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33 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Seth Jones has reportedly told Clb he won't sign an extension with them and wants to test the UFA market after the 21-22 season. Clb is rumored to not want to let him go to market and risk losing him for nothing, so reports say they want to trade him around the draft. He's still only 26 and will likely be a top pairing guy for another 5-7 years. He plays huge minutes and can play both special teams, in addition to providing size, skating, and a huge shot. He's a strong possession player with a positive relative Corsi every season he's been in the league.

What would you offer if you're the Habs, assuming you get the chance to speak to him before a trade and that he's willing to discuss an extension here?

I saw that, and this is a tough one. Seth Jones is a RHD, American Born so perhaps unlikely to come to Canada and in the category of elite with 1 more year left on his contract at $5.4M. He plays big minutes and turns 27 in October. Jones is likely to get Petry type money plus - 4-5 year term - Comparables - Krug, Pietrangelo, Ekblad - probably $7 - $7.5M. Columbus already has 3 first round draft choices for this year, so our first round pick for 2022 could be in play. I sense they are also on a youth / reset kick having to sign Laine and Werenski the year after. They would want some young roster players and they lost leadership in Foligno. Gallagher has a NMC. I think the cost could be high but if they would take Edmundson, our 2022 first round pick, one of our LHD prospects (Struble, Guhle, Harris, Norlinder), that may not be enough. This is a very expensive deal and I really like Seth Jones but does it vault us into top contender status? - IMO likely not as we still need scoring. I believe there could be better alternative values the next year out, and when we are able to unload Weber. 

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17 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

Seth Jones has reportedly told Clb he won't sign an extension with them and wants to test the UFA market after the 21-22 season. Clb is rumored to not want to let him go to market and risk losing him for nothing, so reports say they want to trade him around the draft. He's still only 26 and will likely be a top pairing guy for another 5-7 years. He plays huge minutes and can play both special teams, in addition to providing size, skating, and a huge shot. He's a strong possession player with a positive relative Corsi every season he's been in the league.

What would you offer if you're the Habs, assuming you get the chance to speak to him before a trade and that he's willing to discuss an extension here?

Obviously if there's a chance to get Jones at the right price, you jump on that.  Columbus has spent higher than normal lately but traditionally is a team that likes to keep its salary down so I wonder if there's an opportunity to build a deal around Weber.  He has 1 more year at $6m actual salary & the drops down to $3m or less for the duration - while giving the jackets a $7.8m cap hit. They still have Werenski, They still have Gavrikov  they still have a few other good dmen.  Weber could easily setting into a 2nd pair role and be very effective there.

Of course there's a huge imbalance because of the age difference so we'd have to sweeten the pot. I would assume they would ask for CC, JK or Suzuki, all of which would be a hard pass for me (I might consider trading JK for Eichel for example, but not a player at a different position).

Enter Ryan Poehling.   First round pick, 22 years old just scored at a PPG pace in Laval... Maybe you make an offer like:

Weber + Poehling + middle six roster player 
For
Jones. 

I could see an appeal for both teams.  Would MB do it? Has the lustre of the Man Mountain finally started to wear off a bit on MB? 

Jones - Petry - Brook/Fleury.... thats a very solid RD lineup. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

Isn't Seth Jones having a terrible season?

28pts in 56 games is fairly consistent for his career stats.  His +/- wasnt great but thats a product of Columbus this year imho. 

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6 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Obviously if there's a chance to get Jones at the right price, you jump on that.  Columbus has spent higher than normal lately but traditionally is a team that likes to keep its salary down so I wonder if there's an opportunity to build a deal around Weber.  He has 1 more year at $6m actual salary & the drops down to $3m or less for the duration - while giving the jackets a $7.8m cap hit. They still have Werenski, They still have Gavrikov  they still have a few other good dmen.  Weber could easily setting into a 2nd pair role and be very effective there.

Of course there's a huge imbalance because of the age difference so we'd have to sweeten the pot. I would assume they would ask for CC, JK or Suzuki, all of which would be a hard pass for me (I might consider trading JK for Eichel for example, but not a player at a different position).

