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2017-18 The Rumors Thread


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10 minutes ago, Manatee-X said:

And some (but not all) of his bad moves are kind of just branches off his early coaching decisions.

If we had hired a better, more modern coach to begin with, do you think that Subban would still have been traded?  At least from the outside it seems as though PK just didn't jive with Therrien, and when that became apparent Bergevin made the (stupid) choice to "side" with his friend the coach instead of his all-star defenceman.  If it had been any other coach that wasn't a personal friend you'd have to think that the coach would have been the one shown the door, and if it had been a better coach to begin with we probably wouldn't have seen that sort of issue arise in the first place.

If you've got a better defensive coach and the defence was playing well, would there have been any need to go after Alzner, Benn and company?  If our coach had preached a more progressive, possession-based style would Bergevin have needed to focus so much on grit and grinders?

Bergevin has made some really good moves when he's actually targeted the right players (Petry, Vanek, Radulov, etc.).  It's just that his priorities have been all wrong, especially lately.  How much of his mindset would have been different had we started with a better coaching staff

Edit: Thinking back, he started with a focus on grinders but then after his first year (or two?) he seemed to be shifting his approach.  The year we got Petry and a few others, I remember posting here that maybe he had turned a corner and that I had misjudged him earlier.  I was happy that we seemed to have a GM who was willing to learn from his mistakes....

...but then we lost to Ottawa in the playoffs, and the lesson he took from that was basically to double down on what "worked" before.  And that was the beginning of the end of our hopes of any exciting players playing for this team.

Agree on all points.

 

The other thing with a better coach is that we would have likely identified our problem areas earlier.  For example, instead of using DD at #1 centre for years maybe we would have identified our need for a #1 and we would have done something about it. 

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41 minutes ago, Windoe said:

You're right, trading Subban for Weber because Subban didn't get along with the coach would be insane.  Fortunately, that didn't happen.

Care to elaborate?  Moulson confirmed at the presser this year that they had made the decision to trade Subban and then went about looking for offers.  That's a weird thing to do with your Norris-winning defenceman, isn't it?

I mean I'm not saying that Subban was traded solely because he and Therrien didn't get along (although I think it's pretty clear based on Therrien's comments both before and after becoming coach that they didn't).  But I do think that he was traded because he didn't fit the mould of what Therrien (and Bergevin by extension) were looking for in the personality of a hockey player.  In terms of hockey they saw him as being a "risky" player, when they were looking for someone more straightforward and "safe".  And off-ice, I think it's pretty clear that PKs personality was a factor.  99% of what Bergevin says after acquiring any player is about their attitude, character, will to win, etc.  With that trade in particular the only defense he made was to say those sorts of positive (and intangible) things about Weber (mostly, in my opinion, because it was hard to give any valid hockey-related reason for the deal).

But hey, that's all just conjecture.  It's based only on the evidence of what we see and hear as fans, though, and I obviously wasn't in the room.  So what's your theory?  If not for Therrien's dislike of Subban (both personal and as a hockey player) what is the explanation for trading away a young all-star for a guy who's on the wrong side of 30 and going downhill?  And even better, let's ignore Weber (maybe it was reasonable to hope that he could continue to play well for a few years yet).  If not for Therrien, what is the reason to start shopping your young, fan-favourite Norris winner in the first place?

 

The other thing with a better coach is that we would have likely identified our problem areas earlier.  For example, instead of using DD at #1 centre for years maybe we would have identified our need for a #1 and we would have done something about it. 

+1

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In short, PK was voted off the island by his teammates. PK wanted to be captain badly, he positioned himself to be captain by making a huge donation, signing a huge contract, being a a fan favourite (my favourite player on the team at the time) and by campaigning Madame Beliveau.  But management, knowing PK could not captain his teammates, decided to put the captaincy vote to the players rather than select a captain themselves (why didn't you pick me????).  Pacioretty won the players' vote, PK lost badly, and things got so bad that MB had to decide between trading PK or building around PK.  Of course management is never going to come out and say they traded PK because his teammates had enough of him.  At this stage, the PK trade is only important to gauge MB's fitness for continuing as GM if you believe that he traded PK as a hockey move, which he did not.  It was a personality move done for team chemistry.  

