26NCounting

TRADE DEADLINE - KOVY, THOMPSON, PECA, COUSINS TRADED

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Personally I think Petry will be the first Domino to fall, he is having a great yeat on a decent contract and could easily quaterback a teams second PP unit.  The best fit... as much as I hate to say it would be Toronto or Boston

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11 minutes ago, 26NCounting said:

Personally I think Petry will be the first Domino to fall, he is having a great yeat on a decent contract and could easily quaterback a teams second PP unit.  The best fit... as much as I hate to say it would be Toronto or Boston

I think Petry is too important to move but I can see it happening to make room for younger D (we seem to have a lot that shoot right). But I think the safer play is to move Tatar at the deadline

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51 minutes ago, 26NCounting said:

Personally I think Petry will be the first Domino to fall, he is having a great yeat on a decent contract and could easily quaterback a teams second PP unit.  The best fit... as much as I hate to say it would be Toronto or Boston

Logically, I would put Petry and Tatar right up there with Weber and Price (im NOT saying id move all of them but would certainly gauge their respective values).
I dont think that MB will consider moving Weber or Price (unless one of them demands a trade). I do think he'd consider Tatar and/or Petry but not sure he'll actually pull that trigger.

I think its much more likely we move guys like Thompson, Cousins, Weal etc.  We might move Kovalchuk.    Guys who i really dont mind losing but who are very unlikely to bring us back much of anything. 
 

 

 

 

 

 

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36 minutes ago, maas_art said:


I think its much more likely we move guys like Thompson, Cousins, Weal etc.  We might move Kovalchuk.    Guys who i really dont mind losing but who are very unlikely to bring us back much of anything

 

Weal for sure. Who couldn't use a powerplay specialist??:ph34r:

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In order of who would be ideal to move:

1. Tatar - playing well this year, value is high (some think higher than when he was dealt two years ago for a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd at the deadline given that he's gotten better offensively and has fewer years left on his contract now); move him and you can give more minutes to younger guys up front.

2. Weber - value also as high as it has been since he got here. Now is the time to move him before that drops.

3. Petry - also has good value, has been relatively consistent, and is an analytics darling, so there will be GM's who love him even if some don't see his value as much. Perfect time to maximize value on return as he has 1.5 years left - other team is getting a guy for two playoff runs without committing to him long term.

4. Thompson - he's played well for us, but he's not a long-term answer and we need to create a center spot for Poehling.

5. Weal - does he even have trade value? Not sure, but we should try.

6. At least one of Kulak, Scandella, or Chiarot - would depend on who has the most value, but with Mete here as a longer-term option and rumors of Romanov arriving next year, we don't really need all three of these players. Chiarot is playing the best but maybe also has the most trade value. Scandella is a UFA so maybe most urgent to move but he also just got here and likely has little to no value right now.

7. Byron - we should move on from Byron but with his being injured, we need time to build up his trade value before we can move him. This could always happen in the off-season or next year too.

8. Kovalchuk - like Byron, doesn't have any value right now, so this would be closer to the deadline if we were looking at it.

9. Price - not sure what his market value is right now. If you get a good deal you take it and run. But this could also be better-suited to a draft day deal when teams have more cap space to absorb his contract.

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On 1/9/2020 at 4:12 PM, BigTed3 said:

In order of who would be ideal to move:

1. Tatar - playing well this year, value is high (some think higher than when he was dealt two years ago for a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd at the deadline given that he's gotten better offensively and has fewer years left on his contract now); move him and you can give more minutes to younger guys up front.

2. Weber - value also as high as it has been since he got here. Now is the time to move him before that drops.

3. Petry - also has good value, has been relatively consistent, and is an analytics darling, so there will be GM's who love him even if some don't see his value as much. Perfect time to maximize value on return as he has 1.5 years left - other team is getting a guy for two playoff runs without committing to him long term.

4. Thompson - he's played well for us, but he's not a long-term answer and we need to create a center spot for Poehling.

5. Weal - does he even have trade value? Not sure, but we should try.

6. At least one of Kulak, Scandella, or Chiarot - would depend on who has the most value, but with Mete here as a longer-term option and rumors of Romanov arriving next year, we don't really need all three of these players. Chiarot is playing the best but maybe also has the most trade value. Scandella is a UFA so maybe most urgent to move but he also just got here and likely has little to no value right now.

7. Byron - we should move on from Byron but with his being injured, we need time to build up his trade value before we can move him. This could always happen in the off-season or next year too.

8. Kovalchuk - like Byron, doesn't have any value right now, so this would be closer to the deadline if we were looking at it.

9. Price - not sure what his market value is right now. If you get a good deal you take it and run. But this could also be better-suited to a draft day deal when teams have more cap space to absorb his contract.

I agree with most of this Webber of course will not be moving unless there is a new GM.

