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2017-18 The Rumors Thread


BigTed3
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Brian Wilde says Habs and Sabres have been rumored to be discussing ROR for either Pacioretty straight up or for the 3rd overall. While I think Pacioretty is the better overall player, ROR is a center and he's signed longer-term, so I'd make this trade. I would not ever ever give up the #3 pick for ROR. You can draft a guy who can play on your first line for 10 years if you draft right and you can pay him peanuts to do that for the first 5. So much more value than an overpaid second line center, even if he's still a good hockey player.

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3 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Brian Wilde says Habs and Sabres have been rumored to be discussing ROR for either Pacioretty straight up or for the 3rd overall. While I think Pacioretty is the better overall player, ROR is a center and he's signed longer-term, so I'd make this trade. I would not ever ever give up the #3 pick for ROR. You can draft a guy who can play on your first line for 10 years if you draft right and you can pay him peanuts to do that for the first 5. So much more value than an overpaid second line center, even if he's still a good hockey player.

If thats the rumor, I give it no credibility because neither ROR nor Pacioretty are anywhere close to being worth a 3rd overall pick. 

I would trade for ROR in a heartbeat though. I think Pacioretty and a second for ROR and a a 5th next year. But they won't do that unless ROR is really pushing to get out

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2 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

Brian Wilde says Habs and Sabres have been rumored to be discussing ROR for either Pacioretty straight up or for the 3rd overall. While I think Pacioretty is the better overall player, ROR is a center and he's signed longer-term, so I'd make this trade. I would not ever ever give up the #3 pick for ROR. You can draft a guy who can play on your first line for 10 years if you draft right and you can pay him peanuts to do that for the first 5. So much more value than an overpaid second line center, even if he's still a good hockey player.

Agreed.  ROR for Patches, yes.   ROR for 3rd, no way.   ROR + 1st for Patches + 3rd:  You bet!!! haha. 

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11 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

Brian Wilde says Habs and Sabres have been rumored to be discussing ROR for either Pacioretty straight up or for the 3rd overall. While I think Pacioretty is the better overall player, ROR is a center and he's signed longer-term, so I'd make this trade. I would not ever ever give up the #3 pick for ROR. You can draft a guy who can play on your first line for 10 years if you draft right and you can pay him peanuts to do that for the first 5. So much more value than an overpaid second line center, even if he's still a good hockey player.

I could see Bergevin coveting a player like O'Rielly SOOOOOOOO much that he trades away the third overall. He would then proceed to resign Max and assume he's got a contender on his hands. At the golf tournament he would say, "Our forward corps is better this year than last year," and we would all chuckle.

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A lot of speculation leading up to the draft.


So far the things that seem to be popping  up on multiple sites/multiple insiders (and im talking the more respected ones from TSN, Sportsnet etc, not the eklunds of the world):
 

- Montreal looks more and more like they are going to pick Kotkaniemi (assuming Svechnikov doesnt drop to 3).  They feel like he would be safe well past the #3 spot though so they want to try to trade that pick for an asset & a later round pick.   Thats a somewhat risky move unless you're going with say #4-5 but who knows.  I worry that Mb will mess this up.

- There's been a number of talks between Montreal and Buffalo.   Buffalo is apparently very high on Pacioretty.  Montreal is high on ROR.   Its unclear if the two would be swapped for one another though.  Buffalo wants #3 but sense is that montreal will not trade #3 unless its to trade down & still be able to take Kotkaniemi


Tomorrow should be interesting. lets hope its not a screw up.

 

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2 hours ago, maas_art said:

A lot of speculation leading up to the draft.


So far the things that seem to be popping  up on multiple sites/multiple insiders (and im talking the more respected ones from TSN, Sportsnet etc, not the eklunds of the world):
 

- Montreal looks more and more like they are going to pick Kotkaniemi (assuming Svechnikov doesnt drop to 3).  They feel like he would be safe well past the #3 spot though so they want to try to trade that pick for an asset & a later round pick.   Thats a somewhat risky move unless you're going with say #4-5 but who knows.  I worry that Mb will mess this up.