I've heard alot of false equivalency logic here that goes along these lines: Well his Nashville teammates seem to like him, therefore he must be a good teammate, therefore his Montreal teammates liked him.  That logic does not work no matter how many times its presented.  Gallagher revealed a bit of the truth this year if you knew how to see it.  PK's Montreal teammates (and yes, management too) had enough of the PK show.  Give it a few years in Nashville, see how things go especially if they start losing, maybe history will repeat itself.    

Bigger Point: PK or no PK , we'd still be in the mess we're in, and this comes to the real reason MB should be fired after 6 years: if he does not land a 1C this summer. Yep, you have to draft them (you didn't), or trade major assets to get them (you didn't) or every now and then, a 1C UFA comes up.  I hope for MB's sake he gets it done.  But if he doesn't, its time to move on in my opinion.  We will need to move on, not because our GM made such a "glaring talent assessment error when trading PK for Weber" but because he failed to address our biggest need of getting a 1C AND THEN he pinned this year's performance on his player's attitudes: GOOD LUCK WITH THAT.  

Advanced Note: You think this year's Canadiens players have a bad attitude? Maybe its because they're battling their nuts off every night without 2 centers and a top D.  Maybe their tired of doing battle for you with one hand tied behind their back.  The answer is not in this room, you delusional sack, because there are no top centers in this room.  If MB wants to perk up the attitude of his players, then get the players the tools they need to win, construct a proper team, and stop blaming them for your own shortcomings.  Its hockey, we need centers, they're a pretty big deal. Get it done, or get out of the way.

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9 minutes ago, Windoe said:

In short, PK was voted off the island by his teammates. PK wanted to be captain badly, he positioned himself to be captain by making a huge donation, signing a huge contract, being a a fan favourite (my favourite player on the team at the time) and by campaigning Madame Beliveau.  But management, knowing PK could not captain his teammates, decided to put the captaincy vote to the players rather than select a captain themselves (why didn't you pick me????).  Pacioretty won the players' vote, PK lost badly, and things got so bad that MB had to decide between trading PK or building around PK.  Of course management is never going to come out and say they traded PK because his teammates had enough of him.  At this stage, the PK trade is only important to gauge MB's fitness for continuing as GM if you believe that he traded PK as a hockey move, which he did not.  It was a personality move done for team chemistry.  

I've heard alot of false equivalency logic here that goes along these lines: Well his Nashville teammates seem to like him, therefore he must be a good teammate, therefore his Montreal teammates liked him.  That logic does not work no matter how many times its presented.  Gallagher revealed a bit of the truth this year if you knew how to see it.  PK's Montreal teammates (and yes, management too) had enough of the PK show.  Give it a few years in Nashville, see how things go especially if they start losing, maybe history will repeat itself.    

Bigger Point: PK or no PK , we'd still be in the mess we're in, and this comes to the real reason MB should be fired after 6 years: if he does not land a 1C this summer. Yep, you have to draft them (you didn't), or trade major assets to get them (you didn't) or every now and then, a 1C UFA comes up.  I hope for MB's sake he gets it done.  But if he doesn't, its time to move on in my opinion.  We will need to move on, not because our GM made such a "glaring talent assessment error when trading PK for Weber" but because he failed to address our biggest need of getting a 1C AND THEN he pinned this year's performance on his player's attitudes: GOOD LUCK WITH THAT.  

Advanced Note: You think this year's Canadiens players have a bad attitude? Maybe its because they're battling their nuts off every night without 2 centers and a top D.  Maybe their tired of doing battle for you with one hand tied behind their back.  The answer is not in this room, you delusional sack, because there are no top centers in this room.  If MB wants to perk up the attitude of his players, then get the players the tools they need to win, construct a proper team, and stop blaming them for your own shortcomings.  Its hockey, we need centers, they're a pretty big deal. Get it done, or get out of the way.

mostly agree, however as far as PK goes there are a couple of things I would say

 its very possible everyone, or at least enough of them were fed up.

