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2019-20 State Of The Habs


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1 hour ago, arpem-can said:

we need Hall ...open the vault on an offer and hope he bites 

Hall has stated that his biggest factor is being able to play on a winning team since he has only played in the playoffs twice in his 10 year career. While every team is committed to winning, I don’t think we stack up well in a tough division of ruins, laffs and bolts to give him that assurance that our needle is on the rise  - my bet is he goes to Colorado who also have plenty of cap space and appear to have under tapped potential. Alternatively Dallas has cap room and promising consistency of playoff runs. Any free agent signing by us will impact the Kraken E draft as they will be protected in the 

I would like to see Bergevin negotiate with St. Louis who are close to their cap limit - it’s clear Binnington  is their #1 goalie so we should pry Jake Allen as a Expensive backup at $4.35M  and their #1 pick for one of our castaway forwards. The blues are likely to be desperate for cap room or they are losing Vince Dunn and also not really improving their team. They might even move Alex Steen who is an expensive over the hill player at 5.75M with a NTC but again I would want their #1 pick, For taking on that weight. - 

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26 minutes ago, claremont said:

I would like to see Bergevin negotiate with St. Louis who are close to their cap limit - it’s clear Binnington  is their #1 goalie so we should pry Jake Allen as a Expensive backup at $4.35M  and their #1 pick for one of our castaway forwards. The blues are likely to be desperate for cap room or they are losing Vince Dunn and also not really improving their team. They might even move Alex Steen who is an expensive over the hill player at 5.75M with a NTC but again I would want their #1 pick, For taking on that weight. -

 well that's creative for sure ..I just don't see Steen's contract fetching a #1 pick as well for taking on his contract nor do I see Montreal laying out that kind of money for a back-up (almost 15 mill for goalies ? ) ...this year's draft isn't exactly deep with D prospects that would be available either ...I'd rather keep Domi as an RFA pay him a bit more and try for someone like Khudobin ...some  think Domi has seen his last game for Montreal ...I'm not so sure about that ...I think Montreal could sign Dome to a $4 mill bridge for 2 years that would have him in the fold as well as keeping a tradeable asset 

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2 hours ago, maas_art said:

Julien with a presser today.  I didnt see it but read the snips from Basu, Engels et al. Some highlights:

- Julien feels 100% - so good that if they had won the last game on friday he would have come back to TO to get into the bubble again.

- Will be back coaching next year

- The organization is very high on Romanov & feels he will be ready to take on a significant role next year.  (read between the lines: we arent getting any more D this summer)

- Downplayed Danaults comments about wanting to be in a more offensive role. This is good news because it sounds like Claude intends to play him behind JK and Suzuki.

- Likes Domi as a Centre.   My math indicates we have 4 centres who all believe they should be on the top 2 lines... something has to give. 

Yeah, I thought the comment about Domi was the most interesting. I didn't see the actual presser, but I'm not sure if something was lost in the translation because most of the French media reported Julien as saying "Domi sees himself as a center, so we'll have to see what we can do to make that work" whereas the English media reported it as "I see Domi as a center..." Not sure which was right or if Julien made different comments in different languages.

Certainly, it's clear that Domi doesn't view himself as a winger and if Danault thinks he's a top 6 center, Domi's going to be thinking he has a better claim to being an offensive center than Danault. So if you're Julien, not clear why you come out saying you're going to look to find a spot for Domi at center if you truly believe Suzuki and JK can both play there. Julien did back up this view of Domi as a center by playing him as the 4C in the playoffs (it was Muller who moved him to wing) but I don't suspect that can last: Domi is too good to be a 4C and won't accept a contract that reflects that place in the line-up, nor the ice time that goes with it. And for what it's worth, I think the organization likes Jake Evans and views him as a cheap alternative there that can provide supporting cast offence. Danault's place in the line-up now becomes a question but even if they were to trade him, I highly doubt the organization sees Domi as an effective 3C with how bad he is defensively. So I come back to propping up Domi as a center publicly might be no more than making sure everyone views him as a center as a trade asset. I really think the odds are mounting that he's being traded this off-season.

