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2016-17 The Rumors Thread


BigTed3
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2 hours ago, habsisme said:

Brian Wilde says that one of Islanders protected D will be on habs... rumor chucky for leddy and Beauvillier

I'm opposed but I could totally see this

Habs are making depressed. I really want a rebuild if this happens

Well IF they were going after an Isles D man, it would have to be Leddy... Boychuk is too old, Hamonic is a righty, De Haan isn't even protected... Leddy's the only guy who is a lefty and can play top 4. That said, Leddy + Beauvillier would be a really bad return for Galchenyuk. Chucky is more valuable to us than those two players. Further to that, we don't need any more left wingers, we need centers, so Beauvillier wouldn't get into the top 6 if we acquired him. His being included would simply seem like an over-emphasis on French-Canadian players rather than actual needs.

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23 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Well IF they were going after an Isles D man, it would have to be Leddy... Boychuk is too old, Hamonic is a righty, De Haan isn't even protected... Leddy's the only guy who is a lefty and can play top 4. That said, Leddy + Beauvillier would be a really bad return for Galchenyuk. Chucky is more valuable to us than those two players. Further to that, we don't need any more left wingers, we need centers, so Beauvillier wouldn't get into the top 6 if we acquired him. His being included would simply seem like an over-emphasis on French-Canadian players rather than actual needs.

I think he also plays center but I agree. I'm not completely opposed to trading Chucky but we need to get the right return. Add Strome and a 2018 1st and then maybe I'm for it. Otherwise at this point I'd rather keep the players we have and hope somehow Drouin and Chucky can just play center.

I'm worried though. I honestly think Chucky is gone and not for much

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22 hours ago, habsisme said:

I would sign him for 6 years at this point. At the end of the term we will be in rebuild mode anyway. I really don't understand MB if he made these moves and then loses radulov

Agreed.  If our window is the next 2-3 years, who really cares about cap management in 4+ years?  We'll be in full rebuild mode by then so a few overpriced vets wont really hurt much even if we cant unload their salary.

4 hours ago, habsisme said:

Habs are making depressed. I really want a rebuild if this happens

The good news for you is that the current moves sure make it look like a rebuild will be fast coming.   Im starting to feel like MB is just a better dressed Rejean Houle 2.0  in slow-burn.  

1 hour ago, BigTed3 said:

Well IF they were going after an Isles D man, it would have to be Leddy... Boychuk is too old, Hamonic is a righty, De Haan isn't even protected... Leddy's the only guy who is a lefty and can play top 4. That said, Leddy + Beauvillier would be a really bad return for Galchenyuk. Chucky is more valuable to us than those two players. Further to that, we don't need any more left wingers, we need centers, so Beauvillier wouldn't get into the top 6 if we acquired him. His being included would simply seem like an over-emphasis on French-Canadian players rather than actual needs.

Agree on all accounts.  Id be fine adding leddy but not at the expense of Galchenyuk, unless Tavares is coming with him.  

What really baffles me is that you have two players (Galchenyuk and Drouin) who are nearly mirror images of each other.  Both are incredible offensively. Both have flaws defensively. They are roughly the same age and both have similar media backstories. Both are converted centres who seem more comfortable at wing because of their defensive shortcomings but would be better for us if they could play centre.   The only areas they differ are size (galchenyuk is bigger) and sample size (Galchenyuk has played twice as many games and while their PPG are very similar, Chuck has done it over a larger size = more likely he will continue to do so).

So what do we do?   We sign the incoming guy - the guy with the smaller sample size, that cost us our best prospect and that we dont know that much about to a nice fat contract.  We shop the other guy.  It make NO SENSE. 

I should say that i actually have no problem with the drouin trade and i am not concerned he will regress. I sure HOPE galchenyuk is with us in october and that the media is just looking for a juicy story.  IF, however, we end up trading him for a collection of players who are not as good as him, i will be right pissed.   If we trade him as part of a package to get a better player, i can live with that, but trading quality for quantity is never a good thing and would be especially bad for this team, right now. 

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1 hour ago, maas_art said:

What really baffles me is that you have two players (Galchenyuk and Drouin) who are nearly mirror images of each other...