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Brian Wilde, who is also an Oilers fan in addition to covering the Habs, tweets that he thinks the Oilers are one good RHD away from being a contender this year... we have two veterans who could fit the bill for them, albeit Petry was already there under a different management. Would have to believe Weber is a more intriguing option here, and the Oilers certainly have the pieces to make a deal work. The key piece coming back would absolutely have to be Evan Bouchard (we would need RHD for the near future, with most of our best D prospects being lefties), and I think you could also ask for their 1st rounder as well. I also think we'd need to eat Kris Russell as a salary dump. And maybe we throw in Kovalchuk as a scoring winger to increase the return in addition to the salary dump. But I could see something along the lines of

Edm receives:

Shea Weber (Mtl retains 2M in salary)

Ilya Kovalchuk

3rd round pick 2020

 

Mtl receives:

Evan Bouchard

Raphael Lavoie

Jesse Puljujarvi

Kris Russell

1st round pick 2020

 

 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Brian Wilde, who is also an Oilers fan in addition to covering the Habs, tweets that he thinks the Oilers are one good RHD away from being a contender this year... we have two veterans who could fit the bill for them, albeit Petry was already there under a different management. Would have to believe Weber is a more intriguing option here, and the Oilers certainly have the pieces to make a deal work. The key piece coming back would absolutely have to be Evan Bouchard (we would need RHD for the near future, with most of our best D prospects being lefties), and I think you could also ask for their 1st rounder as well. I also think we'd need to eat Kris Russell as a salary dump. And maybe we throw in Kovalchuk as a scoring winger to increase the return in addition to the salary dump. But I could see something along the lines of

Edm receives:

Shea Weber (Mtl retains 2M in salary)

Ilya Kovalchuk

3rd round pick 2020

 

Mtl receives:

Evan Bouchard

Raphael Lavoie

Jesse Puljujarvi

Kris Russell

1st round pick 2020

 

 

 

 

Sure ... if thats what the Oilers offered.     But ... I live in Edmonton and have some knoweldge of the team.   There's zero chance they give up Bouchard/Lavoie AND another 1st round pick.    I don't think they even consider giving up Bouchard.

At best it would be :

Edm receives:

Shea Weber (Mtl retains 2M in salary)

Ilya Kovalchuk

3rd round pick 2020

Mtl receives:

Jesse Puljujarvi

Kris Russell

1st round pick 2020

2nd round pick 2020

 

 

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31 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:

Sure ... if thats what the Oilers offered.     But ... I live in Edmonton and have some knoweldge of the team.   There's zero chance they give up Bouchard/Lavoie AND another 1st round pick.    I don't think they even consider giving up Bouchard.

At best it would be :

Edm receives:

Shea Weber (Mtl retains 2M in salary)

Ilya Kovalchuk

3rd round pick 2020

Mtl receives:

Jesse Puljujarvi

Kris Russell

1st round pick 2020

2nd round pick 2020

 

 

Which I wouldn't do... I would only trade Kovalchuk if he played well enough to himself garner a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th round pick. He's a cheap throw-in to provide a scoring winger for McDavid or Draisaitl or RNH. Russell is a negative asset that we'd be taking on only as a favor to Edmonton, and we'd also be offering to retain some salary on Weber. All of those factors mean the return has to be better than what you would get for Weber alone.

If I were trading Weber alone, it would be for a top D prospect or young NHL defenceman (preferably a righty) as well as a 1st rounder. I think that's reasonable market-value for a top-pairing D man. So if we say Kovalchuk is maybe worth a mid-round pick, it means that we'd be giving up Weber AND a 3rd rounder AND taking Russell as a dump AND retaining salary on Weber for a 1st and Puljujarvi (who has no future in Edm and may not even come back to the NHL). That's not a feasible trade for the Canadiens, and if that's all your getting, you're better off keeping Weber or looking at another team to trade with. IMO, if Edmonton wants to make a trade, it's a non-starter if it's anything other than a 1st rounder and one of Bouchard or Broberg (and if it's Broberg, the rest of the package has to be better). I fully get your point of view that Edmonton may have no interest in dealing Bouchard, but if I'm the Habs, I have no interest in the trade unless I'm getting a potential future top pairing young D man back. If you want to remove the baggage of Kovalchuk from the trade, I'd still at a minimum be asking for

 

Weber and a 3rd for Bouchard, 1st, and Puljujarvi

or

Weber and a 3rd for Broberg, 1st, and Lavoie

 

(in addition to taking on Russell as a salary dump and retaining some salary on Weber).

