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ramcharger440

Claude Julien: to return in 2020-21

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Has CJ been blackballed by the league/refs ?? I'm at a lost to explain why the officiating is so lopsided. Last night was a prime example for anybody who watched. Blatant calls ignored,,, most of which were right in the refs face. They tell our players to f off after the game and then refuse to even talk to CJ. Something is up.

If Chara had cross checked a guy to the face on any other team, would that have been called a major and possibly a game? Seems to be open house on anybody wearing a Hab jersey of late. CJ's team got away with a ton as the Bruins coach. Are they trying to make up for it now that he doesn't have Jacobs to protect him? Makes you wonder.

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4 hours ago, H_T_L said:

Has CJ been blackballed by the league/refs ?? I'm at a lost to explain why the officiating is so lopsided. Last night was a prime example for anybody who watched. Blatant calls ignored,,, most of which were right in the refs face. They tell our players to f off after the game and then refuse to even talk to CJ. Something is up.

If Chara had cross checked a guy to the face on any other team, would that have been called a major and possibly a game? Seems to be open house on anybody wearing a Hab jersey of late. CJ's team got away with a ton as the Bruins coach. Are they trying to make up for it now that he doesn't have Jacobs to protect him? Makes you wonder.

Doesn't make me wonder. 

 

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The Armia call was one of the worst I have seen in a while.... well at least since the crosscheck to the throat the other night. These calls are hurting us and the refs are destroying some pretty good hockey. I'm not sure that is what the league wants to do but it makes some if us wonder.  :7072:

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On 2/15/2020 at 7:38 AM, BigTed3 said:

Exactly. But this is the problem. You have a faction of the French media, like Gagnon and Rejean Tremblay and Benoit Brunet and so on who turn this into language politics and make it sound like any attempt at hiring an anglophone coach is a slight against Francophone people. But then you get dozens of French posters replying to Gagnon saying "we don't care, we want to win." I absolutely believe that real fans of the team couldn't give a care who the coach is as long as he's good at his job. One poster brought up Felipe Alou as the coach of the Expos and talked about how he did a great job for a long time and was never able to speak to Francophones directly. In fact, almost every coach in the history of the Expos and Alouettes has been Anglophone or otherwise without being able to speak French. The captain of the Habs speaks to the media just as often as the coach, and no one has made as much of a stink over Koivu, Pacioretty, or Weber. And even the coaching thing wasn't a big issue with the Habs until about the past 10 years, when certain people made a stink about Cunneyworth and then Serge Savard was put in charge of the GM search and told Molson that he couldn't hire a non-Francophone because it would be an affront to French-Quebecers. Molson is clearly too scared to ruffle feathers in this, so instead we've set the team back by following this policy.

Again, personally, I have no issue with the Julien hiring. He's a guy with a proven track record who might actually have been the best guy available. But I absolutely do not believe Therrien or Lefebvre were the best candidates for their jobs, and their destruction of our development is still hurting us now. So the selfishness and ignorance of people like Gagnon and Savard and so on is without a doubt hurting this team and it's a sad state of affairs that he would go around posting this now. Then again, Gagnon is a Nordiques/Sens fan who has always taken a bit of an anti-Habs angle on things and his views on the Habs always seem to be biased against them... for example, last night, he also posted that he didn't think Domi plus Poehling would be enough value to give to Minnesota to get Dumba. Personally, I wouldn't make that trade as the Habs, regardless of what Minnesota would or would not do, but he continually under-values Habs' players as well and continually goes against the Habs in penalty assessments while other media (even non-Habs fans from English sports networks) are saying things in our favor. He's anti-Hab and he's anti-Habs success at the expense of language.

He is a Sens fan...if there was a team in Quebec city he would be a fan of them too. he has always had an axe to grind with the Habs. also during the 60's and 70's a time of a lot of english french turmoil in Quebec the coaches were english! but we were winning so no issue!

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5 hours ago, H_T_L said:

Has CJ been blackballed by the league/refs ?? I'm at a lost to explain why the officiating is so lopsided. Last night was a prime example for anybody who watched. Blatant calls ignored,,, most of which were right in the refs face. They tell our players to f off after the game and then refuse to even talk to CJ. Something is up.

If Chara had cross checked a guy to the face on any other team, would that have been called a major and possibly a game? Seems to be open house on anybody wearing a Hab jersey of late. CJ's team got away with a ton as the Bruins coach. Are they trying to make up for it now that he doesn't have Jacobs to protect him? Makes you wonder.

at the start of the season i remeber CJ calling out the refs and one of the french press guy's said that may have been a bad idea....