1. we get rid of those guys. and build around PK, which as its looking would have been a better idea. we dont have anyone even close to his skill level, and the main guys who seem to be the ones who come up, patch and plek, are gone and as good as gone. even if you count gallagher too, sorry id rather have PK and its really not close

2. we actually make a good trade for him like the ones we apparently had on the table from edm or van.not for the ghost of shea weber. Thats grounds for dismissal right there by a mile.

3. nashville is winning with PK. every winning team has great "chemistry"...why? winning makes everyone happy.yeah maybe if nashville goes in the toilet his act might wear thin,but why would they? they have a great team, andb the fact is PK is a guy who contributes very heavily. we sure were a lot more successful with him. they sure are too.  we had one bad year and Bergy thought "this is my chance. this will never happen under weber"well guess what it did in both of the years hes been here, so I guess everyone hating PK really didnt matter because at the end of the day this roster stinks and thats the real reason you win or lose

...which leads to your final point about the "attitude" and you are spot on. 

we need 2 top 6 centers and a top d ( we had one...oops) and I have very little faith in MB to make that happen. He should have been gone a long time ago

 

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All good points. 

Asking the players to be something they simply can't be year after year isn't fair on the players and they're tired of it.  Over a short stretch, fine, 1C is hurt so we're going to need you to play center for a couple of weeks.  No problem.  But, we simply don't have centers?  And we're going to travel the continent playing hockey against hockey teams that do have centers?  Are we getting some sort of experimental government grant here?  Try to win the Cup without centers.  Remember that team that won the Superbowl without any quarterbacks?  Legends.  That could be us, but on ice.  If only you guys could buck up and win us some games...now get out there, we're only down by 2!

Good luck tomorrow everyone, we need it :)

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, Windoe said:

In short, PK was voted off the island by his teammates. PK wanted to be captain badly, he positioned himself to be captain by making a huge donation, signing a huge contract, being a a fan favourite (my favourite player on the team at the time) and by campaigning Madame Beliveau.  But management, knowing PK could not captain his teammates, decided to put the captaincy vote to the players rather than select a captain themselves (why didn't you pick me????).  Pacioretty won the players' vote, PK lost badly, and things got so bad that MB had to decide between trading PK or building around PK.  Of course management is never going to come out and say they traded PK because his teammates had enough of him.  At this stage, the PK trade is only important to gauge MB's fitness for continuing as GM if you believe that he traded PK as a hockey move, which he did not.  It was a personality move done for team chemistry.  

So your telling me that the only reason PK made the huge donation to the children's hospital was because he was positioning himself to be captain? 

“Whenever you’re able to use your success and achievement to help others, that is the best experience you can have in life,” he says. “It’s great to be in the NHL. You’re making money. You’re in the bright lights. But now he’s using it to help others. That’s the ultimate.” Subban's Dad

P.K. “understood very early it was part of his responsibility” to give back through such things as school visits, literacy and fundraising campaigns. Burnett said Subban was especially good with children. “Kids are the prime pieces in changing the world,” P.K. says. “That’s where it starts.”George Burnett

Did it ever occur to you he may of did this because of how he was brought up!

Whats actually ironic is there still people blaming Subban for the trade, there are still people who by all accounts want to rip apart the mans character.

PK is not just about hockey, its his larger than life personality. And that had nothing to do with one losing season while he was here. 

They may not think how I play the game is the right way. Or they may not think everything I do is truly authentic and real, but that's just life. What are you going to do? All you do is continue to work on yourself every day as a player and as a person, and that's it. I try to get better every day and continue to do good things, not just for myself, but for the people around me, and just create good energy around me wherever I go, because that's the only way to live, in my opinion. PK

Since his trade to Nashville, Subban has continued his philanthropic ways. His latest organization, P.K.'s Blue Line Buddies, focuses on building better relations between law enforcement and inner-city youths. According to a 2017 Tennessean article, an officer, a youth and their guests are treated to a Predators home game with perks like autographs and dinner in Bridgestone Arena's Patron Platinum Club.

