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#6 Shea Weber 2016-17


habs_93
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  • 4 weeks later...

Weber being a hab is welcome news, it is exactly what this team needs. A leader, not a distraction. Weber, has the respect of every player in the west for a reason.

Yes .... because in the words of Darren Pang ... what Weber has that PK doesn't ... is he plays and talks the "white" way. PK could lead the league in scoring for dman and the media and neanderthals like MT would still be putting him down. The NHL has no room for flamboyant individuals ... it's not jsut race, it's personality. They want robots that say the exact same thing as every other player during an interview.

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can't wait to see how our d corps shapes up this season it will be interesting to see how things work out in nashville as well.

My only hope is that Beaulieu is given a fair chance with Weber & makes the most of it. I think he may be the most important part of our d-corps next year because finding the right partner for Weber could be the key to the season to be honest.

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My only hope is that Beaulieu is given a fair chance with Weber & makes the most of it. I think he may be the most important part of our d-corps next year because finding the right partner for Weber could be the key to the season to be honest.

I don't really see another partner for Weber that will work. Markov playing 28 minutes a night next to a non-puck-mover? No thanks. Emelin? Even worse. Jeff Petry said today he wouldn't mind playing the left of Weber, but then who's the odd man out on the left and who is playing the right behind Weber and Pateryn? It just doesn't work.

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I don't really see another partner for Weber that will work. Markov playing 28 minutes a night next to a non-puck-mover? No thanks. Emelin? Even worse. Jeff Petry said today he wouldn't mind playing the left of Weber, but then who's the odd man out on the left and who is playing the right behind Weber and Pateryn? It just doesn't work.

Absolutely Agree. The concern is that A) MT may not give Beau that chance, B) MB may trade him or C) Beau cant handle the minutes.

Thing is, if beaulieu-weber works as well as i think it might, we may actually have a pretty solid 1st pairing. Then we get Petry - Markov which should also be a very good 2nd pairing and theres no shortage of 3rd pairing guys.

If Petry plays with Weber (i suspect he could) then our whole grouping is messed up & I think it will end very badly.

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We're bringing Douglas Murray back to play on Weber's leftside so we have two crushing hitters out there ... it'll work out this time, really ... I mean him and Weber can spend their entire shift hitting the other team. Of course, neither one of them will ever touch the puck but hey ... GRIT and CHARACTER

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We're bringing Douglas Murray back to play on Weber's leftside so we have two crushing hitters out there ... it'll work out this time, really ... I mean him and Weber can spend their entire shift hitting the other team. Of course, neither one of them will ever touch the puck but hey ... GRIT and CHARACTER

I dunno.......where would Francis Bouillon fit in?

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I know most people are saying this stuff in Jest but lets be fair: Shea Weber is still an elite defensman. He's a first pairing guy on any team in the league. In the last little bit Ive seen him compared to Murrary, Boullion, Gil etc - but he's so much better than all of them its a bit silly.

Shea Weber on your team is a very very good thing.

Shea Weber on your team for the price of Subban sucks, thats all.

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I know most people are saying this stuff in Jest but lets be fair: Shea Weber is still an elite defensman.

Depending on how one defines "elite", I respectfully disagree. I don't think a defenceman who since 2013-14 is 5th in 5-on-5 TOI (according to Corsica.hockey) and 132nd in 5-on-5 adjusted CF60 (among defencemen who played at least 1,000 minutes in that time period) can be called elite these days. Very good at what he does, sure. Is he an elite power play player? Absolutely. But most of the game (and his ice time) is 5-on-5. And we know exactly what we're going to get 5-on-5, which is less than inspiring. He's the kind of guy who would benefit from not being a first pairing player, really. He's simply not an all-seasons fulcrum anymore, which is going to hit the team real hard when he gets deployed like one.