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45 minutes ago, ramcharger440 said:

He is a Sens fan...if there was a team in Quebec city he would be a fan of them too. he has always had an axe to grind with the Habs. also during the 60's and 70's a time of a lot of english french turmoil in Quebec the coaches were english! but we were winning so no issue!

Gagnon has publicly said he was a Nords fan. When they left, he became a Sens fan thereafter. There's no secret who he likes and that he is not a Habs fan. He just goes out of his way to go against the Habs whenever he can...

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26 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Gagnon has publicly said he was a Nords fan. When they left, he became a Sens fan thereafter. There's no secret who he likes and that he is not a Habs fan. He just goes out of his way to go against the Habs whenever he can...

Wife did some research and found that he doesn't like the Pens either ,and gives them a lot of penalties that were/are "suspicious".

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How this guy has managed to keep his job just confuses me. Should of let him go about 20 games back. I realize that MB is the bigger problem, but come on.

Was at the Dallas game on Saturday the team has burst of energy but other wise is just going through the motions. Domi was terrible most of the game. Time for a new approach and I do not see a reason to wait until the end of the season. Unless you are getting rid of both of them and want the new GM to hire his own coach.  

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8 minutes ago, tony5775 said:

How this guy has managed to keep his job just confuses me. Should of let him go about 20 games back. I realize that MB is the bigger problem, but come on.

Was at the Dallas game on Saturday the team has burst of energy but other wise is just going through the motions. Domi was terrible most of the game. Time for a new approach and I do not see a reason to wait until the end of the season. Unless you are getting rid of both of them and want the new GM to hire his own coach.  

I’d expect and hope it’s this. After TD you fire MB and new gm hires his coach after season 

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1 hour ago, booboo_mtl said:

I’d expect and hope it’s this. After TD you fire MB and new gm hires his coach after season 

Pretty sure MB is safe (I think Molson will give him at least 1 more season) but even if he isnt, i dont see anything happening till the summer. 

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At this point, I don't see how the team can feel CJ or MB should be retained. They've both run out of solutions. I still think CJ is a good coach, but he's lost control of the team and his message isn't getting through any more, so we're flogging a dead horse here. Bergevin, IMO, has demonstrated he can't do the job for years now, so I don't see why he keeps getting chances.

That said, I'd put the odds of Julien being fired at the end of the season at around 75% but I'd put the odds of Bergevin being let go at only 30%. Like I've said before though, the summer of 2021 is going to be the most crucial summer for the Habs in a long time. Lots of UFA's, a few key RFA's who will need contracts, the expansion draft, decisions on re-building and whether to keep Carey and Weber... lots to decide in the next year. If you keep Bergevin through the end of next year, he has a lot of opportunity to set back his successor. If you want to put a new guy in place, the best time to do it is now so they can line things up for the 2021 summer and ED as they see fit.

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Gerry is in town on vacation........i wonder how nervous CJ is!

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2 hours ago, ramcharger440 said:

Gerry is in town on vacation........i wonder how nervous CJ is!

Gallant is in town, but at the same time, Bergevin is in Denver. So it's not Bergevin who is interviewing Gallant if he's here on some smokescreen trip for the Habs coaching job. Either he's actually here just visiting or he's here but meeting with Molson behind Bergevin's back, which means Bergevin would be on his way out too. My guess is this is sadly not hockey-related and Bergevin is staying.

TVA just posted a top 10 list of potential replacements for Julien. Here's their list with my comments:

- Roy: a bit hot-headed and wants to be GM too, which may not work

- Hartley: bad coach. No. No. And no. Worse than Julien and maybe worse than Therrien.

- Therrien: seriously? If this doesn't show you how stupid the French-speaking idea is, then nothing will. The fact that the guy you just fired and whom you've fired twice already is a top 10 candidate just speaks to the fact that the coaching pool of French-speaking candidates is too small to be useful.

- Ducharme: he would have been a maybe before, but has he done much as an assistant to warrant a promotion or should he be shown the door with Julien?

- Bouchard: likewise, seemed to be a good candidate to succeed Julien, but he has a decent AHL roster and his team is in as much of a downward spiral as the Habs. Still better than Ducharme though.

- Pascal Vincent: currently the coach of the Manitoba Moose and not having much success in the AHL. Not a great resume.

- Andre Tourigny: limited NHL experience as an assistant coach, otherwise mainly a junior coach. Currently with the 67's and has been average. Again, nothing to stand out and suggest he deserves to be here.

- Benoit Groulx: of all the French-speaking candidates, he's perhaps the most intriguing. He's currently with the Syracuse Crunch of the AHL, but he's won championships in the QJMHL before. He's been a coach for a while, but the question is if he's too old-school in his philosophy and just more of the same as we had recently.