I guess he is after the Captaincy in Nashville and if he doesn't get it he will be traded.....

 

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15 hours ago, Windoe said:

In short, PK was voted off the island by his teammates. PK wanted to be captain badly, he positioned himself to be captain by making a huge donation, signing a huge contract, being a a fan favourite (my favourite player on the team at the time) and by campaigning Madame Beliveau.  But management, knowing PK could not captain his teammates, decided to put the captaincy vote to the players rather than select a captain themselves (why didn't you pick me????).  Pacioretty won the players' vote, PK lost badly, and things got so bad that MB had to decide between trading PK or building around PK.  Of course management is never going to come out and say they traded PK because his teammates had enough of him.  At this stage, the PK trade is only important to gauge MB's fitness for continuing as GM if you believe that he traded PK as a hockey move, which he did not.  It was a personality move done for team chemistry.  

I dont have any inside information so i can neither confirm or deny this but lets say that its all true:
 

It still doesnt explain the return.

I have said numerous times, if there's some reason you HAVE to trade a player, fine but when you look at the alleged offers from Edmonton and Vancouver? It makes you weep.  Instead of Weber we could have had Dratsaitl, Nurse and possibly even Hall depending upon which you believe.  We could have had Horvat and a couple of other key young players from Vancouver.   

I liked PK a lot (see my avatar, still!) but i understand at times anyone is tradable.  The problem wasnt that we moved him, its that we got 60 cents on the dollar for him. 

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4 minutes ago, maas_art said:

I dont have any inside information so i can neither confirm or deny this but lets say that its all true:
 

It still doesnt explain the return.

I have said numerous times, if there's some reason you HAVE to trade a player, fine but when you look at the alleged offers from Edmonton and Vancouver? It makes you weep.  Instead of Weber we could have had Dratsaitl, Nurse and possibly even Hall depending upon which you believe.  We could have had Horvat and a couple of other key young players from Vancouver.   

I liked PK a lot (see my avatar, still!) but i understand at times anyone is tradable.  The problem wasnt that we moved him, its that we got 60 cents on the dollar for him. 

I don't see it that way. The trades your suggesting are rebuild type deals when he was looking for a win now deal

Now, I agree that MB has been too much 'win now' and not enough rebuild BUT in this situation.... at the time (definitely not in hindsight) I think he made the right choice. Afterall, despite sucking in the playoffs (we have a *star* goalie that has never had success there and got outplayed in a goaltending duel) we actually had a strong year the first year after the trade 

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caperns61: "So your telling me that the only reason PK made the huge donation to the children's hospital was because he was positioning himself to be captain?" - No.  

maas_art: Yep you've said that many times and not on deaf ears, I've been listening, and I agree, either one of those rumoured trades with Edmonton or Vancouver would have been way better for us than getting Weber.  I also agree with the other point you've stated multiple times, that we ended up choosing a deal that only got us 75% FML for PK.

habsisme: I think this is the only rationale for taking Weber over the rumoured Edmonton or Vancouver offers.   

jeff33: "Thats grounds for dismissal right there by a mile." - Yep. If we had gotten either of those rumoured Edmonton or Vancouver deals done, we'd be alot less worked up over "trading PK", which I'd prefer to think about as "the return we got for PK" which is the real shortfall. 

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2 hours ago, habsisme said:

I don't see it that way. The trades your suggesting are rebuild type deals when he was looking for a win now deal

Now, I agree that MB has been too much 'win now' and not enough rebuild BUT in this situation.... at the time (definitely not in hindsight) I think he made the right choice. Afterall, despite sucking in the playoffs (we have a *star* goalie that has never had success there and got outplayed in a goaltending duel) we actually had a strong year the first year after the trade 

no way. it was quantifiable at the time that PK was the better player. how could it be win now when your downgrading?

we actually did NOT have a strong year. we won 10 in a row and had one of the worst records in the NHL the rest of the year. we would have finished almost exactly like this year

 coach got fired.

we got bumped easily in the 1st round BY A TEAM WHO HAS NOW PROACTIVELY STARTED A REBUILD :6351:

we made a huge mistake. facts. 