Enter Ryan Poehling.   First round pick, 22 years old just scored at a PPG pace in Laval... Maybe you make an offer like:

Weber + Poehling + middle six roster player 
For
Jones. 

I could see an appeal for both teams.  Would MB do it? Has the lustre of the Man Mountain finally started to wear off a bit on MB? 

Jones - Petry - Brook/Fleury.... thats a very solid RD lineup. 

Anything we offer has to be conditional on an extension IMO. If he's only with us for 1 year then obviously the deal is going to reflect that. As you mention,,, Weber could be interesting to them,, and if it's only for 1 year for us with Jones,, then i'd be OK for a 1 for 1 swap. Sure we lose Webs in the long term, but is that really a bad situation for us? Can we not find a reasonable replacement in one year down the road for his Cap hit??

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25 minutes ago, maas_art said:

28pts in 56 games is fairly consistent for his career stats.  His +/- wasnt great but thats a product of Columbus this year imho. 

Fair enough. I saw a snapshot of some advanced statistics related to him and it made it sound bad... But, to be honest, I didn't fully know what all the stats were, so... I have no idea if he's dropping off, having a bad season, or if its just reflective of the team's overall poor play.

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Jones is a massive upgrade, he has the speed, physicality that MB likes.  If Columbus would be willing I would like to see 2021 1ST, Poehling and say a Tatar or Leks of course it would have to be a resign and trade kind of deal.

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22 minutes ago, 26NCounting said:

Jones is a massive upgrade, he has the speed, physicality that MB likes.  If Columbus would be willing I would like to see 2021 1ST, Poehling and say a Tatar or Leks of course it would have to be a resign and trade kind of deal.

I think you'd have to include Weber or Petry in the deal.  That would be $19m to our three RHD and thats before Jones gets a raise. 

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2 minutes ago, maas_art said:

I think you'd have to include Weber or Petry in the deal.  That would be $19m to our three RHD and thats before Jones gets a raise. 

Agreed, it doesn't make sense to pay any of the three to play 3rd pairing either, unless of course your using Petry as 1 LD and lining up

Petry-Jones

Chiarot-Weber

Romanov-Edmundson

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Forget the Seth Jones fantasy.  The organization simply can't afford him under current cap, with other FAs to sign.  Unless one of Price/Weber goes, Jones is simply unaffordable.

That's why regardless of the playoffs, the off-season requires a proper assessment of how to free up the Price and Weber contracts.  IMHO, Price is harder to trade because no other franchise would take his contract.  Unless the League is going to expand frequently down the road, the Seattle expansion draft is the only once-in-a-moment opportunity to offload Price's contract because he'll 100% be gone if exposed.  If not, Price goes down the Henrik Lundqvist road and retires with the Habs.  Weber is easier to trade and I wonder whether Nashville will take him back to allow him to retire with them.

Now that the Centre issue is more or less addressed, it's time to build a mobile PMD.  That needs $$$ and the organization really needs to free itself from the contracts of Price and Weber to reform the D.  The Sergachev trade was a mistake which I hope the organizations learns from and never repeats.  I'll pay no more than $5 million for a goalie.      

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1 minute ago, PuckPundit said:

Forget the Seth Jones fantasy.  The organization simply can't afford him under current cap, with other FAs to sign.  Unless one of Price/Weber goes, Jones is simply unaffordable.

That's why regardless of the playoffs, the off-season requires a proper assessment of how to free up the Price and Weber contracts.  IMHO, Price is harder to trade because no other franchise would take his contract.  Unless the League is going to expand frequently down the road, the Seattle expansion draft is the only once-in-a-moment opportunity to offload Price's contract because he'll 100% be gone if exposed.  If not, Price goes down the Henrik Lundqvist road and retires with the Habs.  Weber is easier to trade and I wonder whether Nashville will take him back to allow him to retire with them.

