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kinot-2

Ex-Habs

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18 hours ago, habs1952 said:

He's probably wondering why he is in the AHL and Pacioretty is in the NHL.

:4224:

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On 11/14/2018 at 6:47 PM, habs1952 said:

He's probably wondering why he is in the AHL and Pacioretty is in the NHL.

I gotta say, even regardless of the return we got for Patches (Which was substantial) I think we dodged a bullet on that contract.  Yikes.  Vegas is lucky its only 4 years.  Sure its possible he bounces back but now its 15 games this year AND all of last year.  Its looking more and more like he might actually be on the downturn, not just an extended slump. 

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20 hours ago, maas_art said:

I gotta say, even regardless of the return we got for Patches (Which was substantial) I think we dodged a bullet on that contract.  Yikes.  Vegas is lucky its only 4 years.  Sure its possible he bounces back but now its 15 games this year AND all of last year.  Its looking more and more like he might actually be on the downturn, not just an extended slump. 

Yup. We lucked out on this one.

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23 hours ago, maas_art said:

I gotta say, even regardless of the return we got for Patches (Which was substantial) I think we dodged a bullet on that contract.  Yikes.  Vegas is lucky its only 4 years.  Sure its possible he bounces back but now its 15 games this year AND all of last year.  Its looking more and more like he might actually be on the downturn, not just an extended slump. 

nant-moel7.jpg

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On 11/15/2018 at 10:56 PM, maas_art said:

I gotta say, even regardless of the return we got for Patches (Which was substantial) I think we dodged a bullet on that contract.  Yikes.  Vegas is lucky its only 4 years.  Sure its possible he bounces back but now its 15 games this year AND all of last year.  Its looking more and more like he might actually be on the downturn, not just an extended slump. 

Last year was a wash for every player on our team. I doubt he is done yet. Slow start but its a long season. He is shooting at 4% this year that will not last. He is usually around 10 to 12%. Add to the fact Vegas came out of the gates really slow. 

Having said that he had to go just like Galchenyk had to go. IF only Bergevin had realized that before he traded players like Subban, Sergachev and Lars Eller. We would have a much much much better team. 

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Patches has always needed to play with a center that can get him the puck. Think he made an error in judgement not signing with the Kings. If he was on a line with Kopitar he would be doing great right now. Lucky for us he did not, the Vegas trade even thou it looked lame at the time, is working out pretty darn well. 

As far as Domi goes, I loved that trade from day 1. He is very young and will have his off games. But wow he is really giving it his all.

Not sure why everyone wants to trade Drouin. Again he is very young and still learning. But he is the most talented player we have had here in quite some time. Does he have an off game every now and then. Of course, but we need more players with talent, not less.

 

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6 hours ago, tony5775 said:

 

Not sure why everyone wants to trade Drouin. Again he is very young and still learning. But he is the most talented player we have had here in quite some time. Does he have an off game every now and then. Of course, but we need more players with talent, not less.

 

Drouin is more off than on to my eye.

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Rad has 6G and 6A in 9 GP. 

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11 hours ago, kinot-2 said:

Rad has 6G and 6A in 9 GP. 

Heartbreaking. :wut2:

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On 11/1/2018 at 10:37 PM, BigTed3 said:

If we're going to vaunt Max Domi's performance thus far, let's also talk about how good Alex Galchenyuk has been in Arizona. The Coyotes went 2-5 without AG wile he was hurt and got out-scored 17 to 10 in those games, including being shutout 3 times. Since AG's return, the Yotes are 4-0 and have outscored their opponents 20-4. Galchenyuk has 4 pts in 4 games, is playing center, and is apparently doing well defensively as well, according to media reports.

So again, I'm pleased with what we've gotten from Domi but let's give this time to assess who won the trade and let's also acknowledge that if AG had been given the shot at center Domi's been getting that he too might have done well in the role.

Lets see how he is doing after 11 or 12 games. - 1 last night 0 shots on net. Where are the reports he is playing well defensively. Oh and by the way CF % is at 44% second worst on the team next to Josh Archibald. 

On 11/3/2018 at 3:42 PM, BigTed3 said:

Sure, let's see... Galchenyuk's CF was 52% going into last night's game and he had a bad game possession-wise last night (keeping in mind the Canes are the top team in the league at shot generation so far this year, so it wasn't just him), which killed his season totals because of the small sample size. He was a positive possession player 4 of 6 seasons with us FWIW. In any case, Yotes are 5-0 with him in the line-up (vs. 2-5 without him), so we'll see if they keep rolling... Brian Wilde stated that he had watched Galchenyuk playing center for the Coyotes and that he was having no issues defensively, and someone else reported they had spoken to local Arizona media, who said they didn't think Galchenyuk was hurting them defensively. Not to say he's a standout, just that what he brings on offence wasn't being brought down by poor defence.