On a separate note, the other comments being reported today were from Petry, who said he and his wife feel like Montreal is home and he would be interested in negotiating an extension before the end of his current contract. Yes, it might just be his saying this to the media, but I get the feeling he would be interested in staying and like I argued in another post, I'm not sure expiring UFA's are going to have a lot of trade value given the COVID situation, so we may actually be better off looking to keep Petry if he's willing to sign for something reasonable like 4 years.

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7 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

I highly doubt the organization sees Domi as an effective 3C with how bad he is defensively. So I come back to propping up Domi as a center publicly might be no more than making sure everyone views him as a center as a trade asset. I really think the odds are mounting that he's being traded this off-season.

I think that's bang on the money.   Combine that with Domi removing his MTL references on Social Media, the fact that realistically given these playoffs that Suzuki/Kotkaniemi are now 1A-1B ... that leaves 3 and 4 to Danault and Domi?  The only way Domi stays is if he plays wing ... something he clearly has no interest in.

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1 hour ago, arpem-can said:

 well that's creative for sure ..I just don't see Steen's contract fetching a #1 pick as well for taking on his contract nor do I see Montreal laying out that kind of money for a back-up (almost 15 mill for goalies ? ) ...this year's draft isn't exactly deep with D prospects that would be available either ...I'd rather keep Domi as an RFA pay him a bit more and try for someone like Khudobin ...some  think Domi has seen his last game for Montreal ...I'm not so sure about that ...I think Montreal could sign Dome to a $4 mill bridge for 2 years that would have him in the fold as well as keeping a tradeable asset 

It is creative use of the cap room - I guess I am trying to suggest a way where we could buy a top draft pick almost like the Steve Mason contract ($4.1 million) and Joel Armia (#1 pick - 16th overall) acquisition for the little risk prospect of Simon Bourque given up. So there is precedent if you see the similarity. There will be some teams desperate to acquire cap room. Bergevin has never used much of his cap room. It is an alternative to using it on free agency with Jake Allen or an Alex Steen having only 1 year left. 

Nashville is another team without much cap room - $9.2 million who have to replace 2 C/RW and 35 goals, 43 assists combined scored by Mikael Granlund (17g, 30a), and Craig Smith (18g, 13a) - both of them earned a combined $10M last year. Preds also have to replace 2 defenseman. They are a trading target for the habs as Preds haven fallen short of success and a need to improve. David Poile might be too smart to part with a #1 pick for some cap room vs. say a Domi or some other parts. Other than RW Philip Tomasino their last year RW draft choice who may not be ready to step into an NHL lineup - they don't have any interesting prospects. 

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2 hours ago, jennifer_rocket said:

But but but... Getting knocked out in the first round of the playoffs is hugely important!!! :ph34r: :lol:

We had an 88% chance we wouldnt get 1st overall, so sure, we could have theoretically but i think its much fairer to say 9th vs 16th.

Was a 10 game run (with the first 4 not really counting) worth it?  Maybe.

I say maybe because its all going to depend on what MB does now.   This 10 game span showed our strengths and flaws more than any regular season can.  MB now has real-world evidence - more than he had at the COVID stoppage.   

If he uses that & makes the changes necessary, the drop of 7 picks is worth it.  If he doesnt, then it isnt.  I know someone will say "but we could have had 9th AND made the right changes" but imho no way MB makes some of the moves I hope (and think he might) makes this summer without that small run. 

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1 hour ago, BigTed3 said:

Certainly, it's clear that Domi doesn't view himself as a winger and if Danault thinks he's a top 6 center, Domi's going to be thinking he has a better claim to being an offensive center than Danault. So if you're Julien, not clear why you come out saying you're going to look to find a spot for Domi at center if you truly believe Suzuki and JK can both play there. Julien did back up this view of Domi as a center by playing him as the 4C in the playoffs (it was Muller who moved him to wing) but I don't suspect that can last: Domi is too good to be a 4C and won't accept a contract that reflects that place in the line-up, nor the ice time that goes with it. And for what it's worth, I think the organization likes Jake Evans and views him as a cheap alternative there that can provide supporting cast offence. Danault's place in the line-up now becomes a question but even if they were to trade him, I highly doubt the organization sees Domi as an effective 3C with how bad he is defensively. So I come back to propping up Domi as a center publicly might be no more than making sure everyone views him as a center as a trade asset. I really think the odds are mounting that he's being traded this off-season.