...So what do we do?   We sign the incoming guy - the guy with the smaller sample size, that cost us our best prospect and that we dont know that much about to a nice fat contract.  We shop the other guy.  It make NO SENSE.

I get the impression that even though Bergevin drafted Gachenyuk, he still considers him a holdover of the ancien régime and thus wants change for change's sake. It's ridiculous, capricious, and totally illogical, but what else is new?

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3 minutes ago, habs_93 said:

I get the impression that even though Bergevin drafted Gachenyuk, he still considers him a holdover of the ancien régime and thus wants change for change's sake. It's ridiculous, capricious, and totally illogical, but what else is new?

I don't think he views him as a holdover. He clearly didn't like Briere or PAP or Sekac or DSP either, and those were guys he brought in himself. I think MB simply doesn't look too hard at the on-ice product, he looks at what's happening off the ice and whether guys are toeing the party line and putting in effort. I legitimately think Bergevin would rather have a 4th liner who shows up to the rink at 5AM to put in extra skating time than the guy who scores 30 goals but is spotted out on the town on a day off. It really does come down to character for him.

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13 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

......... he looks at what's happening off the ice and whether guys are toeing the party line and putting in effort.

I guess the early morning party where AG's GF slapped him didn't help. DSP was there and he got booted out .

Rumous were out there that Beaulieu and C Thomas were partying late one night , look what happened to those two

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4 minutes ago, Regis22 said:

I guess the early morning party where AG's GF slapped him didn't help. DSP was there and he got booted out .

Rumous were out there that Beaulieu and C Thomas were partying late one night , look what happened to those two

Absolutely, those incidents seem to have played heavily on Bergevin's assessments of players, but he's been a bit hypocritical, because he's completely ignored comportment issues with other guys:

- Price was rumored to have had a serious off-ice incident when he first broke into the league... seems to be an accepted fact that he grew from that, so why not let other young guys have the same opportunity to redeem themselves

- Pacioretty when in the AHL spoke out against the organization and claimed that the NHL club was doing an awful job managing him and that he preferred the coaching he was getting in the AHL... seems to have been forgotten, because he was made captain.

- Markov has been photographed hanging out in clubs with Ovechkin several times

- Drouin was just acquired despite his off-ice issues and suspension with Tampa previously

- Shaw was involved in an incident where he made a derogatory homophobic remark and yet was a trade target of Bergevin's

- Therrien spent a lot of time bashing players, promoting his own ego, and generally trying to pit players against Subban; not really good character for a coach

 

Just a few examples, but clearly Bergevin ignores issues and red flags when it's convenient to him and makes it an issue with others like Subban, AG, Thomas, Kristo, Beaulieu, Tinordi, Pateryn, Kassian, and so on. Some guys just weren't given the same laxity as others. Just a lot of unexplained favoritism, which is one thing, but it has also negatively affected the product on the ice.

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Eklund says we may be in on Evander Kane.  According to his 'sources' we may even have a deal in place but are waiting till after the ED so that Buffalo could protect him and not us.  

Of course its Eklund so its likely all a bunch of garbage but if it IS true then you have to assume AG wouldnt be going the other way because then we would just protect EK rather than AG.   Anyway, its a quiet time so i thought id post this.  I honestly cant see MB trading for Evander Kane unless the price was VERY low.   

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12 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Eklund says we may be in on Evander Kane.  According to his 'sources' we may even have a deal in place but are waiting till after the ED so that Buffalo could protect him and not us.  

Of course its Eklund so its likely all a bunch of garbage but if it IS true then you have to assume AG wouldnt be going the other way because then we would just protect EK rather than AG.   Anyway, its a quiet time so i thought id post this.  I honestly cant see MB trading for Evander Kane unless the price was VERY low.   

That would just suck, but even MB can't be that stupid

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38 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Eklund says we may be in on Evander Kane.  According to his 'sources' we may even have a deal in place but are waiting till after the ED so that Buffalo could protect him and not us.  