- Mike Babcock: so he gets fired and then run through the mill about how he mistreats players. Hard to envision him being a worthwhile candidate at this point.

- Gallant: he makes sense in that he has coached here as an assistant, is a players' coach, and he has NHL head coaching experience and success. But he's been mysteriously fired twice now and he doesn't speak French. We know the Habs considered him before hiring Julien though, so it doesn't sound like it's out of the question.

All in all, I think this is a pretty sad list. I wouldn't touch Therrien, Hartley, or Babcock with a 10-foot pole and I don't see what gives Vincent or Tourigny any type of credentials to earn the job. I think Bouchard needs more time in the AHL to prove himself but could be a candidate down the line, and he's still ahead of Ducharme for now. That leaves me with Gallant, Groulx, and Roy in some order as the top 3 and I don't know that I love any of those ideas terribly. I'd rather see them think outside the box and bring in someone whose more up to speed on the current NHL and a different way of thinking, who is okay using younger guys and not penalizing youngsters for mistakes and shattering their confidence.

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well.............. his latest brainstorm of supposedly benching Lekky to make him realize he needs to be more productive on offense...:7072:

following THAT logic, all but 2 or 3 of the team ought to be benched !!

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I'm wondering if we'd be dissing Julien if Bergevin had done HIS job.

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3 minutes ago, habs1952 said:

I'm wondering if we'd be dissing Julien if Bergevin had done HIS job.

I definitly would be because MB was not here when CJ had his first shot at running the Canadiens and they didn't make the playoffs then in 2 out of 3 years with the only playoff appearance being a 1st round loss. Sound familiar? Cause it just so happens that he is 1 for 4 with the only appearance a 1st round loss in his current stint. I honestly don't know why he was ever brought back. In fact in his entire 17 years as an NHL coach he has either missed the playoff (8) or had a first round exit (3) 11 times. Also he has only made it past round 2 three times and twice lost in the Stanley cup finals. So 1 championship in 10 appearances and 3 finals over the same span does not make a great coach.

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On 2/19/2020 at 8:23 PM, BigTed3 said:

- Ducharme: he would have been a maybe before, but has he done much as an assistant to warrant a promotion or should he be shown the door with Julien?

This would be the only guy i would look at if they were hiring a new coach. I think as soon as the team is officially out. CJ gets the axe, and give Ducharme the rest of the season. 

It must be hard to work with a coach that has been around as long as Julien you probably dont get much say in the decisions. 

He has been a really good coach with younger kids. And if we start turning over this roster. I think he could be a perfect Fit..

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On 2/19/2020 at 5:23 PM, BigTed3 said:

All in all, I think this is a pretty sad list. I wouldn't touch Therrien, Hartley, or Babcock with a 10-foot pole and I don't see what gives Vincent or Tourigny any type of credentials to earn the job. I think Bouchard needs more time in the AHL to prove himself but could be a candidate down the line, and he's still ahead of Ducharme for now. That leaves me with Gallant, Groulx, and Roy in some order as the top 3 and I don't know that I love any of those ideas terribly. I'd rather see them think outside the box and bring in someone whose more up to speed on the current NHL and a different way of thinking, who is okay using younger guys and not penalizing youngsters for mistakes and shattering their confidence.

I'd pass on all of them except Gallant and Roy, and only consider those two if I had nobody else to go with.   Neither of them were stellar coaches at the NHL level.

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1 hour ago, HabsAlways said:

I'd pass on all of them except Gallant and Roy, and only consider those two if I had nobody else to go with.   Neither of them were stellar coaches at the NHL level.

Except Roy took a team that finished last in the league with very little roster changes to the second or third round of the playoffs in his first year as coach of the Avs. Plus he revolutionized the way coaches look at using the extra attacker. If that's not the makings of a good coach I don't know what is.

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8 minutes ago, campabee82 said:

Except Roy took a team that finished last in the league with very little roster changes to the second or third round of the playoffs in his first year as coach of the Avs. Plus he revolutionized the way coaches look at using the extra attacker. If that's not the makings of a good coach I don't know what is.

2005-06 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 65 51 12 0 2 0.800 Lost in Finals
2006-07 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 70 37 28 0 5 0.564 Lost in round 1
2007-08 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 70 38 28 0 4 0.571 Lost in round 2
2008-09 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 49 16 0 3 0.743 Lost in round 3
2009-10 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 41 20 0 7 0.654 Lost in round 2
2010-11 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 48 16 0 4 0.735 Lost in round 3
2011-12 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 43 18 0 7 0.684 Lost in round 2
2012-13 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 42 21 0 5 0.654 Lost in round 2
2013-14 Colorado Avalanche NHL Head 82 52 22 0 8 0.683 Lost in round 1
2014-15 Colorado Avalanche NHL Head 82 39 31 0 12 0.549 Out of Playoffs
2015-16 Colorado Avalanche NHL Head 82 39 39 0 4 0.500 Out of Playoffs
2018-19 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 27 28 0 13 0.493 Lost in round 1

 

Sure, he did good his first year with the AVs ... and then was underwhelming after.   He had Duchene, Landeskog, McKinnon etc to work with during thost last 2 years and Varlamov in net ... so they under performed it would seem.

