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2020 NHL Draft


kinot-2
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13 minutes ago, H_T_L said:

Bonus is that the Leafs will not have any picks in the 1st round because they traded it to the Canes. Sweet.

Yup! even better.

I can definitely live with the Rags having him. They've got enough problems & I dont think he's going to solve many. 

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13 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

 

Winnipeg is actually the team I most hope he goes to. Some good young talent but not a complete team where they'd become dominant with him (they have one of the worst D corps in the league) and he'd stay in Canada on a non-Leafs team. After that, I'm rooting for another West team like Minnesota, Nashville, or to a lesser degree Edmonton. Worst case scenario for us would be Florida winning. Florida has a lot of good young talent and adding Lafreniere might be enough to keep them ahead of us in the standings on some occasions over the next 5 years. They're direct competition for us. Yes, Toronto is also in our division and also direct competition and it's much easier to dislike them, but you have to figure that team is being remodeled anyways, so who knows what they're going to look like in 4 months.

And FWIW, I think the league is hoping he goes to the Rangers.

Just pointing out that this is what the league would have wanted if it had the choice, as I stated before the lottery happened. Goes along with the Rangers being one of last year's winners in 2019 as well, when they moved up to grab Kaapo Kakko. Two gifts. League representatives have long been quoted as saying behind closed doors that it's good for the league to have strong teams in New York, LA, and Boston. Joe Thornton mentioned the same thing as being a well-known fact among players that the NHL favors the Rangers and Bruins above other teams. So it's not the worst thing that could have happened to us, but it's still a convenient result for the NHL.

I wasn't a fan of how the league set up this lottery to be honest. As opposed to the usual lottery where there are numbered balls that correspond to a winner, in this case, you could actually see the logos of each team's ball as it floated around the pit. Before the button-pusher pressed the switch, you could clearly see a moment where the Leafs ball sa in the outflow tube or when the Wild one sat there or so on. And when the winning ball went flying out, you could see it was a blue and red logo as it went out. I'm not saying the supposedly impartial button-pusher was looking or had a favorite, but if he wanted to, he could definitely have tried to influence the outcome by pressing the button at a moment where he thought one team's ball was in best position to move out through the tube. It definitely didn't seem like a blinded procedure.

I also found it funny that Bettman defended the lottery by saying that the teams in the this pool were ones that didn't qualify for the first round of the playoffs and thus would be considered the equivalent of non-playoff teams and thus should be eligible to get the top pick. No mention of the fact the league referred to the play-in as the playoffs. No mention of the fact that these were in some cases top 10-15 teams in the league and have top 10-15 talent but got knocked out by a sham best-of-5 series. Inconsistent yet again from the league.

In any case, from our perspective, I'll take the fact the Pens didn't win as an equivalent sign that we wouldn't have won in their place and thus we'd likely now be looking at a #16 pick instead of a #9. Still an important drop, especially if we get knocked out in the next round, but more tolerable than knowing we could have had Lafreniere.

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1 hour ago, habs1952 said:

Bush league officiating by a bush league. Bush league discipline by a bush league. Bush league playoff setup by a bush league. Bush league lottery by a bush league. 

WOW, tell us what you really think. :frech1:

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2 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

Just pointing out that this is what the league would have wanted if it had the choice, as I stated before the lottery happened. Goes along with the Rangers being one of last year's winners in 2019 as well, when they moved up to grab Kaapo Kakko. Two gifts. League representatives have long been quoted as saying behind closed doors that it's good for the league to have strong teams in New York, LA, and Boston. Joe Thornton mentioned the same thing as being a well-known fact among players that the NHL favors the Rangers and Bruins above other teams. So it's not the worst thing that could have happened to us, but it's still a convenient result for the NHL.

I wasn't a fan of how the league set up this lottery to be honest. As opposed to the usual lottery where there are numbered balls that correspond to a winner, in this case, you could actually see the logos of each team's ball as it floated around the pit. Before the button-pusher pressed the switch, you could clearly see a moment where the Leafs ball sa in the outflow tube or when the Wild one sat there or so on. And when the winning ball went flying out, you could see it was a blue and red logo as it went out. I'm not saying the supposedly impartial button-pusher was looking or had a favorite, but if he wanted to, he could definitely have tried to influence the outcome by pressing the button at a moment where he thought one team's ball was in best position to move out through the tube. It definitely didn't seem like a blinded procedure.

I also found it funny that Bettman defended the lottery by saying that the teams in the this pool were ones that didn't qualify for the first round of the playoffs and thus would be considered the equivalent of non-playoff teams and thus should be eligible to get the top pick. No mention of the fact the league referred to the play-in as the playoffs. No mention of the fact that these were in some cases top 10-15 teams in the league and have top 10-15 talent but got knocked out by a sham best-of-5 series. Inconsistent yet again from the league.