- There's been a number of talks between Montreal and Buffalo.   Buffalo is apparently very high on Pacioretty.  Montreal is high on ROR.   Its unclear if the two would be swapped for one another though.  Buffalo wants #3 but sense is that montreal will not trade #3 unless its to trade down & still be able to take Kotkaniemi


Tomorrow should be interesting. lets hope its not a screw up.

 

any movement in the draft I do not trust MB with in any way shape or form. We cant score goals, just take zadina. to me , anything else is a mistake. my opinion.

as for ROR, its not what I would do with patch, but this whole team is not what I would do. as it is....you do that all day if the rumour is true. turns your winger into a centre , offiensive production is the same and ROR is a complete hockey player who can do a lot of things

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33 minutes ago, jeff33 said:

Oh gosh, THAT i could get behind.  Most likely we'd be trading for a 30something LW though.  

 

30 minutes ago, jeff33 said:

any movement in the draft I do not trust MB with in any way shape or form. We cant score goals, just take zadina. to me , anything else is a mistake. my opinion.

as for ROR, its not what I would do with patch, but this whole team is not what I would do. as it is....you do that all day if the rumour is true. turns your winger into a centre , offiensive production is the same and ROR is a complete hockey player who can do a lot of things

Yeah at this point I think we can only hope for "whats the best MB will do"  not "whats the best that can possibly be done..."

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Quote from LeBurn:

It's a very poorly kept secret that Canadiens general manager Marc Bergevin is desperate to add a center to his roster so it would be fair to assume that they would want a player that fits that description if they were to give up their captain in the deal. The problem however is that of the players who fit that characterization on the Kings roster we really only have Anze Kopitar and Jeff Carter. You can immediately eliminate any notion of Kopitar being traded and I'm not so certain that the Kings are all that interested in trading Jeff Carter either. 

That being said though Pacioretty is 4 years young than Carter and although Carter plays a more valuable position he also counts for nearly $1 million more against the cap. Additionally Carter is under contract for 4 more seasons and he will be very old by NHL standards come the end of that deal, Pacioretty on the other hand is entering the final year of his contract. I'm still not certain the Kings would consider it, despite the fact that Carter is also coming off his own struggles in this most recent season, but there are some ways this trade could make sense for both sides.

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1 hour ago, jeff33 said:

any movement in the draft I do not trust MB with in any way shape or form. We cant score goals, just take zadina. to me , anything else is a mistake. my opinion.

as for ROR, its not what I would do with patch, but this whole team is not what I would do. as it is....you do that all day if the rumour is true. turns your winger into a centre , offiensive production is the same and ROR is a complete hockey player who can do a lot of things

Yep, couldn't agree more. Bergevin is all in at this point, so if there's a deal to be made based on Patches/ROR, I'd pull the trigger without looking back and then use our 3rd overall pick to draft Zadina as a long-term replacement.

Domi - O'Reilly - Gallagher (all-situations line, capable of eating up decent minutes and incredibly aggravating to play against)

Zadina - Drouin - Scherbak (purely offensive-minded exploitation line, needs lots of sheltering obviously)

Hudon - Danault - Lehkonen (reliable defensive assignments with moderate offensive upside)

Deslauriers - Plekanec/DLR - Shaw (not too shabby as far as 4th lines go)

Trade Byron for the best offer you can get while he's still valuable, I really like the guy but he's 29 and not going to keep scoring 20 goals/year for much longer. It's a business.

And just to be clear: The team above certainly isn't going to win the cup but those 4 lines do at least resemble a halfway-competent hockey team. Compared to what we've seen this past season, IMO they might actually be fun to watch.

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13 minutes ago, FireHabs said:

Quote from LeBurn:

It's a very poorly kept secret that Canadiens general manager Marc Bergevin is desperate to add a center to his roster so it would be fair to assume that they would want a player that fits that description if they were to give up their captain in the deal. The problem however is that of the players who fit that characterization on the Kings roster we really only have Anze Kopitar and Jeff Carter. You can immediately eliminate any notion of Kopitar being traded and I'm not so certain that the Kings are all that interested in trading Jeff Carter either. 