On a separate note, the other comments being reported today were from Petry, who said he and his wife feel like Montreal is home and he would be interested in negotiating an extension before the end of his current contract. Yes, it might just be his saying this to the media, but I get the feeling he would be interested in staying and like I argued in another post, I'm not sure expiring UFA's are going to have a lot of trade value given the COVID situation, so we may actually be better off looking to keep Petry if he's willing to sign for something reasonable like 4 years.

Suddenly we've gone from a team with horrific weakness down the middle to a strong team down the middle with the emergence of Suzuki and KK in this short playoff run. You raise an interesting puzzle - is Danault more valuable in the eyes of a trading partner vs Domi, and attitude among these entitled athletes counts somewhere. I am not convinced Evans has the heart and vision to be that fourth liner. He's been conked hard in games I have seen, and just doesn't strike me as strong on his skates. I could live with trading either of Danault, Domi and even Poehling who I keep reading needs an attitude adjustment.

I would love Petry to be signed to an extension - he has earned it by his performance and seems to be a fan and teammate favourite.

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34 minutes ago, maas_art said:

We had an 88% chance we wouldnt get 1st overall, so sure, we could have theoretically but i think its much fairer to say 9th vs 16th.

Was a 10 game run (with the first 4 not really counting) worth it?  Maybe.

I say maybe because its all going to depend on what MB does now.   This 10 game span showed our strengths and flaws more than any regular season can.  MB now has real-world evidence - more than he had at the COVID stoppage.   

If he uses that & makes the changes necessary, the drop of 7 picks is worth it.  If he doesnt, then it isnt.  I know someone will say "but we could have had 9th AND made the right changes" but imho no way MB makes some of the moves I hope (and think he might) makes this summer without that small run. 

As much as I hate to admit it ... that 1/8 chance of getting Lafrenniere ... well I was mad at first, but watching Suzuki and Kotkaniemi blossom in the playoffs, well maybe that experience was well worth dropping from 9th to 16th.    Not comparing those two to him, but Lemieux blossomed after the Canada Cup in 87 ... he even admitted that having to play that intense with every game on the line taught him how to compete more.  And maybe thats what we are looking at with our two young centers.

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1 hour ago, BigTed3 said:

Yeah, I thought the comment about Domi was the most interesting. I didn't see the actual presser, but I'm not sure if something was lost in the translation because most of the French media reported Julien as saying "Domi sees himself as a center, so we'll have to see what we can do to make that work" whereas the English media reported it as "I see Domi as a center..." Not sure which was right or if Julien made different comments in different languages.

Yeah im not sure - not having hear Claude actually say it.  I think the team does view him as a centre...  of course on the flip side, a centre is worth more than a winger so possibly they are (finally) trying to inflate the value of their players before a trade - you know "he had an ok season but he's way better at centre" sort of thing.  

1 hour ago, BigTed3 said:

ertainly, it's clear that Domi doesn't view himself as a winger and if Danault thinks he's a top 6 center, Domi's going to be thinking he has a better claim to being an offensive center than Danault. So if you're Julien, not clear why you come out saying you're going to look to find a spot for Domi at center if you truly believe Suzuki and JK can both play there. Julien did back up this view of Domi as a center by playing him as the 4C in the playoffs (it was Muller who moved him to wing) but I don't suspect that can last: Domi is too good to be a 4C and won't accept a contract that reflects that place in the line-up, nor the ice time that goes with it. And for what it's worth, I think the organization likes Jake Evans and views him as a cheap alternative there that can provide supporting cast offence. Danault's place in the line-up now becomes a question but even if they were to trade him, I highly doubt the organization sees Domi as an effective 3C with how bad he is defensively. So I come back to propping up Domi as a center publicly might be no more than making sure everyone views him as a center as a trade asset. I really think the odds are mounting that he's being traded this off-season