And if we're going to compare, Domi is 4th worst on the team and 2nd worst among forwards for us in terms of CF too, so not like there's much difference between him and Galchenyuk there. And Domi's been a negative Corsi player every season he's been in the NHL, albeit on a bad team. Again, I'm not declaring a winner or loser in the trade by any means, just saying that if people are going to talk up Domi for playing 8-10 strong games, Galchenyuk has had just as good a start for Arizona.

So as requested after 12 games, his last 8 games he has 4 points, a - 4 rating, and Arizona has gone 3 and 5.  3rd highest in oZS% over 63%, 3rd lowest in dZS% 37%, so lots of help from the coaches to help with his offense. Expected +/- where shots come from when a player is on the ice. Only two players worse demers and keller, Galchenyk at a - 4.1.

After 12 games 8 points...

Meanwhile Domi has 12 points in his last 8, and is a + 2 rating, he doesn't have to be insulated like Glachenyk as can be atrributed by his oZS and dZS both being at 50%. 

After 20 games 24 points...

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2 hours ago, caperns61 said:

Lets see how he is doing after 11 or 12 games. - 1 last night 0 shots on net. Where are the reports he is playing well defensively. Oh and by the way CF % is at 44% second worst on the team next to Josh Archibald. 

So as requested after 12 games, his last 8 games he has 4 points, a - 4 rating, and Arizona has gone 3 and 5.  3rd highest in oZS% over 63%, 3rd lowest in dZS% 37%, so lots of help from the coaches to help with his offense. Expected +/- where shots come from when a player is on the ice. Only two players worse demers and keller, Galchenyk at a - 4.1.

After 12 games 8 points...

Meanwhile Domi has 12 points in his last 8, and is a + 2 rating, he doesn't have to be insulated like Glachenyk as can be atrributed by his oZS and dZS both being at 50%. 

After 20 games 24 points...

There is no way to know, but it's a near-certainty that Domi will regress. It'll be hard for him to maintain his shooting percentage. I fully agree that Domi is off to a better start than Galchenyuk, all I said before is that AG in his own right had had a good start in Arizona too, despite his early injury. I think it's too soon to say who will win the trade.

I also said the same thing about the Sergachev-Drouin trade. People last year were giving the Lightning a TKO win in the deal, but what I said was that it was too early to say who would be the winner in the long run and that both teams could end up winning the trade. I think the same thing of the Domi-AG deal, and maybe both teams will end up happy with what they got just because of the change of scenery for the two players.

 

 

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25 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

There is no way to know, but it's a near-certainty that Domi will regress.

FWIW Domi had 15 points in his last 15 games in Arizona too.  So thats 39 points in his last 35 games. Lets hope it continues.
I agree with you that his shooting percentages in particular will likely go down but his assists may end up going up so its tough to say. Either way he's been fantastic.


Having said that I still feel like we got less than full value in the trade.  Here's why.  Lets say we had traded Pacioretty for Tatar + 2nd.  Right now it would look like we won but it wasnt fair value for Pacioretty at the time.  Domi is playing better than Galchenyuk but at the time - summer of 2018 - i feel like AG should have had more value in a trade. In the end its worked out (very well) and Ive said all along id be happy to have Max Domi on my roster, but MB still should have insisted on something more imho. 

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On ‎11‎/‎18‎/‎2018 at 6:11 PM, maas_art said:

FWIW Domi had 15 points in his last 15 games in Arizona too.  So thats 39 points in his last 35 games. Lets hope it continues.
I agree with you that his shooting percentages in particular will likely go down but his assists may end up going up so its tough to say. Either way he's been fantastic.


Having said that I still feel like we got less than full value in the trade.  Here's why.  Lets say we had traded Pacioretty for Tatar + 2nd.  Right now it would look like we won but it wasnt fair value for Pacioretty at the time.  Domi is playing better than Galchenyuk but at the time - summer of 2018 - i feel like AG should have had more value in a trade. In the end its worked out (very well) and Ive said all along id be happy to have Max Domi on my roster, but MB still should have insisted on something more imho. 