In any case, from our perspective, I'll take the fact the Pens didn't win as an equivalent sign that we wouldn't have won in their place and thus we'd likely now be looking at a #16 pick instead of a #9. Still an important drop, especially if we get knocked out in the next round, but more tolerable than knowing we could have had Lafreniere.

I liked the fact that the lottery was a 1 ball system. No trying to figure out what team won based on number combinations no behind closed doors and we say this team won so that's who won. It was live on TV no obvious chance of rigging. The league might value teams like the Rangers and Bruins but the league also knows that it cannot survive without the Leafs and Canadiens. They are the 2 biggest fan bases. 

1 hour ago, habs1952 said:

Bush league officiating by a bush league. Bush league discipline by a bush league. Bush league playoff setup by a bush league. Bush league lottery by a bush league. 

I disagree and was a little frustrated that your called the game I love Bush league! Seriously my first response was to get sarcastic. However I took a minute and read through some other posts and came back to let you know that I get why you feel this way and I know that you will continue to watch and support our team no matter how Bush league you feel the league is getting. Your well liked and are generally a great person to interact with on this site, I am really glad I took the extra time before replying.

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27 minutes ago, campabee82 said:

I liked the fact that the lottery was a 1 ball system. No trying to figure out what team won based on number combinations no behind closed doors and we say this team won so that's who won. It was live on TV no obvious chance of rigging. The league might value teams like the Rangers and Bruins but the league also knows that it cannot survive without the Leafs and Canadiens. They are the 2 biggest fan bases. 

I disagree and was a little frustrated that your called the game I love Bush league! Seriously my first response was to get sarcastic. However I took a minute and read through some other posts and came back to let you know that I get why you feel this way and I know that you will continue to watch and support our team no matter how Bush league you feel the league is getting. Your well liked and are generally a great person to interact with on this site, I am really glad I took the extra time before replying.

I would have felt more comfortable if the person "choosing/selecting" the ball were behind a curtain or something like that. 

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9 minutes ago, kinot-2 said:

I would have felt more comfortable if the person "choosing/selecting" the ball were behind a curtain or something like that. 

Agreed but at least it wasn't behind closed doors with some random numbers range and then announced that this teams combination won. I think moving forward all draft lotteries should be televised with the guy behind a curtain and all non playoff teams get the same odds.

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NHL was clearly trying to make the best of a bad situation and the seeding round at least saved them from further embarrassment. They have responded to concerns about the draft with good intentions since the Oilers started to collect first overalls like playing cards and it would appear no system is fool proof when you include chance. Remember there was les than a 3% chance to go down this rabbit hole in the first place. The Rags selection made this a little more palatable. Had the Oil, Leafs or Pens won this would not be a very calm reflection. Barring an injury or other unforeseen circumstance Lafreniere is likely a Rag but we still have a few months for some very low probability happenstance to work some more magic on this draft.

Saying anything is possible in regards  to this draft is actually fairly accurate at this time. The Leaf fans appeared to have this one, but somehow as if the ball had just come back from a 3 goal lead within the final moment of the game it fell out of the way only to see the Rag ball slide past. A super slow motion Leaf fans should interpret as a sign for years to come I hope. Ah the idea of random chance, does it really exist for Leaf fans? A physicist may tell us there is no such thing. But we all know a Leaf fan has no chance!!!

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13 hours ago, kinot-2 said:

I would have felt more comfortable if the person "choosing/selecting" the ball were behind a curtain or something like that. 

I think he should of been visible to the audience. I do think though once he started the balls he then should of turned his back to the balls and just pushed stop when told to. It probably was legit but with him able to see the balls especially with the team logos on them. Now it just looks funny or suspicious. 

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22 hours ago, campabee82 said:

 

I disagree and was a little frustrated that your called the game I love Bush league! Seriously my first response was to get sarcastic. However I took a minute and read through some other posts and came back to let you know that I get why you feel this way and I know that you will continue to watch and support our team no matter how Bush league you feel the league is getting. Your well liked and are generally a great person to interact with on this site, I am really glad I took the extra time before replying.

I appreciate the kind words Campabee but I can't help but feel the NHL is trying to outdo the WWE in gimmickry. I'll admit I'm old school but some of this stuff the league is doing is out of this world. 

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22 hours ago, campabee82 said:

I liked the fact that the lottery was a 1 ball system. No trying to figure out what team won based on number combinations no behind closed doors and we say this team won so that's who won. It was live on TV no obvious chance of rigging. The league might value teams like the Rangers and Bruins but the league also knows that it cannot survive without the Leafs and Canadiens. They are the 2 biggest fan bases.

