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2017-18 The Rumors Thread


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Just now, jeff33 said:

exactly, we already have some decent wingers and we're about to draft a really good winger whether its zadina or tkachuk. if there was ever any question about the sense of trading patchy its definitely gone. 

we need at C and LD and ideally we get something back at both places. that HAS to be our mentality in moving him

IF we got Tavares, I'd be willing to give them 2 seconds along with Pacioretty for Bennett and Brodie. I'd want them to take maybe Schlemko back at least. I think that might be a more realistic trade. We have to remember we're giving up a winger, they are giving us a C and D and Bennett... boy they could really end up regretting trading him, even if he might also be a bust

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Sorry I'm late to the party, but just to weigh in on the PK comments again since I wasn't online over the weekend.

#1) I agree with everyone who's saying that the return was the biggest problem with the trade.  I still wouldn't have liked it as someone who really enjoyed watching Subban play, but had we received some comparable young talent then it wouldn't have gone down as the disaster that it was.  This isn't a hindsight thing either - IMO it was pretty evident at the time that Weber was a terrible return.

#2) Let's say it's true that PK was strongly disliked by his teammates - I'm not saying it is, mind you, but it's certainly plausible and there's as much evidence for this as there is for it having been a problem with Therrien.  My only question would be: so are we all in Junior High here? 

I mean, seriously, these guys are supposed to be professionals.  So you find a guy you're working with annoying.  Is he still doing his job?  Yes?  Is he keeping you from doing yours?  No?  Well then suck it up, buttercup.  You're paid to play hockey to the best of your abilities, not to give each other that warm fuzzy feeling.  Your duty is to put in your best effort and to work towards team success, and whatever else Subban may or may not have been doing absolutely nobody is arguing that he wasn't contributing to team success on the ice.  Even if he's abrasive, which I'm sure he was at times, if you've got a group of players that can't get over themselves enough to play hockey with a guy who bugs then that's a problem with their attitudes, not with PK's.  Sit them down and tell them that you hear their concerns but that they are expected to deal with it like a pro and play hockey.  Problem solved, Norris-winning defenceman still with the team.

And even far as team chemistry goes, nothing helps team chemistry more than a winning record.  If we'd had a competent coach and if our GM could have acquired a centre (or at the very least tried to work with the one we drafted) then I think you would have seen the Habs' fortunes turn around and all of the talk of attitude problems would have been nothing but a memory.

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1 hour ago, Manatee-X said:

Sorry I'm late to the party, but just to weigh in on the PK comments again since I wasn't online over the weekend.

#1) I agree with everyone who's saying that the return was the biggest problem with the trade.  I still wouldn't have liked it as someone who really enjoyed watching Subban play, but had we received some comparable young talent then it wouldn't have gone down as the disaster that it was.  This isn't a hindsight thing either - IMO it was pretty evident at the time that Weber was a terrible return.

#2) Let's say it's true that PK was strongly disliked by his teammates - I'm not saying it is, mind you, but it's certainly plausible and there's as much evidence for this as there is for it having been a problem with Therrien.  My only question would be: so are we all in Junior High here? 

I mean, seriously, these guys are supposed to be professionals.  So you find a guy you're working with annoying.  Is he still doing his job?  Yes?  Is he keeping you from doing yours?  No?  Well then suck it up, buttercup.  You're paid to play hockey to the best of your abilities, not to give each other that warm fuzzy feeling.  Your duty is to put in your best effort and to work towards team success, and whatever else Subban may or may not have been doing absolutely nobody is arguing that he wasn't contributing to team success on the ice.  Even if he's abrasive, which I'm sure he was at times, if you've got a group of players that can't get over themselves enough to play hockey with a guy who bugs then that's a problem with their attitudes, not with PK's.  Sit them down and tell them that you hear their concerns but that they are expected to deal with it like a pro and play hockey.  Problem solved, Norris-winning defenceman still with the team.

And even far as team chemistry goes, nothing helps team chemistry more than a winning record.  If we'd had a competent coach and if our GM could have acquired a centre (or at the very least tried to work with the one we drafted) then I think you would have seen the Habs' fortunes turn around and all of the talk of attitude problems would have been nothing but a memory.

Very well said indeed.