Re the bolded part, maybe the plan is 3 offensive lines & Evans as the 4th line checking centre?  Dunno.  With Suzuki and JK as your top 2 centres you have two good two way lines, so you could theoretically use Domi on the 3rd line in an exploitative situation.  Wont get the icetime he needs most likely though in that scenario. 

1 hour ago, BigTed3 said:

On a separate note, the other comments being reported today were from Petry, who said he and his wife feel like Montreal is home and he would be interested in negotiating an extension before the end of his current contract. Yes, it might just be his saying this to the media, but I get the feeling he would be interested in staying and like I argued in another post, I'm not sure expiring UFA's are going to have a lot of trade value given the COVID situation, so we may actually be better off looking to keep Petry if he's willing to sign for something reasonable like 4 years.

There have been a few players (Hall today today too) that made it sound like its not all about the money & they realize the money is going to be different for the foreseeable future. 

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33 minutes ago, claremont said:

Suddenly we've gone from a team with horrific weakness down the middle to a strong team down the middle with the emergence of Suzuki and KK in this short playoff run. You raise an interesting puzzle - is Danault more valuable in the eyes of a trading partner vs Domi, and attitude among these entitled athletes counts somewhere. I am not convinced Evans has the heart and vision to be that fourth liner. He's been conked hard in games I have seen, and just doesn't strike me as strong on his skates. I could live with trading either of Danault, Domi and even Poehling who I keep reading needs an attitude adjustment.

I would love Petry to be signed to an extension - he has earned it by his performance and seems to be a fan and teammate favourite.

I think for sure Danault would be a more valuable piece to a team than Domi ..Domi has had one good year point -wise and Danault is considered a top defensive forward in the league who at this point can get you 50 points consistently  ( plus the circle ) .. .... with the emergence of our other centres Montreal is strong down the middle  for the first time in years ...I'd keep them both ...just convince Domi that $4 +  mill for a 2 or 3 year bridge deal  at 24 yrs of age means the club gets to tell you where to play ...I'm all for signing Petry to an extension as well 

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1 hour ago, arpem-can said:

I think for sure Danault would be a more valuable piece to a team than Domi ..Domi has had one good year point -wise and Danault is considered a top defensive forward in the league who at this point can get you 50 points consistently  ( plus the circle ) .. .... with the emergence of our other centres Montreal is strong down the middle  for the first time in years ...I'd keep them both ...just convince Domi that $4 +  mill for a 2 or 3 year bridge deal  at 24 yrs of age means the club gets to tell you where to play ...I'm all for signing Petry to an extension as well 

I tend to agree that for most teams, Danault has more value than Domi in a trade, although at team that needs an offensive centreman may choose Domi over Danault, especially if they have a high end #1 centre.  Domi is an ideal #2 centre if your top guy can get you 80-90+ points per year. 

I would not be opposed to trading either, or keeping both, although id definitely rather not lose both. 

 

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10 minutes ago, maas_art said:

I tend to agree that for most teams, Danault has more value than Domi in a trade, although at team that needs an offensive centreman may choose Domi over Danault, especially if they have a high end #1 centre.  Domi is an ideal #2 centre if your top guy can get you 80-90+ points per year. 

I would not be opposed to trading either, or keeping both, although id definitely rather not lose both. 

 

It is kind of surreal that we have so many good centers that we are talking about trading one to get a d man or a winger! it is like an alternate universe!

 

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1 hour ago, maas_art said:

Yeah im not sure - not having hear Claude actually say it.  I think the team does view him as a centre...  of course on the flip side, a centre is worth more than a winger so possibly they are (finally) trying to inflate the value of their players before a trade - you know "he had an ok season but he's way better at centre" sort of thing.  