That being said though Pacioretty is 4 years young than Carter and although Carter plays a more valuable position he also counts for nearly $1 million more against the cap. Additionally Carter is under contract for 4 more seasons and he will be very old by NHL standards come the end of that deal, Pacioretty on the other hand is entering the final year of his contract. I'm still not certain the Kings would consider it, despite the fact that Carter is also coming off his own struggles in this most recent season, but there are some ways this trade could make sense for both sides.

Agreed they are not moving Kopitar and I dont *think* MB is dumb enough to go after Carter. 

I think we'd like to dream that we're trying to land Vilardi but it really doesnt make a lot of sense for LA to move him... for anybody really but certainly not for 29 year old Pacioretty.

The best you could conceivably hope for would be a package, maybe that includes their 1st round pick (20th overall), 

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What about this guy:

Evan Bouchard, D, 6-foot-2, 193 pounds (London, OHL): Did more than enough in the regular season to earn his meteoric rise up everyone’s list. He thinks the game well well, shoots the puck a ton, and is as strong as an ox, which will allow him to log big minutes down the road.

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5 minutes ago, FireHabs said:

What about this guy:

Evan Bouchard, D, 6-foot-2, 193 pounds (London, OHL): Did more than enough in the regular season to earn his meteoric rise up everyone’s list. He thinks the game well well, shoots the puck a ton, and is as strong as an ox, which will allow him to log big minutes down the road.

He looks good but he shoots R (the position we're strong at on defense) and he most likely will go mid-first-round.  

It sure seems like Timmins isnt interested at all in a defenseman in the first round. I dont think they even met / had dinner with one. 

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17 minutes ago, maas_art said:

He looks good but he shoots R (the position we're strong at on defense) and he most likely will go mid-first-round.  

It sure seems like Timmins isnt interested at all in a defenseman in the first round. I dont think they even met / had dinner with one. 

Larry Brooks of the NY Post said he used to work for the Devils and in the 80's NJ made a big show of taking Tom Barasso out for dinner multiple times and fawning over him, but it was all a smokescreen to get Buffalo to choose him first, so that John MacLean would fall to them. At this point, everyone thinks the Habs want Kotkaniemi, but maybe it's a smokescreen to go after Zadina or Hughes or Bouchard or whoever else.

Of interest, Arpon Basu said that TT brought up Zadina of his own volition in an interview when he wasn't asked about him. Just out of nowhere started talking about how Zadina was a great pick. Basu thought this might be a ploy to direct attention to Zadina so they can drop down a couple of spots and still take JK, but you have an equal camp who thought they want Zadina and are using JK as the smokescreen.

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4 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Larry Brooks of the NY Post said he used to work for the Devils and in the 80's NJ made a big show of taking Tom Barasso out for dinner multiple times and fawning over him, but it was all a smokescreen to get Buffalo to choose him first, so that John MacLean would fall to them. At this point, everyone thinks the Habs want Kotkaniemi, but maybe it's a smokescreen to go after Zadina or Hughes or Bouchard or whoever else.

Of interest, Arpon Basu said that TT brought up Zadina of his own volition in an interview when he wasn't asked about him. Just out of nowhere started talking about how Zadina was a great pick. Basu thought this might be a ploy to direct attention to Zadina so they can drop down a couple of spots and still take JK, but you have an equal camp who thought they want Zadina and are using JK as the smokescreen.

Yeah i just read an article by David St Louis who believes that Timmins was downplaying Hughes' value so that they could potentially take him if they draft down.  

its going to be an interesting day tomorrow. 

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9 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Yeah i just read an article by David St Louis who believes that Timmins was downplaying Hughes' value so that they could potentially take him if they draft down.  

its going to be an interesting day tomorrow. 