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2 hours ago, Manatee-X said:

#1) I agree with everyone who's saying that the return was the biggest problem with the trade.  I still wouldn't have liked it as someone who really enjoyed watching Subban play, but had we received some comparable young talent then it wouldn't have gone down as the disaster that it was.  This isn't a hindsight thing either - IMO it was pretty evident at the time that Weber was a terrible return.

As someone who really likes weber and would have been happy to have added him for any blueliner not named subban, I wholeheartedly agree.  When I heard of the trade I was sure I was missing something.  Like they traded us Weber + ________ and I just hadnt heard the blank yet.   It was a downgrade on defense but an upgrade elsewhere, right?  Right?  Bueller?  Bueller?  

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I was upset as anyone that day but I realize now that he had to go. I would have rebuilt because... well i have the...courage... to do it! And that would have allowed me to get the return all of you wanted. But given that we were still trying to win now and its how most people felt... that was the best trade MB could make. Anything that didn't include a #1 dman would have meant rebuild.

As for therrien... he did better than the current coach... i know the team is worse and i was done with MT too but the current guy won a Stanley Cup and we've all come around on Chucky not being a center. The best coach in the world (or so everyone said) benched PK and made Weber #1 on team Canada. All these things have to count for something

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35 minutes ago, habsisme said:

But given that we were still trying to win now and its how most people felt... that was the best trade MB could make. Anything that didn't include a #1 dman would have meant rebuild.

I would agree with that statement/arguement - IF - we had been stacked in all other positions. We were without a #1 Centre and even #2 centre (pleks) seemed to be on heavy decline.     Had  you moved Subban for a package of youth (Dratsatl, Nurse + ) then I think you could argue (even without the gift of hindsight) we would have been better by plugging one hole with 2.

Even if we had say, acquired Weber and Neal or Fisher you could argue we downgraded but we spread out skill into other slots we were missing.  1 for 1 it was a complete bomb. 

 

 As for therrien... he did better than the current coach... i know the team is worse and i was done with MT too but the current guy won a Stanley Cup and we've all come around on Chucky not being a center.

I strongly believe that Julien is being micromanaged by MB.  You can certainly argue that is julien's fault for letting it happen but the alternative (ie if he rebelled and did what he thought was right) would probably see him getting fired so its a tough one.  If ever there comes a point where MB is fired but Julien remains im very interested to see how his roster utilization changes.  Maybe im wrong, maybe he's totally on the same page as MB but some of his decisions sure seem out of character (galchenyuk and alzner usage for example). 

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32 minutes ago, habsisme said:

I was upset as anyone that day but I realize now that he had to go. I would have rebuilt because... well i have the...courage... to do it! And that would have allowed me to get the return all of you wanted. But given that we were still trying to win now and its how most people felt... that was the best trade MB could make. Anything that didn't include a #1 dman would have meant rebuild.

As for therrien... he did better than the current coach... i know the team is worse and i was done with MT too but the current guy won a Stanley Cup and we've all come around on Chucky not being a center. The best coach in the world (or so everyone said) benched PK and made Weber #1 on team Canada. All these things have to count for something

it counted for something possibly in 2012 or whatever that was.

think weber makes team canada if there was one this year? nope. how about if it was next year, or the year after. not a chance. subban would though. 

I notice you also didn't speculate on his norris chances. perhaps you know my line of reasoning here is correct, and your opinion on this subject comes from your personal feelings instead of anything quantifiable. 

anyway its all good, we aren't going to change how you feel with stats. Just understand, fans are going to be mad about this ...basically until this management regime and roster turns over completely and its all beyond being significant in any way. Especially when its only 2 years in and P.K in Nashville has already been to a cup final,been nominated for yet another Norris and won a President's trophy, and we have gone directly into the toilet....and all the while displaying poor attitude apparently, and going on sustained losing streaks and looking like we don't care on the ice....things which were apparently egomaniac subbans fault, things the king of character and leadership would never allow to happen to this team. So as mad as fans were at the time, we have had our noses rubbed in it to the highest degree possible. theres a picture of this trade in the dictionary beside "blowing up in your face"

As fans it wont ever be let go historically. Im still mad they traded Roy and I'll have that debate if it ever comes up even today.