 

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13 minutes ago, jeff33 said:

no way. it was quantifiable at the time that PK was the better player. how could it be win now when your downgrading?

we actually did NOT have a strong year. we won 10 in a row and had one of the worst records in the NHL the rest of the year. we would have finished almost exactly like this year

 coach got fired.

we got bumped easily in the 1st round BY A TEAM WHO HAS NOW PROACTIVELY STARTED A REBUILD :6351:

we made a huge mistake. facts. 

 

No. I am totally against most habs fans on this trade. 

Fact 1: The team hated PK and therefore PK had to go. I'm not going to even substantiate it anymore, its self-evident. 

Fact 2: GIVEN Fact 1, the team got the best player they could get that could help them win NOW. 

Fact 3: As I said, in hindsight, I agree that a rebuild would have been better, but no one in these boards was talking like that then and I believe we had a very strong regular season, which included strong play from Weber (I would even go as far as saying that Weber had the better season that first year)

You're all crying over spilled milk and over a deal which was not THAT bad... I don't really miss PK... I don't think we would have had winning season if PK were still here (and we barely had Weber this year). 

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1 hour ago, habsisme said:

Fact 1: The team hated PK and therefore PK had to go. I'm not going to even substantiate it anymore, its self-evident.

Even if you accept the first part of this "fact", the second doesn't naturally follow. Funny how someone who was apparently so hated seems to be doing just fine in Nashville - suggesting even if there were serious locker room problems there were other ways to fix them.

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9 minutes ago, Graeme-1 said:

Even if you accept the first part of this "fact", the second doesn't naturally follow. Funny how someone who was apparently so hated seems to be doing just fine in Nashville - suggesting even if there were serious locker room problems there were other ways to fix them.

its been 2 years.... wait. Weber is a good D-man. As good as PK, no but he's still good. We need to get over this PK nonsense. I liked him too but something tells me I wouldn't have wanted to play with him

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53 minutes ago, Graeme-1 said:

Even if you accept the first part of this "fact", the second doesn't naturally follow. Funny how someone who was apparently so hated seems to be doing just fine in Nashville - suggesting even if there were serious locker room problems there were other ways to fix them.

yeah ill just keep going from here

fact 2....that was the best player we could have got to help now? how could you know that? what if there was an offer straight up for hall? this isnt a fact this is your assertion based on pretty much nothing since we dont get told what offers were actually on the table

fact 3 ...you can believe we had a strong season all you want but the reality is we didnt. we were so consistently bad for so long that bergy actually was forced to fire his buddy. a coach doesnt get fired during a strong season. as for weber, he did have a good season. the best one you are ever going to see him have. clocks do not run backwards. he is declining and pk is improving.think weber has a shot at being a norris nominee next year?

the only thing you're right about is that we would have been bad anyway, because this roster is a joke. 

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50 minutes ago, habsisme said:

its been 2 years.... wait. Weber is a good D-man. As good as PK, no but he's still good. We need to get over this PK nonsense. I liked him too but something tells me I wouldn't have wanted to play with him

Webers getting old.

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13 hours ago, Regis22 said:

Webers getting old.

What's getting even older , is all the PK trade talk. No matter the opinion it's long done dwelling on this and rehashing it over and over and over............accomplishes absolutely nothing ! As they say hindsight is 20-20 but it is in the past can we move on to more productive discussions? Honestly these are not productive at all arguments about past history that will change nothing now. It's honestly just getttttttttttttttttttting verrrrrrrrrrrrry oldddddddddddddddddd!

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9 minutes ago, CaptWelly said:

What's getting even older , is all the PK trade talk. No matter the opinion it's long done dwelling on this and rehashing it over and over and over............accomplishes absolutely nothing ! As they say hindsight is 20-20 but it is in the past can we move on to more productive discussions? Honestly these are not productive at all arguments about past history that will change nothing now. It's honestly just getttttttttttttttttttting verrrrrrrrrrrrry oldddddddddddddddddd!