Re the bolded part, maybe the plan is 3 offensive lines & Evans as the 4th line checking centre?  Dunno.  With Suzuki and JK as your top 2 centres you have two good two way lines, so you could theoretically use Domi on the 3rd line in an exploitative situation.  Wont get the icetime he needs most likely though in that scenario. 

There have been a few players (Hall today today too) that made it sound like its not all about the money & they realize the money is going to be different for the foreseeable future. 

I 100% believe the team views Domi as a center, or at least Julien does (and Julien confirmed he'd be back next year). If you don't view him as a center, I doubt you put him in as your 4C. But Domi was ineffective as a 4C, be it because he didn't have the wingers to support him or because he wasn't happy there and decided not to play. And he wasn't overly effective as a winger either. I think everyone knows that Domi will produce the most if he's played as a top 6 center, but he's no longer our best option in that role, and we have guys (Suzuki and Kotkaniemi) now who are already more talented (Suzuki) or have the potential to be more talented (Kotkaniemi) all the while being superior defensively. It doesn't look like there's a seat for Domi left.

As far as the 3C slot goes, I also don't see Domi there. We could easily fill out our line-up with three attacking-style lines but someone's going to have to play against the Crosby's, the McDavid's, the Matthews', and the MacKinnon's of the league, and I don't see Julien trusting Domi to do that job. And while I think Suzuki and Kotkaniemi could probably learn how to go best on best, I also don't see CJ wanting to waste their talents on a lot of defensive zone starts and big minutes on the PK. You're going to have to have someone who fills that role, the way Danault does so perfectly. If Julien was really fine with going pro-offence and not having a shutdown guy, I highly doubt we would have seen Danault on the top line for so long. I highly doubt we would have seen Galchenyuk bumped down to 4th line wing if they were okay with just putting their best offensive centers in the line-up. This team had Carbonnneau and Koivu and Plekanec and Eller and then Danault, and even though we haven't had a true 1C in ages, we've always had strong two-way centers. The Habs have never been ones to break dramatically from history and I'd be shocked if they abandon the idea of matching up a shutdown center to play against the opposition's top line. And at the end of the day, if you have a guy like Danault, he's a better overall player than Domi anyways, so as long as he doesn't quit on the team, Danault is your obvious choice over Domi anyways.

As far as Evans goes, I also don't view him as a checking center. I think he's going to be a smart player (which the coaches love) but I think he's also a guy with skill. Not good enough to necessarily be a top 6 center, but he can be your 4C, give you some offensive punch from the 4th line, and fill in higher up the line-up if there's an injury. With some luck, maybe we shape him into a Danault-like two-way player but I think he's at least 2 years away from that and not ready to step into Danault's spot right away. He wouldn't be a guy I'd trust with last-minute-of-the-game defensive stands next year. But Suzuki-JK-Danault-Evans would be a pretty decent middle of the ice line-up if everyone accepts their roles.

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Friedman also reporting that the next NHL season is likely to start in mid-December after a draft and free agency period in November. What he adds though is that the players are extremely unlikely to agree to being in a bubble again for a full season, so they're most likely going to need to look at having teams travel like the NFL plans to do. The problem with that is that Canada requires a 14-day quarantine if you come into the country, so it makes it virtually impossible to have teams play between the two countries. Two solutions would be

1. To have the Canadian teams play out of American cities (the Habs for example have been rumored to be relocated to Buffalo along with the Leafs and Sens) or to Florida, where they have their share of fans.

2. An all-Canadian division with the 7 Canadian teams basically playing only each other in a shortened season. This would be a pretty interesting situation for us because there isn't one team in Canada that jumps out as a big threat the way your Tampa's or Vegas' or Boston's might be. Ottawa is re-building, Edmonton is a mess, Toronto is going to have to make changes, Vancouver is up-and-coming but not quite there yet, and Calgary is rebounding after another disappointing playoff exit, while Winnipeg has no D corps. That division would be there for the taking for a possible #1 seed. Might give MB hesitation about trading away any of his impending UFA's if he feels he's in a division he could potentially win.