If we recap what MB and TT have said/done:

- They've boasted about the value of JK as a true #1 center

- They've said Zadina is a pure scorer who deserves to be in the conversation for #3

- They've taken JK, Zadina, Tkachuk, Svechnikov, and Hayton out for dinner

- They've mentioned Hughes will have issues playing defence in the NHL

- They've talked about how hard it is to get a top 3 pick and that you have to seize that opportunity as a reward

- Bergevin has also said he would be open to any discussion for trade if a GM called him

 

So all over the board, really. If they don't plan on trading the pick, they can say whatever they want and know that anyone other than Dahlin and Svechnikov is likely to be available. If they're trying to trade down or trying to acquire a 2nd top 10 pick, then it makes sense to throw out some nonsense, but if that's the case, JK becomes the smokescreen here. I don't think you're likely to land Zadina by trading down (someone trading up to 3 is either trying to get Zadina or Tkachuk in all likelihood). So is the play Tkachuk all along? He's really a name I haven't heard the Habs discuss as much as some of the others, yet he fits a lot of what we know Bergevin likes in players. Makes you wonder... could the Habs be trying to drum up a bidding war for #3 and trying to get Zadina and JK to go 3-4, for example, so they can take Tkachuk at 5? Or a defenceman? I think the Habs are most likely to take a forward and I still believe it's Kotkaniemi but they've definitely got everyone guessing and then second-guessing whether the obvious is really the truth.

 

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1 minute ago, Regis22 said:

Im still betting that they screw this up .

Third overall they should be a ble to pick a kid who is ready to play now and they'll mess it up ......somehow

JK has said he won't rule out coming to NHL next year but that he foresees playing one more year in Finland and then trying to make the NHL in 2019-20.

Zadina and Tkachuk have both said their goal is to play in the NHL next year. Most GM's think Dahlin and Svechnikov are NHL-ready and that Zadina has a shot. Tkachuk may be further away.

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Martin McGuire says LA has the most interest in Pacioretty, but that Pittsburgh also had interest at the deadline last year (and maybe that interest goes up if they end up dealing Kessel and need a replacement). Carolina and Florida also reportedly still interested, and obviously some discussion with Buffalo.

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Among teams that we know have looked into Pacioretty: LA, Ana, Fla, Car, Buf, Cal, and we can add Minnesota to that list as well. According to Michael Russo of The Athletic Minnesota, the Wild have looked into Pacioretty too. But reportedly, the Habs asked for a package that included the Wild's 1st rounder and Minny didn't want to do it. If true, gives an idea the Habs want another 1st rounder this year back. If you can get a 2nd pick inside the top 20, it gives you a crack at a guy like Hayton, Veleno, Miller, Berggren, Farabee, Smith, etc. If Bergevin and Timmins find a way to come out of the draft with one of JK/Zadina and one of Veleno/Hayton/Smith/Miller for example, I'd be mightily impressed.

Also, to further clarify the Martin McGuire rumor about Pacman to LA, he's added that Pacman will travel to LA to negotiate a contract extension after the draft... LA is a tricky destination, because I have very little interest in getting a guy like Toffoli or Muzzin back. I want Vilardi or I want a 1st rounder as part of a deal, otherwise I don't think they have what we want...

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41 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Among teams that we know have looked into Pacioretty: LA, Ana, Fla, Car, Buf, Cal, and we can add Minnesota to that list as well. According to Michael Russo of The Athletic Minnesota, the Wild have looked into Pacioretty too. But reportedly, the Habs asked for a package that included the Wild's 1st rounder and Minny didn't want to do it. If true, gives an idea the Habs want another 1st rounder this year back. If you can get a 2nd pick inside the top 20, it gives you a crack at a guy like Hayton, Veleno, Miller, Berggren, Farabee, Smith, etc. If Bergevin and Timmins find a way to come out of the draft with one of JK/Zadina and one of Veleno/Hayton/Smith/Miller for example, I'd be mightily impressed.

Also, to further clarify the Martin McGuire rumor about Pacman to LA, he's added that Pacman will travel to LA to negotiate a contract extension after the draft... LA is a tricky destination, because I have very little interest in getting a guy like Toffoli or Muzzin back. I want Vilardi or I want a 1st rounder as part of a deal, otherwise I don't think they have what we want...

McGuire stating Pacioretty will travel to LA to negotiate a contract extension... That seems confusing. Wouldn't that imply that a deal is almost certainly going to happen? Or that a deal will be happening soon? Is McGuire a reliable source?

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