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10 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:
2005-06 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 65 51 12 0 2 0.800 Lost in Finals
2006-07 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 70 37 28 0 5 0.564 Lost in round 1
2007-08 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 70 38 28 0 4 0.571 Lost in round 2
2008-09 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 49 16 0 3 0.743 Lost in round 3
2009-10 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 41 20 0 7 0.654 Lost in round 2
2010-11 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 48 16 0 4 0.735 Lost in round 3
2011-12 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 43 18 0 7 0.684 Lost in round 2
2012-13 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 42 21 0 5 0.654 Lost in round 2
2013-14 Colorado Avalanche NHL Head 82 52 22 0 8 0.683 Lost in round 1
2014-15 Colorado Avalanche NHL Head 82 39 31 0 12 0.549 Out of Playoffs
2015-16 Colorado Avalanche NHL Head 82 39 39 0 4 0.500 Out of Playoffs
2018-19 Quebec Remparts QMJHL Head 68 27 28 0 13 0.493 Lost in round 1

 

Sure, he did good his first year with the AVs ... and then was underwhelming after.   He had Duchene, Landeskog, McKinnon etc to work with during thost last 2 years and Varlamov in net ... so they under performed it would seem.

I assumed we were just talking about at the My level cause that is exactly what you said! That none of the preformed well at THE NHL LEVEL! But your right he still only has 1 playoff appearance in 3 years and that was a first round exit as well so similar to CJ's stats and everyone considers CJ a great coach. Plus Roy is better working with younger kids

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8 minutes ago, campabee82 said:

I assumed we were just talking about at the My level cause that is exactly what you said! That none of the preformed well at THE NHL LEVEL! But your right he still only has 1 playoff appearance in 3 years and that was a first round exit as well so similar to CJ's stats and everyone considers CJ a great coach. Plus Roy is better working with younger kids

I think Roy is a better coach than CJ, but I also don't think Roy is a stellar coach .. nor Gallant.   There's a reason Roy hasn't coached in 5 years in the NHL.    And only reason he coached again the Q is he owns the team.    Gallant as well, not sure what it is behind the scenes but he's been fired twice now without a lot of "reason".   They were a winning team and in a WC spot at the time (Vegas).

The only way Habs get good coaching is if Molson can buck the establishment and go with a non-Francophone and get the best coach available (that's not Gallant in my mind).

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35 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:

Sure, he did good his first year with the AVs ... and then was underwhelming after.   He had Duchene, Landeskog, McKinnon etc to work with during thost last 2 years and Varlamov in net ... so they under performed it would seem.

He may have had those players, but the defence was brutal and your lucky if they had two NHL lines. So even to get them to the playoffs once  was a miracle. The west had power house teams then ..Colorado only turned the corner with the emergence of MacKinnon and Rantanen and the Jewels they found on dee with Makar and Girard add to those two Nikita Zadorov and a pair of good vets like Johnson and Cole. Well they may just have one of the top 1,  2 or 3 defensive groups in the whole league,,

Even when Mackinnon and Rantanen had carreer years in 2016-2017 Colorado still ended up last place in the league because of there dee, goal tending and depth. 

Don't read into this either, i dont want Roy, but there are worse choices.....

I still think our best option right now would be Ducharme

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25 minutes ago, caperns61 said:

Don't read into this either, i dont want Roy, but there are worse choices.....

Which is why I said "'I'd pass on all of them except Gallant and Roy, and only consider those two if I had nobody else to go with"

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8 hours ago, campabee82 said:

I definitly would be because MB was not here when CJ had his first shot at running the Canadiens and they didn't make the playoffs then in 2 out of 3 years with the only playoff appearance being a 1st round loss. Sound familiar? Cause it just so happens that he is 1 for 4 with the only appearance a 1st round loss in his current stint. I honestly don't know why he was ever brought back. In fact in his entire 17 years as an NHL coach he has either missed the playoff (8) or had a first round exit (3) 11 times. Also he has only made it past round 2 three times and twice lost in the Stanley cup finals. So 1 championship in 10 appearances and 3 finals over the same span does not make a great coach.

Which is a hell of a lot better than every coach the Habs have had in that time span.

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