Now that the Centre issue is more or less addressed, it's time to build a mobile PMD.  That needs $$$ and the organization really needs to free itself from the contracts of Price and Weber to reform the D.  The Sergachev trade was a mistake which I hope the organizations learns from and never repeats.  I'll pay no more than $5 million for a goalie.      

Don''t agree about the money, if we let Tater and Dano go we could find a way to do it. Now that being said I don't know if I would but it could be done.

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22 minutes ago, PuckPundit said:

Forget the Seth Jones fantasy.  The organization simply can't afford him under current cap, with other FAs to sign.  Unless one of Price/Weber goes, Jones is simply unaffordable.

That's why regardless of the playoffs, the off-season requires a proper assessment of how to free up the Price and Weber contracts.  IMHO, Price is harder to trade because no other franchise would take his contract.  Unless the League is going to expand frequently down the road, the Seattle expansion draft is the only once-in-a-moment opportunity to offload Price's contract because he'll 100% be gone if exposed.  If not, Price goes down the Henrik Lundqvist road and retires with the Habs.  Weber is easier to trade and I wonder whether Nashville will take him back to allow him to retire with them.

Now that the Centre issue is more or less addressed, it's time to build a mobile PMD.  That needs $$$ and the organization really needs to free itself from the contracts of Price and Weber to reform the D.  The Sergachev trade was a mistake which I hope the organizations learns from and never repeats.  I'll pay no more than $5 million for a goalie.      

Or after we win the Cup this year then Weber decides to retire

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19 minutes ago, PuckPundit said:

Forget the Seth Jones fantasy.  The organization simply can't afford him under current cap, with other FAs to sign.  Unless one of Price/Weber goes, Jones is simply unaffordable.

That's why regardless of the playoffs, the off-season requires a proper assessment of how to free up the Price and Weber contracts.  IMHO, Price is harder to trade because no other franchise would take his contract.  Unless the League is going to expand frequently down the road, the Seattle expansion draft is the only once-in-a-moment opportunity to offload Price's contract because he'll 100% be gone if exposed.  If not, Price goes down the Henrik Lundqvist road and retires with the Habs.  Weber is easier to trade and I wonder whether Nashville will take him back to allow him to retire with them.

Now that the Centre issue is more or less addressed, it's time to build a mobile PMD.  That needs $$$ and the organization really needs to free itself from the contracts of Price and Weber to reform the D.  The Sergachev trade was a mistake which I hope the organizations learns from and never repeats.  I'll pay no more than $5 million for a goalie.      

It's doable but very improbable, so yes it fits within the fantasy realm. It would have to be a trade and sign extension for it to work, and Jones is likely to get $8M plus money, and Columbus would want a 3 player deal. Columbus is pretty much in a rebuild / reset mode with youth movement even with 3 first round picks this year, one would think what's another 2021 first rounder going to do for them  - maybe a 2022 first round pick is in the mix as the first part. The second part is what current roster player would Columbus want - would Jonathan Drouin be sufficient - that would release $5.5M of cap room but unlikely since they whiffed on Domi from us - KK, Suzuki and Caufield are untouchable. The third part would be a promising prospect of our LHD side as I have previously mentioned. This would be a very expensive deal just for a RHD who would push Petry to 3/4 pairing and Captain Weber (assuming he stays) to 5/6 pairing on the RHD sides. The Jackets will have better offers - likely from the LA Kings. 

IMHO, we are not freeing up the Price contract unless it's thru the unlikely Seattle Krakken claim. Weber is less of a long term problem as I have previously analyzed with 2 year implications, or the Nashville trade to lessen the potential recapture penalty. Price and Weber don't hurt us for the next 2 seasons. 

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2 hours ago, H_T_L said:

You would hope, but

1. I'm sure almost every team will want a kick at the can.

2. He doesn't fit the prototype for what Bergevin usually goes after... he's more of an offensive D man than defensive D man and off the ice, he supposedly keeps to himself and is seen as less of a leader in the dressing room.

3. I think MB loves Weber and Petry and doesn't see a need for another RHD (mistakenly).

 

If the team could sign a guy like Hamilton and trade Weber (or lose him in the ED), it would be huge. But it won't happen.