Of course its Eklund so its likely all a bunch of garbage but if it IS true then you have to assume AG wouldnt be going the other way because then we would just protect EK rather than AG.   Anyway, its a quiet time so i thought id post this.  I honestly cant see MB trading for Evander Kane unless the price was VERY low.   

Someone else (don't recall, maybe Dreger or someone a little more reliable than Eklund) said they thought Kane would stick in Buffalo and that things were going well there.

Also rumors that Radulov and Habs have already agreed on a multi-year contract and are just waiting until after the ED to announce it. I guess we'll find out later this week... I expect there might be a rash of UFA signings in the 48hrs after the ED is finalized. If we go through that period without a deal in place with Radulov, really makes it less likely we will keep him.

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8 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Also rumors that Radulov and Habs have already agreed on a multi-year contract and are just waiting until after the ED to announce it. I guess we'll find out later this week... I expect there might be a rash of UFA signings in the 48hrs after the ED is finalized. If we go through that period without a deal in place with Radulov, really makes it less likely we will keep him.

Agreed

And yes, after all the changes in Buffalo it would be a little odd to move one of their big names without at least giving them a shot on the ice under the new direction. 

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29 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Agreed

And yes, after all the changes in Buffalo it would be a little odd to move one of their big names without at least giving them a shot on the ice under the new direction. 

I am, however, a little concerned about Radulov potentially signing in Vegas. Of all the UFA's, I think he's one who could be drawn in there. Only played one year here, so not a lot of allegiance, and the Knights already have Shipachyev and are rumored to be close to signing Dadonov. So he'd be playing on the 1st line there with guys he knows... could be enticing, not to mention they can throw money and term at him than we can.

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11 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

I am, however, a little concerned about Radulov potentially signing in Vegas. Of all the UFA's, I think he's one who could be drawn in there. Only played one year here, so not a lot of allegiance, and the Knights already have Shipachyev and are rumored to be close to signing Dadonov. So he'd be playing on the 1st line there with guys he knows... could be enticing, not to mention they can throw money and term at him than we can.

Nah! too hot for him there!

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http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/article/trade-watch-after-drouin-and-beaulieu-deals-what-is-montreal-s-next-move

 

More moves coming? The Montreal Canadiens need help on defense after trading Nathan Beaulieu to Buffalo for a draft pick and sending top prospect Mikhail Sergachev to Tampa Bay for Jonathan Drouin.

I’m not here to make a judgment, but I do have a lot of questions. The Montreal Canadiens traded defenseman Nathan Beaulieu to Buffalo over the weekend in exchange for a third-round draft pick in 2017. This came on the heels of the big-time deal that saw Jonathan Drouin return to his home province in exchange for Montreal’s top prospect, defenseman Mikhail Sergachev

So a team that already had a very old blueline corps just parted with two of its youngest assets. Should Vegas choose Brandon Davidson in the expansion draft, that’s another blueliner on the south side of 30 who's gone. Also, the Habs reportedly will not qualify defenseman Nikita Nesterov, making him an unrestricted free agent.

 

Something else big must be cooking, no?

I don’t begrudge the Drouin trade, as Montreal got the best player in the deal – for now. Perhaps Sergachev becomes a top-pairing blueliner in a couple years, but we don’t know that yet. We know Drouin is an electric NHLer already. The big question for Canadiens GM Marc Bergevin is, can Drouin be a No. 1 center for the franchise? Because that’s one crucial position the Canadiens have been lacking for years and it has held them back from meaningful success. So far, Bergevin has said that Drouin’s position (he mostly played left wing in Tampa Bay, but did finish ninth in faceoff wins on the Bolts this season) will be determined by coach Claude Julien.

The Canadiens have been quite vocal about their position on Alex Galchenyuk – whom many folks, including myself, believe can be a No. 1 center – believing he is not that pivot yet. And based on how gale the trade winds are right now, it really feels like Galchenyuk is going to be dealt out of town soon, perhaps at the draft in Chicago.

Is this where the bomb drops? Because the Habs cannot be done.

I’m not saying Beaulieu was P.K. Subban, but he was a serviceable defenseman still on the ascent and he could move the puck up the ice. With Sergachev gone, the Habs’ pipeline took a deep cut and I don’t see anyone in their system who could step in next season the way we all assumed Sergachev would have.