The league can't survive without Toronto and Montreal, sure. But they also know that the fanbases there are pretty willing to support their teams no matter what happens. In LA or NYC, fans might turn to other things. There's NFL. There's college sports in the US. There's NBA which is bigger in the US and only here in Canada in Toronto. But there's no real threat to Canadian fans turning away from the NHL in big numbers unless the league as a whole is going under. There's much more competition for fans' attention in the US. And even more important than that, the fact is that fans across the US tune into watch games more often when teams from major cities like NY and Boston are in contention. It's like that in other sports too, like baseball and basketball and football. For whatever reason, there's appeal for marginal fans to follow those story lines. So tv ad revenue and so on tends to go up as well when the Rangers are legitimate. It's why it's a known fact among people in the league that having strong franchises in key cities like those helps the league and generating interest and money. Bottom line is that in the US (where the population is considerably larger than Canada and where revenue potential is thus much bigger) no one really gives two cents about whether the Habs or Leafs make the finals.

 

22 hours ago, kinot-2 said:

I would have felt more comfortable if the person "choosing/selecting" the ball were behind a curtain or something like that. 

Yeah. Was it rigged? Probably not. But the guy standing one foot away from the machine and looking at the balls where you could clearly see the logos and then hitting his switch as he stared at the balls didn't do much for the optics. In theory, he could have very easily tried to hit the switch when a ball he liked was near the opening of the tube. The replays actually showed the Leafs ball was the closest one at the time he hit it, so maybe he was actually trying to send Lafreniere to Toronto, but whether he did or did not affect anything, the set-up had the potential to make the selection unfair, either by preferentially favoring one team or else hitting the button when a team's ball was nowhere close...

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13 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

The league can't survive without Toronto and Montreal, sure. But they also know that the fanbases there are pretty willing to support their teams no matter what happens. In LA or NYC, fans might turn to other things. There's NFL. There's college sports in the US. There's NBA which is bigger in the US and only here in Canada in Toronto. But there's no real threat to Canadian fans turning away from the NHL in big numbers unless the league as a whole is going under. There's much more competition for fans' attention in the US. And even more important than that, the fact is that fans across the US tune into watch games more often when teams from major cities like NY and Boston are in contention. It's like that in other sports too, like baseball and basketball and football. For whatever reason, there's appeal for marginal fans to follow those story lines. So tv ad revenue and so on tends to go up as well when the Rangers are legitimate. It's why it's a known fact among people in the league that having strong franchises in key cities like those helps the league and generating interest and money. Bottom line is that in the US (where the population is considerably larger than Canada and where revenue potential is thus much bigger) no one really gives two cents about whether the Habs or Leafs make the finals.

 

Yeah. Was it rigged? Probably not. But the guy standing one foot away from the machine and looking at the balls where you could clearly see the logos and then hitting his switch as he stared at the balls didn't do much for the optics. In theory, he could have very easily tried to hit the switch when a ball he liked was near the opening of the tube. The replays actually showed the Leafs ball was the closest one at the time he hit it, so maybe he was actually trying to send Lafreniere to Toronto, but whether he did or did not affect anything, the set-up had the potential to make the selection unfair, either by preferentially favoring one team or else hitting the button when a team's ball was nowhere close...

Excellent point about competing with the US sports machine. Upon reflection I think we are in an excellent situation to grow our game as the NCAA continues to cancel events and leagues like the NFL come closer to making some tough choices. The NHL may benefit from a lack of other sports with our only current competition coming from the NBA. It will be interesting to look at the television ratings for the US (Canada too) in comparison to other normal playoff years. I would expect that ratings for games not involving Canadian teams to go up in Canada and the ratings for Canadian teams to be high as well, although with the Leafs getting an early exit we may not see ratings in the GTA as high as other areas of the country. We have two good western teams in Vancouver and Calgary that should be able sustain viewership for much of the post season, and having the Habs in the playoffs should get Habs' fans across Canada to get stuck to their televisions.

I am sure many other leagues like MLB will struggle to get their numbers back up over the coming years. The rule changes they have put in place (which I believe are likely to become permanent) may be an indication that they are worried about losing some of their fan base and need to adjust to meet the needs of a new fan base.

Comparatively speaking I think the NHL is in an excellent position when compared to other sports leagues when it comes to improving their fan base. With a new franchise in Seattle and opportunities for the NHL to get air time and exposure that would normally not be there it would be interesting to see the how this impacts the league going forward. I don't think I've heard Betman share any thoughts about this and perhaps we will have to wait until the start of the new season in December when we will have the ratings results before he shares any thoughts. The NHL and NBA clearly have an advantage when it comes to improving their fanbase and exposure through television viewership during these crazy times.

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I seen a close-up vid of the balls bouncing around and just milli-seconds before the rags ball went up, there was the laffs ball in place to go up.  We dodged a bullet there. 