 

 

 

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Re: Edmonton trade - they only have $1m of cap room, Kris Russell has a NT NMC list - I doubt he waives that to come to the Habs 

 

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15 minutes ago, claremont said:

Re: Edmonton trade - they only have $1m of cap room, Kris Russell has a NT NMC list - I doubt he waives that to come to the Habs 

 

It's a partial NTC, so he has to submit a list of teams he accepts a trade to... depends on the stipulations in his contract as to when he has to do this (at start of the year, on demand, etc.)... if not Russell, Habs could offer to retain up to 50% of Weber's salary or take on someone else (Gagner?) instead too...

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1 minute ago, BigTed3 said:

It's a partial NTC, so he has to submit a list of teams he accepts a trade to... depends on the stipulations in his contract as to when he has to do this (at start of the year, on demand, etc.)... if not Russell, Habs could offer to retain up to 50% of Weber's salary or take on someone else (Gagner?) instead too...

I realize hockey is a business but it’s a bit of a slap in the Morality/team spirit face for a contending team to trade some key roster players that got you in contention in the first place for rentals. Most teams trade picks and prospects for rentals or 1 1/2 year contracts. 
As stated in another thread - Colorado has a lot of cap room and I believe they would be the primary target for big moves like Weber, Petry, Danualt, Tatar or even Price 

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If we can find a buyer for..

Petry for a 1st 2020, 2nd 2021

Tatar for a 1st 2020, 2nd 2021

and Kovalchuk for a 2nd (2020 or 2021)

If we can pull that off we are set. No need to blow it up any further than that. The last two drafts have been pretty solid already. Follow them up with three 1st’s and three 2nd’s this year, and at least one 1st and three 2nd’s in 2021, while maintaining the majority of our core. That’s a pretty good recipe for a “rebuild on the fly”. All we have to do from there is use those picks to draft well.... it could happen...

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1 hour ago, claremont said:

I realize hockey is a business but it’s a bit of a slap in the Morality/team spirit face for a contending team to trade some key roster players that got you in contention in the first place for rentals. Most teams trade picks and prospects for rentals or 1 1/2 year contracts. 
As stated in another thread - Colorado has a lot of cap room and I believe they would be the primary target for big moves like Weber, Petry, Danualt, Tatar or even Price 

Sure, but if a team needs cap space, they will do what they have to do, and Russell is awful. I think Edmonton would gladly upgrade from Russell to Weber, and I'm by no means forcing them to do this, I think it's more in their interest to be able to dump a D man contract rather than giving up a piece they actually benefit from keeping.

I also don't think we're in a position where we are forced to trade anyone key. Petry and Tatar have another year on their contracts, Weber is signed long-term, as is Price. And we're not stuck having to trade with one specific team, I was just throwing out a potential offer we could make to Edmonton based on Brian Wilde's thoughts as an Edmonton fan that the Oilers were one key RHD away from contending. I'd agree with you that Colorado is absolutely another team you look into, and if we go that route dealing them either Weber or Price, then Byram is the piece you don't back down from that needs to be included.

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I feel like the following players are realistic candidates to be moved before the deadline:

  • Nate Thompson
  • Ilya Kovalchuk
  • Jeff Petry
  • Marco Scandella

I can't really see players like Weber or Price being moved. Nor do I see any teams looking to acquire Nick Cousins or Jordan Weal types. Thompson might be the only bottom-six player we have that might garner some interest.

I'd hang onto Kovalchuk for as long as possible. I think he's got a real chance of continuing to boost his value over the next month.

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35 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

I feel like the following players are realistic candidates to be moved before the deadline:

  • Nate Thompson
  • Ilya Kovalchuk
  • Jeff Petry
  • Marco Scandella

I can't really see players like Weber or Price being moved. Nor do I see any teams looking to acquire Nick Cousins or Jordan Weal types. Thompson might be the only bottom-six player we have that might garner some interest.

I'd hang onto Kovalchuk for as long as possible. I think he's got a real chance of continuing to boost his value over the next month.

Agree with all of this. I dont think its in our best interest (there are several veterans who would make more sense to move) but i think you're right on the money as to what likely will happen.

Having said that, I do wonder if MB has at least considered moving Price or Weber.  With tons of articles now by respected Montreal Journalists suggesting this very thing you have to wonder if he's starting to realize this could be his best option.

He says and does all the right things when it comes to prospects, surely he can see that by the time JK, Suzuki, Poehling, Brook, Romanov etc etc are firing on all cylinders Price and Weber will be a few years older...


A few reporters in the states have suggested that Carolina make a big push for Price.  Not sure what we could get in return but they have a bunch of young players who could be very interesting... 

Edmonton + Weber would be a match made in heaven. 

Could one of those teams bite? I think so. Will MB?  Not so sure. 

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19 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Agree with all of this. I dont think its in our best interest (there are several veterans who would make more sense to move) but i think you're right on the money as to what likely will happen.

Having said that, I do wonder if MB has at least considered moving Price or Weber.  With tons of articles now by respected Montreal Journalists suggesting this very thing you have to wonder if he's starting to realize this could be his best option.

