekanec at centre on the No. 2 line between Shaw and Radulov.

Then there are four players who could rotate in on the fourth line: Torrey Mitchell, Phillip Danault, Paul Byron and Brian Flynn. There’s also Stefan Matteau.

That means the battle for any forward jobs at training camp will most likely be on the third line. Judging by Friday’s scrimmage, that line could be David Desharnais between Daniel Carr and Sven Andrighetto.

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Bad news. If those are the lines MT wants to go with (and based on last year's camp, he basically just set the lines at the beginning of camp and that was that), then that means they plan on using Carr and Andrighetto on the 3rd with DD and Byron with Mitchell and Danault on the 4th. It means Lehkonen, Hudon, and McCarron, three guys with actual skill, will have to fight to dislodge someone. I still see no reason why Byron and Danault are handed spots over the likes of the three youngsters, and I also believe a young offensive player would be better suited to the top 6 than Shaw.

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Bad news. If those are the lines MT wants to go with (and based on last year's camp, he basically just set the lines at the beginning of camp and that was that), then that means they plan on using Carr and Andrighetto on the 3rd with DD and Byron with Mitchell and Danault on the 4th. It means Lehkonen, Hudon, and McCarron, three guys with actual skill, will have to fight to dislodge someone. I still see no reason why Byron and Danault are handed spots over the likes of the three youngsters, and I also believe a young offensive player would be better suited to the top 6 than Shaw.

But, MT doesn't like to use younger players in the line-up, unless he has to, and MT is calling the shots.

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It means Lehkonen, Hudon, and McCarron, three guys with actual skill, will have to fight to dislodge someone. I still see no reason why Byron and Danault are handed spots over the likes of the three youngsters, and I also believe a young offensive player would be better suited to the top 6 than Shaw.

i think McCarron will have a spot. MT seems to like him and he's got the size MB and MT love. I dont understand the fascination with turning him into a centre although with the loss of Eller we probably need him there now.

FWIW Danault is 23 so Id probably still call him a "youngster" and i think there's still an outside chance he hasnt quite shown all he has (although I dont see him ever reaching more than a 3rd line role). With Eller gone he may have to start taking on that role now... not sure who else is suited to it... DLR maybe but for whatever reason he seems to have fallen out of favour.

Byron is what he is. We know what that is (he aint getting 'better' at 27 imho) and should definitely not be a 'given' over younger players with more potential.

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i think McCarron will have a spot. MT seems to like him and he's got the size MB and MT love. I dont understand the fascination with turning him into a centre although with the loss of Eller we probably need him there now.

He was a right winger and Dale Hunter flipped him to Centre where he excelled

FWIW Danault is 23 so Id probably still call him a "youngster" and i think there's still an outside chance he hasnt quite shown all he has (although I dont see him ever reaching more than a 3rd line role). With Eller gone he may have to start taking on that role now... not sure who else is suited to it... DLR maybe but for whatever reason he seems to have fallen out of favour. .

I think Danault hs been handed the 3rd or 4 th liner C spot by MB . He likes him . He drafted him when he was with the Hawks . He has character, grit and is a Franocphone.

And MAtteau, who few mentioned, should be in the minors . He has shown nothing with NJD or the small stint with the Habs.

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i think McCarron will have a spot. MT seems to like him and he's got the size MB and MT love. I dont understand the fascination with turning him into a centre although with the loss of Eller we probably need him there now.

FWIW Danault is 23 so Id probably still call him a "youngster" and i think there's still an outside chance he hasnt quite shown all he has (although I dont see him ever reaching more than a 3rd line role). With Eller gone he may have to start taking on that role now... not sure who else is suited to it... DLR maybe but for whatever reason he seems to have fallen out of favour.

Byron is what he is. We know what that is (he aint getting 'better' at 27 imho) and should definitely not be a 'given' over younger players with more potential.

I'm not sure McCarron has a spot. He's been moved around the line-up like they're not sure what to do with him, and they seem to think that he's a project the way they thought Galchenyuk and Subban and so on were projects. You only get handed a spot if you're a gritty non-scoring plugger or if you're French. The problem for McCarron is that

1. He's ideally a top 6 player, and MT seems set on his top 6 and using Shaw there (which is a huge mistake). You have a spot to insert a McCarron, Lehkonen, or Hudon into a scoring role, and they're passing that up without even giving any of them a chance. It's blindness and madness.

2. He's been better as a winger IMO and yet MT seems set on using him as a center. He's not getting a spot at center over Galchenyuk, Plekanec, or even Desharnais. And I doubt they use him on the 4th over Mitchell or Danault. So barring a trade, it's almost like they've condemned him to a roster spot that doesn't exist.

Even at practice, MT has formed a line of Ghetto-DD-Carr, which is an indication that'll be his default 3rd line, and Lehkonen got first crack at being Pacman's stand-in... so where does that leave McCarron? IMO, he's a guy who could be a top line RW next to Pacman and Galchenyuk, which would free up Gallagher to play with Radulov and Plekanec. I don't see the fascination with playing Shaw in the top 6 and with giving Byron and Flynn spots, especially when you have kids with skill, speed, and size knocking at the door.

As for Danault, I'm in agreement that he's still a youngster and that he can get better. I liked what I saw of him as a skater and I liked his hockey sense. The issue I have is not that he can't be a decent bottom 6 player for this team, it's that he's seemingly been handed a roster spot when he has very little NHL experience and when other players drafted around the same time as him like McCarron, Scherbak, Hudon, Lehkonen, Ghetto, and so on have had to fight for spots. Why are we discussing whether Mac and Lehkonen and Hudon will make the team while Danault has an automatic roster spot according to just about everyone? What does Danault bring that DLR didn't? What does he bring that Bournival didn't? I don't hate Danault by any means, but like Desharnais and Bouillon and Byron and Moen, he seems to be handed more than he's earned.

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Frankly I'd rather have Desharnais and Mitchell centering the bottom two lines. IMO the Habs should do what they did a few seasons back, have 3 scoring lines and one sacrificial lamb 4th line anchored by a strong defensive C (Mitchell).

That was actually the start of last season... maybe just seems like a few years back because of how drastic a tumble the Habs took down the standings from 1st to near-worst. I don't have an issue with going three scoring lines either. The problem I have is with pretending that Byron and Flynn and DLR and Moen and Prust and DSP and so on can be parts of those scoring lines. You have younger players who can skate and score, you need to use them. We saw with Team North America how much speed and skill gives other teams fits, no matter the players' ages. I'm tired of Therrien and Bergevin saying McCarron isn't ready and Hudon isn't ready but then turning right around and using DLR and Danault and Matteau on the 3rd line. I'm tired of seeing Byron and Flynn in the top 6-9. Those players may have already reached their full potential, but that full potential is far short of what the kids' full potential could be.

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