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The likelihood either Jones or Hamilton sign here is slim to none. I’d bet both these players are eyeing up an American market. Big FA’s don’t choose Canadian markets. If we are to get anything done it will be through the draft and shrewd trading, and thrifty FA acquisitions. The good news is that I don’t think we’re in too bad a position. Yes we need an upgrade in the puck moving defence department in order to improve our regular season results, PP etc. But our defence has been pretty effective thus far in these playoffs. With any luck Romanov will have a better go of it next year, but if not, maybe Gustovson could prove helpful in the mean time. To me our issue seems to be less about what we have and more about how we use it. What we have now is working, but it doesn’t work in the regular season. We just need to adjust how we deploy the likes of Weber and Chiarot, drop them down a pair or two in the regular season, push them back to the front line when we get back to the playoffs. Gus might be a bit of a turnover machine, but so are a lot of puck moving D. In the regular season they look great, but are liabilities in the playoffs. Lol look at Sergachev, I haven’t watched a lot of Tampa, but the little bit I have seen this post he has been brutal! 

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9 minutes ago, MALMACIAN_CRUNCH said:

The likelihood either Jones or Hamilton sign here is slim to none. I’d bet both these players are eyeing up an American market. Big FA’s don’t choose Canadian markets. If we are to get anything done it will be through the draft and shrewd trading, and thrifty FA acquisitions. The good news is that I don’t think we’re in too bad a position. Yes we need an upgrade in the puck moving defence department in order to improve our regular season results, PP etc. But our defence has been pretty effective thus far in these playoffs. With any luck Romanov will have a better go of it next year, but if not, maybe Gustovson could prove helpful in the mean time. To me our issue seems to be less about what we have and more about how we use it. What we have now is working, but it doesn’t work in the regular season. We just need to adjust how we deploy the likes of Weber and Chiarot, drop them down a pair or two in the regular season, push them back to the front line when we get back to the playoffs. Gus might be a bit of a turnover machine, but so are a lot of puck moving D. In the regular season they look great, but are liabilities in the playoffs. Lol look at Sergachev, I haven’t watched a lot of Tampa, but the little bit I have seen this post he has been brutal! 

While i agree that its unlikely we'll sign either, i think there are exceptions to the rule. Hamilton is an odd cat for a hockey player. Ive read several reports where he did things like going to an art museum by himself rather than going paintballing with his teammates on a road trip.  To be sure, im not saying this is a bad thing, but it speaks to the fact that he may be looking for something other than just money. Maybe the culture in quebec is of interest to him?  Anyway, its moot imho because i think MB thinks Weber/Petry is our 1-2 RHD for the foreseeable future still. 

I DO think that a run like this should help us attract some free agents though. Im not sure who we would actually target (since we dont know who we're resigning, who we're iosing in the ED and who we may be trading) but going deep into the playoffs is always a good way to get UFAs interested.  they wont give you a discount but it might be the final incentive to get them to sign here. 

 

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29 minutes ago, habsisme said:

Especially if Drouin doesn't come back and its probably a given we don't sign Tatar, I would really be looking hard at Taylor hall

 especially since Hall said it's about the right fit not about the money ...and if you believe that I also have some prime swamp land in Florida 

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11 minutes ago, arpem-can said:

 especially since Hall said it's about the right fit not about the money ...and if you believe that I also have some prime swamp land in Florida 

well he'd get the money and the fit here

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36 minutes ago, arpem-can said:

 especially since Hall said it's about the right fit not about the money ...and if you believe that I also have some prime swamp land in Florida 

A land baron, eh? :lol:

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38 minutes ago, arpem-can said:

 especially since Hall said it's about the right fit not about the money ...and if you believe that I also have some prime swamp land in Florida 

The guy also chose to go to Buffalo last year after just about every team in the league contacted him. Given how poorly that worked out, you'd have to think he'll choose differently this time around but I'd put odds on one of these teams:

- Boston

- Edmonton

- Pittsburgh

- Islanders

- Rangers

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