So here’s my pet theory: Galchenyuk gets traded for a very good young blueliner. Now, because the Habs have been so vocal about Galchenyuk’s perceived inadequacies, the well has been a bit poisoned in terms of his trade value. But I look at Carolina as the perfect trade partner.

The Hurricanes have an excellent young defense corps and just grabbed a potential No. 1 goalie in Scott Darling. They have a nice array of forwards, but no legit top pivot (Jordan Staal being your shutdown guy instead). Galchenyuk would get a fresh start in Carolina and GM Ron Francis would get the center his team needs.

If I’m Francis, I offer Brett Pesce and a late second-rounder in this year's draft (Carolina owns Pittsburgh’s second as well as the Rangers’ selection in that round). If I’m Bergevin, I ask for Justin Faulk and I toss in Washington’s second-rounder in 2017. If neither party can agree, I go a third route and propose Ryan Murphy and top prospect Jake Bean (both defensemen).

To me, the Faulk scenario is the least likely and Montreal’s second-guessing of Galchenyuk is the reason. You can’t get full value for a potential No. 1 center if you spend all your time claiming he’s not a No. 1 center.

But something has to happen, because Montreal cannot go into the 2017-18 season as currently comprised. Carey Price can cover up a lot of mistakes with his netminding and Drouin will bring a nice dose of excitement up front, but if the defense can’t get the puck up the ice, or slow down the likes of Auston Matthews, Jack Eichel and Erik Karlsson, then it really won’t matter, will it?

Let it never be said that Marc Bergevin is boring.

 

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FWIW, TSN web stite is saying this: 

Hamonic on the Block?

"Arthur Staple of Newsday reports that New York Islanders general manager Garth Snow is pursuing a high-end offensive player this off-season and he's believed to be willing to part with Travis Hamonic to get it.

Staple reports the Islanders covet Colorado Avalanche centre Matt Duchene and Edmonton Oilers winger Jordan Eberle above all others. Another target for the team is Canadiens restricted free agent Alex Galchenyuk, who could be on his way out of Montreal after the Jonathan Drouin trade.

Islanders head coach Doug Weight said earlier this month the team's goal was to add a top-six forward to help improve the team around John Tavares. According to Staple, Tavares has told the team he plans to wait to sign an extension - or not - until he has a better feel for the team's future."

Bold is mine.

Hamonic: 26, 6'2", 205#, shoots R. 49GP, 3G, 11A, -21, 58 Hits. 

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More stuff from EOTP:

 

Montreal News and Notes
The Islanders have been talking to the Canadiens regarding Galchenyuk. [Newsday]
GMs who are interested in Alex Galchenyuk have said that Marc Bergevin is looking for multiple assets in trade discussions. 
Martin Lemay believes the Vegas Knights will select Tomas Plekanec [TSN690]
 

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As I have watched the team's roster strategy being completely mismanaged in this offseason of our discontent, I was suddenly hit with a lightening bolt of such magnitude that I feel reborn ..... Geoff Molson is not some dimwitted and disinterested owner whose face was rumoured to be destined for Milk Cartons all over Quebec!!!!! No!!!!!   He is in fact a true progeny ... a sheer genius of such prestine lineage as Dr Evil or Mini Me!!!!!!!!!    

The Canadiens, under the steady handed tutelage of our majestic GM Bergevin have deftly manoeuvered themselves into a position where they will have no chance of icing a roster which could even compare favourably to last year's squad. Barring a miracle heretofore unforeseen in free agency signings, this team is surely headed for non-playoff status. This will of course come as a bit of a shock to the denizens of Hab land who have not quite caught on to the new schtick of Mr. Molson's invention which is so slick that I am almost paralyzed in admiration. Molson has accurately deduced that if he simply gives Bergevin a free hand in running the team, we will see the evidence of his handy work soon enough and be saddled with such a moribound collection of spare parts on our roster that people will be recalling the years of Rejean Houle and Mario Tremblay rather fondly! People will be irate at said deft handed GM .... completely unaware that this was Molson's unannounced commencement of the Montreal Canadien rebuild that has been so badly needed. Any resultant fan frustration and anger will be focused away from Mr. Molson who can allow such rebuild to carry on under Bergevin's watch until the latter's contract has fully amortized. The one remaining major piece to the puzzle is to get Bergevin thinking that trading Price is a good idea and makes hockey sense in order for the team to better manage its Cap strategy. A few back yard barbeques should get that sorted out .....