 

 

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According to reports out of Russia, Rinat Valiev is one of several Russian hockey players who plan on leaving North America to play in the KHL next year.

Jimmy Schuldt, a defenceman with St. Cloud State (teammate of Ryan Poehling) also announced he would return to college next year rather than sign with an NHL team. The Habs had had interest in him and were rumored to be one of the front-runners to sign him.

So that seems to be 2 D prospects down the drain within 24 hours.

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Marc Bergevin pleased many fans by confirming the hiring of Dominique Ducharme as an assistant coach.

Blainville-Boisbriand Armada and Laval Rocket analyst Anthony Marcotte mentioned recently that he had talked with Armada head coach Joel Bouchard and that he had told him that he would really like to work with Dominique Ducharme again.

The Canadiens recently signed 3 former Armada players and the Bouchard rumours have been blowing up social media, suggesting that he will be the Laval Rocket's next head coach.

The Armada are still in the QMJHL playoffs, the announcement could be made official as soon as the team is eliminated.

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11 hours ago, kinot-2 said:

Marc Bergevin pleased many fans by confirming the hiring of Dominique Ducharme as an assistant coach.

Blainville-Boisbriand Armada and Laval Rocket analyst Anthony Marcotte mentioned recently that he had talked with Armada head coach Joel Bouchard and that he had told him that he would really like to work with Dominique Ducharme again.

The Canadiens recently signed 3 former Armada players and the Bouchard rumours have been blowing up social media, suggesting that he will be the Laval Rocket's next head coach.

The Armada are still in the QMJHL playoffs, the announcement could be made official as soon as the team is eliminated.

They also could be looking at Bouchard as the defense coach replacing JJ.  So now you potentially have Julien, Muller, Ducharme and Bouchard behind the bench next year in MTL.  I still think they're other talents you can mine to fill the Laval spot.  Everything's being evaluated right now and you still have player development to retool.  I would like to see Larry Robinson brought in to strictly work with defense on the player development side.  If Yannick Perreault is available, I think you'd need permission to speak to Chicago to hire him.  Have him work strictly on offense, in particular mentoring centres into 2-way face off winners with offense and skill. Goal I think we're still solid from a development stand point.  Although if Vladislav Tretiak was available to bring on as a consultant for goalie development, I'd bring him in.  I would bring in Trevor Georgie from the Seadogs to run Laval http://sjseadogs.com/trevor-georgie.  Bye-bye Carriere, Dudley, Mellanby, LaPointe...Gut the front office before you gut the roster.  

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6 minutes ago, East_Coast_Juggalo_13 said:

They also could be looking at Bouchard as the defense coach replacing JJ.  So now you potentially have Julien, Muller, Ducharme and Bouchard behind the bench next year in MTL.  I still think they're other talents you can mine to fill the Laval spot.  Everything's being evaluated right now and you still have player development to retool.  I would like to see Larry Robinson brought in to strictly work with defense on the player development side.  If Yannick Perreault is available, I think you'd need permission to speak to Chicago to hire him.  Have him work strictly on offense, in particular mentoring centres into 2-way face off winners with offense and skill. Goal I think we're still solid from a development stand point.  Although if Vladislav Tretiak was available to bring on as a consultant for goalie development, I'd bring him in.  I would bring in Trevor Georgie from the Seadogs to run Laval http://sjseadogs.com/trevor-georgie.  Bye-bye Carriere, Dudley, Mellanby, LaPointe...Gut the front office before you gut the roster.  

Dudley is gone to Carolina (confirmed this morning). Lapointe if rumoured to be moved upstairs.

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3 hours ago, Shutoutfan said:

With the Oilers only picking 10th overall but being under pressure to perform now do you think they will be looking for trades? They need defense and probably a goalie as well. And we could use Draisaitl.

Interestingly, when Chiarelli was asked about RNH by a reporter a few weeks ago  he said he's "not going anywhere" this summer but he didnt say anything about Draisaitl  

Now, maybe its because there have been no rumours about LD but when you look at a team like the oilers who have two legitimate #1 centres, a legitimate #2 and a legitimate #2-3 in Strome, you have to wonder when they will realize they need to move one to fill other huge gaps in the roster.