I felt we should of gotten more initially myself. I think a lot of it has to do with Chucky being drafted 3rd overall and his offensive capabilities. That said after watching more of Domi this season I think he is a far more responsible defensive player who still has offensive skills and vision. You can see in Domi's down low coverage and helping out with the D he has a very high "hockey IQ". This could be from growing up in a hockey family and being around the game his whole life. I think an example is the game against Washington when Domi stole the puck from Ovie. Yes he did go down and score afterwards but even if he hadn't it may of prevented a goal. I don't ever remember Chucky having defensive awareness like that. I think all to often people over rate the highly gifted offensive players because they are exciting and fun to watch. In the overall picture though I would always rather have a Bergeron , or Toews or Yzerman or Sakic, Tavares, those that will sacrifice offense for defense when needed and can play in all situations. I really believe from the short sample we've seen already the JK is going to be that kind of player in the future. That is what you want in your #1 Centers . Players that you don't have to shelter. Eller is a player I still like and may not be a #1 but he can definitely fill in when needed and can be a #2 or # 3 because of skill and awareness.

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Pacioretty heating up a little, with 4G and 2A in the last 6 games inlcuding the OT winner last night.

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4 minutes ago, tony5775 said:
 Vegas Golden Knights Daniel Carr, RW - Called up from minors from Chicago-AHL
Knew this would be coming. Hope he sticks.

 

 

 

Was burning up the AHL when i last checked. First in scoring i think? like over 20 points in 15 games.   

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On 11/21/2018 at 5:56 AM, CaptWelly said:

I felt we should of gotten more initially myself. I think a lot of it has to do with Chucky being drafted 3rd overall and his offensive capabilities. That said after watching more of Domi this season I think he is a far more responsible defensive player who still has offensive skills and vision. You can see in Domi's down low coverage and helping out with the D he has a very high "hockey IQ". This could be from growing up in a hockey family and being around the game his whole life. 

True. And i mean in fairness to MB lets say your scount said "domi is 100% on the verge of a breakout & will be awesome for us." and you approach Arizona & want Domi + 2nd for Galchenyuk but they wont budge.   At a certain point you have to decide if its worth going with your scouts & making the trade even if its a little less than your ask. 

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^^ Everyone is aware that Galchenyuk also comes from a hockey family and grew up around the game too, right? His dad being "too involved" is supposedly one of the things the Habs didn't like. They also didn't like Tinordi's father interfering and Beaulieu's either. In fact, Bergevin seems to be largely against anyone's family having any type of opinion or involvement with his players.

In any case, the point remains: if the Habs, in a completely wasted season, had played AG at center and allowed him to score 25-30 goals, regardless of how crummy his defence was, there would have been a significantly higher market for him.

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On ‎11‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 4:18 PM, BigTed3 said:

^^ Everyone is aware that Galchenyuk also comes from a hockey family and grew up around the game too, right? His dad being "too involved" is supposedly one of the things the Habs didn't like. They also didn't like Tinordi's father interfering and Beaulieu's either. In fact, Bergevin seems to be largely against anyone's family having any type of opinion or involvement with his players.

In any case, the point remains: if the Habs, in a completely wasted season, had played AG at center and allowed him to score 25-30 goals, regardless of how crummy his defence was, there would have been a significantly higher market for him.

With Chucky that is true , but his father was Russian and they don't usually emphasize defensive hockey. I would imagine it also makes a difference the type of involvement and communication also. The teams do actually promote some with fathers and mothers actually making team trips. The team this year welcomed Kot's mother when she came over and he was staying with her.

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If anyone's interested, here's some update on Pleky's hockey future. This season he will play for his native Kladno (owned by Jaromír Jágr) in the second czech league. He will also alternate starts for Brno in the first czech league (Brno is a defending champion). Oh, and Jágr seems to continue in Kladno too :).

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On 11/23/2018 at 2:18 PM, BigTed3 said:

^^ Everyone is aware that Galchenyuk also comes from a hockey family and grew up around the game too, right? His dad being "too involved" is supposedly one of the things the Habs didn't like. They also didn't like Tinordi's father interfering and Beaulieu's either. In fact, Bergevin seems to be largely against anyone's family having any type of opinion or involvement with his players.

In any case, the point remains: if the Habs, in a completely wasted season, had played AG at center and allowed him to score 25-30 goals, regardless of how crummy his defence was, there would have been a significantly higher market for him.

Maybe, except ... AG 9pts in 15games, -3 with Arizona, 1pt in his last 5 games, averaging 16 mins of ice time.      I was very high on AG, but even I'm starting to think I may have misjudged his talent.    The trade is looking more and more like we got a steal in Domi.

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3 hours ago, HabsAlways said:

Maybe, except ... AG 9pts in 15games, -3 with Arizona, 1pt in his last 5 games, averaging 16 mins of ice time.      I was very high on AG, but even I'm starting to think I may have misjudged his talent.    The trade is looking more and more like we got a steal in Domi.

the talent is there the brain is not.

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Rad has 8G and 12 Assists  in 14 GP. 

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3 minutes ago, kinot-2 said:

Rad has 8G and 12 Assists  in 14 GP. 

I blame you.

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