Mr Molson et al ...... I am impressed!!!!!             :5187:

 

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I would pass hard on Galchenyuk for Hamonic. I would take Leddy, but not for Galchenyuk. I would look at Beauvillier or Barzal, but the only guy worth trading Galchenyuk to the Isles for is as part of a package for Tavares. End of story. Ryan Johansson was traded for Seth Jones and I wouldn't accept anything less than a young stud blueliner like Jones if we're talking a 1-for-1 deal for AG. You could argue Jones, you could argue Dougie Hamilton, you could argue Ekblad (if he were healthy), you could argue guys like that might be worth it to us, but no way we should trade a 30-goal man (a fairly rare entity) for a mid-level defenceman.

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According to Bob McKenzie, we were trying hard to get Marco Scandella from Minnesota prior to the ED freeze.  He's unprotected, so it makes you wonder if bergevin has a offered something to LV if they pick him in the ED.  I would think Dumba (also unprotected) would command more interest & possible return if Vegas picked him (also unprotected) but he's a RD so i dont think MB would be interested. 

 

 

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2 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

I would pass hard on Galchenyuk for Hamonic. I would take Leddy, but not for Galchenyuk. I would look at Beauvillier or Barzal, but the only guy worth trading Galchenyuk to the Isles for is as part of a package for Tavares. End of story. Ryan Johansson was traded for Seth Jones and I wouldn't accept anything less than a young stud blueliner like Jones if we're talking a 1-for-1 deal for AG. You could argue Jones, you could argue Dougie Hamilton, you could argue Ekblad (if he were healthy), you could argue guys like that might be worth it to us, but no way we should trade a 30-goal man (a fairly rare entity) for a mid-level defenceman.

Agreed. And its why the news that MB is looking for "pieces" worries me.  

What that likely means is he would end up with mid-level talent from 2 or 3 players.  Quantity for Quality.  Never a good plan and certainly not in this instance.  The only exception would be if we were getting a stud defensman & the other pieces were unproven prospects at other positions, but it sounds like he wants multiple roster players. 

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1 hour ago, maas_art said:

According to Bob McKenzie, we were trying hard to get Marco Scandella from Minnesota prior to the ED freeze.  He's unprotected, so it makes you wonder if bergevin has a offered something to LV if they pick him in the ED.  I would think Dumba (also unprotected) would command more interest & possible return if Vegas picked him (also unprotected) but he's a RD so i dont think MB would be interested. 

 

 

Just posted about this in the Expansion thread but apparently Minny may have a deal in place with LV. Lebrun wrote that Mtl was interested in getting Scandella but that this doesn't appear to be happening in the end.

1 hour ago, maas_art said:

Agreed. And its why the news that MB is looking for "pieces" worries me.  

What that likely means is he would end up with mid-level talent from 2 or 3 players.  Quantity for Quality.  Never a good plan and certainly not in this instance.  The only exception would be if we were getting a stud defensman & the other pieces were unproven prospects at other positions, but it sounds like he wants multiple roster players. 

Right. You always want to try and get the best player in the deal. If we trade Galchenyuk for another 3rd line center and a #4 D man, we lose the trade. Sure it fills two holes, but you lose a top-notch scorer, which is much harder to replace. You can find depth if you develop your own prospects properly (hint hint cough) or by signing UFA's. You're unlikely to get another Galchenyuk unless you draft one in the top 10 or you trade a top 10 pick like Sergachev to get a top scorer. That's why the Drouin trade was a good move, but it all comes undone if he dumps Galchenyuk for parts. That's the huge problem with MB, he makes one good move then offsets it with two really bad ones and the overall sum of things is that there's no vision for the club. Bergevin has spent as much time undoing his mistakes as he has building the team up.

 

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