Weber would fill a huge hole for them and actually make their defense respectable overnight as everyone else falls back into place.    Nurse-Weber  Klefbom-Larsson  Sekera-Russell is so much better than last year's group because everyone shifts back a spot. 

Obviously we would have a big hole to fill on defense but with our surplus of wingers (and adding another one with 3rd overall) we should have the means to rejig our defense. 

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4 minutes ago, habsisme said:

I don't get it.

What is the point of trading Weber and Price for players like that? That leaves a pretty big hole in our lineup

Of we trade. Trade for picks and prospects

I wouldnt trade both weber and price for one player (unless multiple players were coming back).  

We have huge holes at #1C #2C and #1LD    If we traded Weber we would fill that #1C role and then have a smaller hole at RD as Petry showed he can fill in well and Juulsen may have top 4 potential.  We are still lacking a #1LD and we're still missing #2C but the #1C role is a huge one to fill.


The bigger picture though, even if its just 'filling one hole and making another' by dealing weber for draisatil, is that you end up gaining 10 years in the move.  Thats a huge.  LD would be our #1C for years and years while Weber probably only has a few good years left.  

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16 minutes ago, maas_art said:

I wouldnt trade both weber and price for one player (unless multiple players were coming back).  

We have huge holes at #1C #2C and #1LD    If we traded Weber we would fill that #1C role and then have a smaller hole at RD as Petry showed he can fill in well and Juulsen may have top 4 potential.  We are still lacking a #1LD and we're still missing #2C but the #1C role is a huge one to fill.


The bigger picture though, even if its just 'filling one hole and making another' by dealing weber for draisatil, is that you end up gaining 10 years in the move.  Thats a huge.  LD would be our #1C for years and years while Weber probably only has a few good years left.  

 

 

While speaking with TVA Sports, Plekanec made it clear what his intentions are. 

"Obviously, as I said before, my priority is to play for the Montreal Canadiens," said Plekanec. "But I do not know what will happen. I do not know the plans of Marc (Bergevin) and Claude Julien. So everything is open from now until July 1st. My heart is in Montreal. As I said, my priority is Montreal. [...] But things can happen differently. "

Bold is mine.

Our #2 C.  :ph34r:

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2 minutes ago, Manatee-X said:

I'm not convinced he won't be our #1 C :P

He probably will. :lol: I wouldn't mind Plekanec back if we can't get our "center game" in order. But he's only going to be a serviceable bottom-six solution. Nothing more. I can see it happening simply because MB won't be able to accomplish anything else when it comes to fixing the center ice position.

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It doesnt really matter

Either we will get a couple of centers (tavares) and he will be a bottom 6 veteran... or we will have no one new and there will be plenty of spots for him. At the end of the day... unless its a multi year deal, i dont care

I wonder if we might be able to bring back Markov... he might actually help us if we can't find a trading partner

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3 minutes ago, habsisme said:

It doesnt really matter

Either we will get a couple of centers (tavares) and he will be a bottom 6 veteran... or we will have no one new and there will be plenty of spots for him. At the end of the day... unless its a multi year deal, i dont care

I wonder if we might be able to bring back Markov... he might actually help us if we can't find a trading partner

Pretty much.

If we bring manage to actually get true #1 and #2 C and Plekanec comes back on a 1 year deal on the 4th line, great.  No worries.  Would we be better going with youth? yes but its not going to be a huge thing either way imho.

If we dont solve our centre problems it really doesnt matter what happens with Pleks,  And most likely MB will be gone before next spring. 

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1 hour ago, habsisme said:

It doesnt really matter

Either we will get a couple of centers (tavares) and he will be a bottom 6 veteran... or we will have no one new and there will be plenty of spots for him. At the end of the day... unless its a multi year deal, i dont care

I wonder if we might be able to bring back Markov... he might actually help us if we can't find a trading partner

I think Marky signed a 2 year deal and said he intended to honour it.

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2 hours ago, maas_art said:

DLR - Plekanec - Froese - Mete


"Expect the unexpected" Marc Bergevin.

Ya, just like we expected the PK trade? Ok,,, didn't see that coming. Hello MB, get rid of Weber, he's an albatross if there ever once was.. 

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