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Depending on how one defines "elite", I respectfully disagree. I don't think a defenceman who since 2013-14 is 5th in 5-on-5 TOI (according to Corsica.hockey) and 132nd in 5-on-5 adjusted CF60 (among defencemen who played at least 1,000 minutes in that time period) can be called elite these days. Very good at what he does, sure. Is he an elite power play player? Absolutely. But most of the game (and his ice time) is 5-on-5. And we know exactly what we're going to get 5-on-5, which is less than inspiring. He's the kind of guy who would benefit from not being a first pairing player, really. He's simply not an all-seasons fulcrum anymore, which is going to hit the team real hard when he gets deployed like one.

Yeah he's certainly not an elite all situations player anymore. Shea Weber vs. PK Subban is not about stats vs. eye test or stay at home vs. puck mover, it's simply about aging curves and career trajectories. There seems to be this idea that Shea Weber is "underrated" by stats or he's not a type of player stats can evaluate fairly which is just categorically false. He was totally cream of the crop super elite in his prime, with 2011-12 being an utterly dominant season. In his prime he was a super elite possession player, super elite scorer, super elite power play guy, and super elite penalty killer. In 2016 he's still super elite on the PP and at scoring, but has regressed in everything else with age to the point where he isn't elite anymore at even strength. It's not a knock on his play style, he hasn't changed his play style and he was super elite in Vancouver, Sochi, and in his prime years in the NHL playing the same game he does now. The simple fact is Vancouver was 6 and a half years ago, and essentially every single human being to ever walk the earth has physical decline at age 31 compared to age 25.

On the other hand, I think the decline in his GA/60 and subsequently his GF% numbers is a bit over stated. Some of that decline is because he doesn't drive possession anymore but a big part is because Pekka Rinne is super overrated and has only had 1 good season over the last 4 years, with the other 3 being sub .910 save percentages. Kinda like how Subban didn't just suddenly forget to play defense last year and have his GA/60 crater, it was because instead of Price he played in front of 3 AHLers.

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On 9/27/2016 at 4:55 PM, Noob616 said:

On the other hand, I think the decline in his GA/60 and subsequently his GF% numbers is a bit over stated. Some of that decline is because he doesn't drive possession anymore but a big part is because Pekka Rinne is super overrated and has only had 1 good season over the last 4 years, with the other 3 being sub .910 save percentages. Kinda like how Subban didn't just suddenly forget to play defense last year and have his GA/60 crater, it was because instead of Price he played in front of 3 AHLers.

I'm with you there. I have no doubt that Weber will probably have a career year for 5-on-5 GA60 or very close to it, but it's going to be basically meaningless.

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Looked great for a first game with the team. the Leafs were really weak but for a first game with a new partner on a new team it was good. love how his shots are on the net and you can really see how guy's back up when he winds up. seems to be a very solid passer and a good if not spectacular skater too. so far i i am impressed he passes the puck really fast which helps our forwards to pick up speed nicely.

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1 hour ago, ramcharger440 said:

Looked great for a first game with the team. the Leafs were really weak but for a first game with a new partner on a new team it was good. love how his shots are on the net and you can really see how guy's back up when he winds up. seems to be a very solid passer and a good if not spectacular skater too. so far i i am impressed he passes the puck really fast which helps our forwards to pick up speed nicely.

Did look good, as did the majority of the newcomers (acquired players and rookies). Hopefully this translates into on-ice success in the season.

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55 minutes ago, habs_93 said:

I think a lot of people get that plus/minus is a meaningless thing, actually.

If your on the ice for more goals against then for, that is hardly meaningless. Not to mention the leadership on the ice and in the dressing room that Weber brings. Time to get on board.

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4 minutes ago, tony5775 said:

If your on the ice for more goals against then for, that is hardly meaningless. Not to mention the leadership on the ice and in the dressing room that Weber brings. Time to get on board.

That plus/minus is wholly unfit for purpose is really not news. Copious amounts of quality literature on the subject exists, and I don't feel quite so arrogant as to redo that work. A brief summary, though: Goals are rare in hockey, and heavily influenced by luck. A goal being scored by the opposing team while you're on the ice is also influenced by the other four skaters and your goalie. Players can (and have) gotten plusses and minuses while on a change. And so on.

As for leadership: believe what you wish, but don't be surprised if other people don't accept unsupported supposition as an article of faith.

Despite the order for uniformity, l do believe I'll pass.

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