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After the first 10 picks, it's anybody's guess. I look at the mock drafts, and see who they have the Habs pick, and it rarely ever happens.

Even if that player is available. So I just watch on draft day and google the players that they actually pick.  This way, no expectations no disappointments.

Like when they drafted Wickenheiser over Savard.  I was sooooo upset.  I think Savard was even more upset.  So I say, no expectations.

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22 hours ago, pcharnish said:

Does anyone know who couod be good around the #16 pick

 

36 minutes ago, electron58 said:

After the first 10 picks, it's anybody's guess. I look at the mock drafts, and see who they have the Habs pick, and it rarely ever happens.

Even if that player is available. So I just watch on draft day and google the players that they actually pick.  This way, no expectations no disappointments.

Like when they drafted Wickenheiser over Savard.  I was sooooo upset.  I think Savard was even more upset.  So I say, no expectations.

Yeah, its also really tough to know who will be still available at that point.  Remember that last year Cole Caufield was expected to go top 10 - maybe even top 5-7 but he was still available at 15th for us. 
 

Tons and tons of elite players are picked in the second half of the draft... unfortunately we just dont seem to have a very good track record of being a team that finds them!

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9 hours ago, habsisme said:

I think we have like 5 players on our team that we actually drafted, a team that finished 24th. This team has not drafted very well for more than a decade. Either that or its development

Kotkaniemi, Lehkonen, Mete, Price, Poehling, Romanov, Fleury, Juulsen, Gallagher, Primeau, Evans, Hudon... there are a decent number of guys on our post-season roster that we drafted, just that most of them didn't get to play or didn't get roles of any significance.  If you look at the "hit" success rate of their draft picks in the Timmins era, it's not actually that bad, meaning the same percentage of players they've drafted have made the NHL as other teams. And we've had a few stars that we've drafted in Price, Subban, Pacioretty, etc. We've found a few diamonds in the rough like Gallagher. And there's some hope for some recent picks.

The problems IMO are not so much with the guys we drafted but rather

1. We have rarely had top 5 picks, which is what many of the "successful" drafting teams have had regularly. When we did, we hit on Price, we took one of the best player in a weak draft in Galchenyuk, and the jury's out on Kotkaniemi. But hard to say teams like TB, Edm, Chi, Pit, Tor, Was have necessarily drafted better than us. They've just had top picks in years where there were stars to be had.

2. Development has been awful. We wasted how many years on Lefebvre not having a clue what he was doing and how many years on Therrien hating on young players and being an abusive coach.

3. Bergevin has zero tolerance for guys with attitude issues and a lot of younger guys take some time to mature. He's traded away a lot of guys we've drafted for other guys. And it's helped us land the likes of Suzuki, Domi, Drouin, Danault, etc. None of those are guys we drafted but they've all been here since they were relatively young. They don't get counted in our homegrown pool but they're not far off. MB has also done terribly at free agency, so he hasn't complemented our core with any big-name additions to put us into the next level.

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2 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Kotkaniemi, Lehkonen, Mete, Price, Poehling, Romanov, Fleury, Juulsen, Gallagher, Primeau, Evans, Hudon... there are a decent number of guys on our post-season roster that we drafted, just that most of them didn't get to play or didn't get roles of any significance.  If you look at the "hit" success rate of their draft picks in the Timmins era, it's not actually that bad, meaning the same percentage of players they've drafted have made the NHL as other teams. And we've had a few stars that we've drafted in Price, Subban, Pacioretty, etc. We've found a few diamonds in the rough like Gallagher. And there's some hope for some recent picks.

The problems IMO are not so much with the guys we drafted but rather

1. We have rarely had top 5 picks, which is what many of the "successful" drafting teams have had regularly. When we did, we hit on Price, we took one of the best player in a weak draft in Galchenyuk, and the jury's out on Kotkaniemi. But hard to say teams like TB, Edm, Chi, Pit, Tor, Was have necessarily drafted better than us. They've just had top picks in years where there were stars to be had.

2. Development has been awful. We wasted how many years on Lefebvre not having a clue what he was doing and how many years on Therrien hating on young players and being an abusive coach.

3. Bergevin has zero tolerance for guys with attitude issues and a lot of younger guys take some time to mature. He's traded away a lot of guys we've drafted for other guys. And it's helped us land the likes of Suzuki, Domi, Drouin, Danault, etc. None of those are guys we drafted but they've all been here since they were relatively young. They don't get counted in our homegrown pool but they're not far off. MB has also done terribly at free agency, so he hasn't complemented our core with any big-name additions to put us into the next level.

#2 & # 3, Big Time.Funny thing, when we drafted Carey Price, we didn't need him.  There were better options out there.

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