He says and does all the right things when it comes to prospects, surely he can see that by the time JK, Suzuki, Poehling, Brook, Romanov etc etc are firing on all cylinders Price and Weber will be a few years older...


A few reporters in the states have suggested that Carolina make a big push for Price.  Not sure what we could get in return but they have a bunch of young players who could be very interesting... 

Edmonton + Weber would be a match made in heaven. 

Could one of those teams bite? I think so. Will MB?  Not so sure. 

Yeah I saw a report on TSN this morning suggesting Price to Carolina. You would think if that was the case then the return would have to be something significant as they are in the same conference and the whole Aho situation. I am thinking something like.

Price + 2nd 2020

Slavin + Merazyk + Suzuki + 1st 2020

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17 minutes ago, maas_art said:

A few reporters in the states have suggested that Carolina make a big push for Price.  Not sure what we could get in return but they have a bunch of young players who could be very interesting... 

Edmonton + Weber would be a match made in heaven. 

Could one of those teams bite? I think so. Will MB?  Not so sure. 

Doubt Carolina trades with us for a long time given the Aho offer sheet ... but lets pretend they do ....

Ryan Suzuki + picks for Price

And lets supposed Oilers go "win now" and decide Bouchard is available

Bouchard + picks for Weber

Lets presume we get a 1st rounder in both trades ... 

That gives us back 2 guys who were drafted in the first round ... Nick's brother and a top D prospect ... and three 1st round picks this draft.   I'd possibly go for that, especially if I can also turn Tatar, Kovalchuk, Petry into another 1st round and 2nd round picks or other top prospects.   Lets say for those three we get another 1st and 2nd

That's four first round picks and 3 2nd round picks this year.

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6 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:

Doubt Carolina trades with us for a long time given the Aho offer sheet ... but lets pretend they do ....

Ryan Suzuki + picks for Price

And lets supposed Oilers go "win now" and decide Bouchard is available

Bouchard + picks for Weber

Lets presume we get a 1st rounder in both trades ... 

That gives us back 2 guys who were drafted in the first round ... Nick's brother and a top D prospect ... and three 1st round picks this draft.   I'd possibly go for that, especially if I can also turn Tatar, Kovalchuk, Petry into another 1st round and 2nd round picks or other top prospects.   Lets say for those three we get another 1st and 2nd

That's four first round picks and 3 2nd round picks this year.

Neither Edmonton or Carolina can go this route they would both need to shed salary so that's why I had Slavin and Merazyk from Carolina.

If Edmonton takes Weber then we likely get something like

 Bouchard + Russel + Granlund + 1st 2020

for

Weber

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2 minutes ago, campabee82 said:

Neither Edmonton or Carolina can go this route they would both need to shed salary so that's why I had Slavin and Merazyk from Carolina.

If Edmonton takes Weber then we likely get something like

 Bouchard + Russel + Granlund + 1st 2020

for

Weber

Yeah, I meant to write "+ picks/parts" that would facilitate the salary caps

For Carolina it would be

Price + 3rd for

1st, Suzuki, Merazyk, Trevor Van Riemsdyk

That frees up 6m for the Canes and they have 5.5m at deadline ..  we could also take Haula or Williams off them to free up more cap.

Edited by HabsAlways
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1 minute ago, HabsAlways said:

Yeah, I meant to write "+ picks/parts" that would facilitate the salary caps

 

LOL I see but I like both trade options IF we have to move Price and Weber. It makes our rebuild go way quicker

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1 minute ago, campabee82 said:

LOL I see but I like both trade options IF we have to move Price and Weber. It makes our rebuild go way quicker

For Carolina it would be

Price + 3rd for

1st, Suzuki, Merazyk, Trevor Van Riemsdyk

That frees up 6m for the Canes and they have 5.5m at deadline ..  we could also take Haula or Williams off them to free up more cap.

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In theory, for Price, Weber, Tatar, Petry and Kovalshuk we should be able to get

3 First round picks (4 with our own)

1-2 2nd round picks (+2 of our own)

2 good prospects (Suzuki and Bouchard)

and spare parts that are going to be UFA this summer (Van Riemsdyk, Williams, Hausa)

If we got Granlund and Russell ... wonder if we could fit Sam Gagner's 3m to entice Oilers

Edited by HabsAlways
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I really do think these next 4 games before the AS break will deteremine MB's moves ... if we get 5 or more pts we're buyers leading up to the deadline.   If we get 4 or less, we're sellers.

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2 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:

I really do think these next 4 games before the AS break will deteremine MB's moves ... if we get 5 or more pts we're buyers leading up to the deadline.   If we get 4 or less, we're sellers.

Would like to be buyers but if we are getting a decent enough return I could also live with being sellers

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