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9 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

Friedman also reporting that the next NHL season is likely to start in mid-December after a draft and free agency period in November. What he adds though is that the players are extremely unlikely to agree to being in a bubble again for a full season, so they're most likely going to need to look at having teams travel like the NFL plans to do. The problem with that is that Canada requires a 14-day quarantine if you come into the country, so it makes it virtually impossible to have teams play between the two countries. Two solutions would be

1. To have the Canadian teams play out of American cities (the Habs for example have been rumored to be relocated to Buffalo along with the Leafs and Sens) or to Florida, where they have their share of fans.

2. An all-Canadian division with the 7 Canadian teams basically playing only each other in a shortened season. This would be a pretty interesting situation for us because there isn't one team in Canada that jumps out as a big threat the way your Tampa's or Vegas' or Boston's might be. Ottawa is re-building, Edmonton is a mess, Toronto is going to have to make changes, Vancouver is up-and-coming but not quite there yet, and Calgary is rebounding after another disappointing playoff exit, while Winnipeg has no D corps. That division would be there for the taking for a possible #1 seed. Might give MB hesitation about trading away any of his impending UFA's if he feels he's in a division he could potentially win.

It's getting more and more difficult to imagine the NHL pulling this off in American cities where they have no handle on Covid (especially Florida )...the US is content to just let everybody get it at this point as they're past the point of no return in testing and tracing ..It's only working at all because the play-offs are being held in TO and Edmonton ...and we're not even through the third stage of the playoffs with a way to go yet ... I'm intrigued by an all Canadian division on Canadian soil but I just don't see this flying in the States ...I'm still finding  piped in crowd sounds a bit surreal

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16 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

Friedman also reporting that the next NHL season is likely to start in mid-December after a draft and free agency period in November. What he adds though is that the players are extremely unlikely to agree to being in a bubble again for a full season, so they're most likely going to need to look at having teams travel like the NFL plans to do. The problem with that is that Canada requires a 14-day quarantine if you come into the country, so it makes it virtually impossible to have teams play between the two countries. Two solutions would be

1. To have the Canadian teams play out of American cities (the Habs for example have been rumored to be relocated to Buffalo along with the Leafs and Sens) or to Florida, where they have their share of fans.

2. An all-Canadian division with the 7 Canadian teams basically playing only each other in a shortened season. This would be a pretty interesting situation for us because there isn't one team in Canada that jumps out as a big threat the way your Tampa's or Vegas' or Boston's might be. Ottawa is re-building, Edmonton is a mess, Toronto is going to have to make changes, Vancouver is up-and-coming but not quite there yet, and Calgary is rebounding after another disappointing playoff exit, while Winnipeg has no D corps. That division would be there for the taking for a possible #1 seed. Might give MB hesitation about trading away any of his impending UFA's if he feels he's in a division he could potentially win.

 

6 hours ago, arpem-can said:

It's getting more and more difficult to imagine the NHL pulling this off in American cities where they have no handle on Covid (especially Florida )...the US is content to just let everybody get it at this point as they're past the point of no return in testing and tracing ..It's only working at all because the play-offs are being held in TO and Edmonton ...and we're not even through the third stage of the playoffs with a way to go yet ... I'm intrigued by an all Canadian division on Canadian soil but I just don't see this flying in the States ...I'm still finding  piped in crowd sounds a bit surreal

What a mess.  With the recent shift by the US government to only test symptomatic people, the numbers seem to be going down but are most likely going to get far worse if asymptomatic spreaders go untested, becoming essentially super spreaders.    

At this point you almost think its better to forget the regular season as we know it. Give them 4-5 months breadk, Do a few round robins - maybe 10 - 15 games to see teams and then just let everyone play. Do another play in round or 2 and then start the playoffs.  Keeps interest up and its not like teams will be making back their lost revenue if the venues arent open anyway.

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2 hours ago, maas_art said:

 

What a mess.  With the recent shift by the US government to only test symptomatic people, the numbers seem to be going down but are most likely going to get far worse if asymptomatic spreaders go untested, becoming essentially super spreaders.    