Why would Habs fans suddenly stop talking about one of the worst trades in Habs history? I'd find that rather odd.

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1 minute ago, ChiLla said:

Why would Habs fans suddenly stop talking about one of the worst trades in Habs history? I'd find that rather odd.

Because it's not even close to being one of the worst trades in hockey history... only really ignorant fans think that... sorry but its the truth 

When I said "Wait" it's because PK will cause issues in Nashville too, I'm sure he already is but we haven't heard about it. PK is a great player and really cool guy, but he's also incredibly self absorbed and really immature. I would have punched him a few times had I been his teammate

Trading Sergachev for Drouin was a MUCH worse trade and even that had its merits at the time (but you don't trade defenseman for wingers... you just don't)

Signing Alzner was a much worse move than trading away PK....MUCH worse

Trading FOR Gomez AND trading away McDonagh (taken separately!) are both much worse moves than trading away PK for Weber

Weber was hurt all year, he will be back and playing fine. We definitely need a pair him with a puck mover but that's okay. Do I think PK is a better player, of course! But its not this great difference that some of you make it sound like and there are times I sincerely do believe that Weber IS the better player. You forget how much of a better team Nashville is and what an utter screw up PK has a tendency to be

I got lots of reasons to be fed up of this team and MB and I may not watch another game this season... but PK Subban, that overrated idiot, is not one of them! Not when I have Shea freaking Weber! 

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Subban, at the time of his trade, I too, believe he was too much to handle in Montreal. MB is (what I think) not the kind of guy who lets you stand in his way (mind wise). he had a job to do, to get Montreal going again.

Timing has everything to do with it. MB (and maybe Molson) thought it was best that after "no excuses", to put all focus in a win now attitude.

But then he screwed up, .. forgetting the importance of Markov / Radulov, and in never finding this team a decent Centermen.

Price dropped in value, (still better than many others), Weber became ill, and no-one found Pacioretty on the ice, nor were they able to free him up. so they sticked to the weber shot or Galchenyuk`s one-timers, and the odd goal from others with the exception of Gallagher, / Byron. and scoring the 3 goals/game again seemed too much to ask.

MB, he panicked, and was edgy, thats why (instead of doing nothing), bought and shuffled many 3rd, 4th, and 5th liners. and got us into this (his) mess.

I truly believe he wants to get us out of this, but I wonder if he is capable. the win now, is at least, another year away, if we`re still headed that way.

(sign JT with Patches, and some other, you do have a decent line) to build from. otherwise, sell and rebuild, and stop trying to do both.

 

PK, is maturing, he has seen (and felt) the power of the franchise., they simply got rid of him, and Nashville may be the better place to mature, for a more creative style of play.

but in his maturing, we may need (again, and even in the future) to argue the decision of the trade. sure, it changes nothing, but we have lost very much, these last few years, and until today yet to find our gain.

so Hab-fans have the right to discuss issues over and over, because this isn`t Nashville, .. it`s Montreal, and we ruled.

how can we show or tell our kids what this team was like. a cup every decennia, until 2000, how can we let Pittsburg rule?, why the beep is Las Vegas doing so good?

anyway, understanding to both sides of the argument. and I guess we`ll be talking this over and over, till they start to show us something else to talk about.

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1 hour ago, habsisme said:

Because it's not even close to being one of the worst trades in hockey history... only really ignorant fans think that... sorry but its the truth 

When I said "Wait" it's because PK will cause issues in Nashville too, I'm sure he already is but we haven't heard about it. PK is a great player and really cool guy, but he's also incredibly self absorbed and really immature. I would have punched him a few times had I been his teammate

Trading Sergachev for Drouin was a MUCH worse trade and even that had its merits at the time (but you don't trade defenseman for wingers... you just don't)

Signing Alzner was a much worse move than trading away PK....MUCH worse

Trading FOR Gomez AND trading away McDonagh (taken separately!) are both much worse moves than trading away PK for Weber

Weber was hurt all year, he will be back and playing fine. We definitely need a pair him with a puck mover but that's okay. Do I think PK is a better player, of course! But its not this great difference that some of you make it sound like and there are times I sincerely do believe that Weber IS the better player. You forget how much of a better team Nashville is and what an utter screw up PK has a tendency to be

I got lots of reasons to be fed up of this team and MB and I may not watch another game this season... but PK Subban, that overrated idiot, is not one of them! Not when I have Shea freaking Weber! 

Just based on that last sentence, I don't think there's any point in trying to have a serious discussion about the subject. Also, there's no need to be sorry for an opinion, we're all entitled to one. I think it's incredibly ignorant not to think of the trade as one of the worst in Habs history. We traded a Norris winner for an older, clearly declining player. That in itself is ridiculous, indefensible, and a recipe for disaster.

I don't think the Sergachev-Drouin trade was worse, not at all. I agree that it doesn't look great but there's at least a chance that Drouin becomes the player people think he can be. With Shea Weber, what you see is what you get. There's no room for development, especially not after missing a full season and requiring surgery. Subban was the better player at the time of the trade and it's going to stay that way. Weber gave us one good season and it's only going to go downhill from there. Simply due to his age, injuries will happen more frequently and he's not going to get any faster, while the league clearly is though.

 

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2 hours ago, CaptWelly said:

What's getting even older , is all the PK trade talk. No matter the opinion it's long done dwelling on this and rehashing it over and over and over............accomplishes absolutely nothing ! As they say hindsight is 20-20 but it is in the past can we move on to more productive discussions? Honestly these are not productive at all arguments about past history that will change nothing now. It's honestly just getttttttttttttttttttting verrrrrrrrrrrrry oldddddddddddddddddd!

Kinda like the Habs Staneley Cup wins . Yea they have the most but they haven't won anything ijn 25 years ..lol

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1 hour ago, ChiLla said:

Just based on that last sentence, I don't think there's any point in trying to have a serious discussion about the subject. Also, there's no need to be sorry for an opinion, we're all entitled to one. I think it's incredibly ignorant not to think of the trade as one of the worst in Habs history. We traded a Norris winner for an older, clearly declining player. That in itself is ridiculous, indefensible, and a recipe for disaster.

I don't think the Sergachev-Drouin trade was worse, not at all. I agree that it doesn't look great but there's at least a chance that Drouin becomes the player people think he can be. With Shea Weber, what you see is what you get. There's no room for development, especially not after missing a full season and requiring surgery. Subban was the better player at the time of the trade and it's going to stay that way. Weber gave us one good season and it's only going to go downhill from there. Simply due to his age, injuries will happen more frequently and he's not going to get any faster, while the league clearly is though.

 

Agreed.

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https://news.hockeyfeed.com/videos/rumors-of-a-big-trade-deal-between-the-flames-and-habs?ref=jo

just to get this back on track. The article is pretty incoherent...suggests we want to move patch and they were interested but the ask was high, and that they could move hamilton but their ask would be high....doesnt seem to really make a link.....

on the other hand, if they wanted to do something like brodie, bennett and a pick, that would be the kind of package we are looking for. what you guys think?

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2 minutes ago, jeff33 said:

https://news.hockeyfeed.com/videos/rumors-of-a-big-trade-deal-between-the-flames-and-habs?ref=jo

just to get this back on track. The article is pretty incoherent...suggests we want to move patch and they were interested but the ask was high, and that they could move hamilton but their ask would be high....doesnt seem to really make a link.....

on the other hand, if they wanted to do something like brodie, bennett and a pick, that would be the kind of package we are looking for. what you guys think?

I would do that, I don't think we should expect a high pick. We can definitely make that move given the pick we have now

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1 minute ago, habsisme said:

I would do that, I don't think we should expect a high pick. We can definitely make that move given the pick we have now

exactly, we already have some decent wingers and we're about to draft a really good winger whether its zadina or tkachuk. if there was ever any question about the sense of trading patchy its definitely gone. 

we need at C and LD and ideally we get something back at both places. that HAS to be our mentality in moving him

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