At this point you almost think its better to forget the regular season as we know it. Give them 4-5 months breadk, Do a few round robins - maybe 10 - 15 games to see teams and then just let everyone play. Do another play in round or 2 and then start the playoffs.  Keeps interest up and its not like teams will be making back their lost revenue if the venues arent open anyway.

Hopefully after January 21st. (due to Nov. 4th) There will be a welcome shift in the US. With someone in charge  actually using and applying science based strategies. 

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8 hours ago, CaptWelly said:

Hopefully after January 21st. (due to Nov. 4th) There will be a welcome shift in the US. With someone in charge  actually using and applying science based strategies. 

  I think the window has closed for the States as sad as it is because now it's impossible to do effective tracing not to mention the man-power needed for such an undertaking . Tack onto that the lack of PPE's even for health workers and it's insurmountable .This is reflective in the sheer numbers in the States with 4% of the worlds pop and anywhere from  20% - 25%  of the world's deaths and cases . The predictable future according to real scientists holds 3 scenarios ..either 1) this fall and winter will see a huge secondary strike of Covid cases that medical facilities can't possibly deal with 2) there will be continuing peaks and valleys well into next year or 3) it will just be a steady uninterrupted flow of positive cases well beyond next year with no guarantee that a vaccine that can even last for a year let alone be available to the masses . Every major sport has no paying customers ..... yeah it's a long-term mess and for sure my grandson isn't going to school until further notice .

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Seems the playoff elite final 8 have some young defenceman that have just surpassed all expectations - Vancouver has Hughes, Avs have Makar, Stars have Heiskenen, Isles have Pulock or Toews to lesser degrees, TB not so young with Sergachev - Flyers not so much, Bruins not so much. Columbus with Jones and Werensky were dynamic.

We all know the game is getting younger but my point is that to get into the elite, it appears you need to have some luck / fortune or development opportunities for a young D-men to step up into the limelight. I don;'t expect Romanov to  be that offensive Dynamo but putting some additional eggs in the basket with Norlinder, Struble, Harris, Juulsen, Fleury, Mete or getting some additional prospects in a trade like Broberg, Byram, Dobson, York, Harley , Heinonen etc. would be a good strategy. Your expected #5/6 stepping up to be a 1, 2 in short time frames is a recipe for success. I hear the trade Weber noise building.

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21 minutes ago, claremont said:

Seems the playoff elite final 8 have some young defenceman that have just surpassed all expectations - Vancouver has Hughes, Avs have Makar, Stars have Heiskenen, Isles have Pulock or Toews to lesser degrees, TB not so young with Sergachev - Flyers not so much, Bruins not so much. Columbus with Jones and Werensky were dynamic.

We all know the game is getting younger but my point is that to get into the elite, it appears you need to have some luck / fortune or development opportunities for a young D-men to step up into the limelight. I don;'t expect Romanov to  be that offensive Dynamo but putting some additional eggs in the basket with Norlinder, Struble, Harris, Juulsen, Fleury, Mete or getting some additional prospects in a trade like Broberg, Byram, Dobson, York, Harley , Heinonen etc. would be a good strategy. Your expected #5/6 stepping up to be a 1, 2 in short time frames is a recipe for success. I hear the trade Weber noise building.

Not sure that I would say any of that is luck. Makar (4th overall), Heiskanen (3rd), Hughes (7th), Sergachev (9th), Jones (4th), and Werenski (8th) were all top 10 picks. They were all studs going into their respective drafts and they have all done well at the NHL level. You can add in Provorov, who was drafted 7th overall, and to a lesser degree Charlie McAvoy, who was a 14th overall pick. The Islanders are maybe more of an exception, but they still have a bunch of 1st rounders on their roster, even if none are stars... Pulock was a #15, Dobson was a #12, Hickey was a #4, Leddy was a #16. Most of the teams left in the playoffs simply spent smart capital at the draft building their D corps, which is something I have always advocated for: a strong D man, especially earlier in their career, can be on the ice for 24-27 minutes a night and can influence the game moreso than most forwards do. The Habs, conversely, have only one 1st round D men on their roster (Juulsen, 26th overall) if we exclude Alzner, who isn't really on the NHL roster any more. Most of our D corps has been built via trade. We went through the same thing at center, where we didn't have any strong homegrown talent. The bottom line is that success in a salary cap world requires you to have high draft picks or diamonds in the rough who blossom in your own system and give you top performance through their ELC and cost-controlled RFA years.

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2 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

The bottom line is that success in a salary cap world requires you to have high draft picks or diamonds in the rough who blossom in your own system and give you top performance through their ELC and cost-controlled RFA years.

This can't be stressed enough.    You don't build a team through trades or UFA signings so much anymore.    Those are used to compliment what you've drafted and put you over the top into contention.      You need the young studs on ELC/Cheap RFAs to be top performers otherwise you simply won't fill out a roster with top talent given the cap.

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It seems to me that if a top end team, say Colorado, had Carey Price, they would significantly improve their odds of winning the Cup.  Just imagine if Price played as well as he did for Montreal in these playoffs for Colorado...Colorado would likely still be in the playoffs, and Colorado would have a much greater chance of winning the Cup this year, and for a few more years.

In exchange for Price, and likely a Cup or two, we get Colorado's (example team) top picks and elite prospects, then down the road, we may become a top end team.  That's our role right now.  Give the best goalie in the league to a team that needs one to win the Cup.  In exchange for providing that, we get major future assets, so we can one day become a top end team.

If we need to eat some cap in the short term to make the deal go through, no problem.  

Everyone wins here, the top end team likely wins a Cup/s, Price wins a Cup/s, and we get multiple major future assets.



 






 

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50 minutes ago, Windoe said:

It seems to me that if a top end team, say Colorado, had Carey Price, they would significantly improve their odds of winning the Cup.  Just imagine if Price played as well as he did for Montreal in these playoffs for Colorado...Colorado would likely still be in the playoffs, and Colorado would have a much greater chance of winning the Cup this year, and for a few more years.

In exchange for Price, and likely a Cup or two, we get Colorado's (example team) top picks and elite prospects, then down the road, we may become a top end team.  That's our role right now.  Give the best goalie in the league to a team that needs one to win the Cup.  In exchange for providing that, we get major future assets, so we can one day become a top end team.

If we need to eat some cap in the short term to make the deal go through, no problem.  

Everyone wins here, the top end team likely wins a Cup/s, Price wins a Cup/s, and we get multiple major future assets.



 






 

With one proviso:

That they develop those picks and/or prospects before sending them to the Habs.

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

So with Joel Edmundson signed, our d-corps looks like this:

Weber, Petry, Chairot, Edmundson, Kulak, Romanov, Juulsen, Fleury, Brook, Alzner

Mete is RFA (should be re-signed), Ouellet is RFA (may not be resigned,or, resigned for Laval), Folin is UFA (wont -hopefully - be resigned).

Reading between the lines and taking what MB has said at face value, our pairs should look like this:

 

Chairot - Weber
Edmundson - Petry
Romanov - Juulsen/Fleury

That means Mete or Kulak is either gone, or press-boxed/waived.   Brook will almost certainly be sent to Laval for more development. If Juulsen can stay healthy then I think Fleury goes down again too.  Alzner may finally be bought out, or just buried, but either way he wont be on this roster. 

Its not the worst we've seen during MB's tenure - may actually be one of his best - but is it good enough?  I think our RD is fine (a little long in the tooth of course but thats what we've got) but LD is still a huge question mark.  Chairot and Edmundon are both (at best) #4 dmen. So having one play next to Petry is fine but the other one should be on the bottom pair.   We need to hope like heck that Romanov adapts immediately because if he can take the role of top pairing LD then the whole d corps is suddenly worlds better.    Its a big IF though and you're putting it on the shoulders of a 20 year old. 

 

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