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2021-22 State of the Habs


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5 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:

Its  a Vaccination and there is no legimate good excuse to not have gotten it yet, period.   You are free to choose not to get it but that choice, like any choice in life, comes with consequences and benefits.

If Ylonen is showing himself to be a science denying antivaxxer then yes, trade him.   Its time we stopped tolerating people who want to ignore facts and try and twist it into a "difference of opinion".    It's not an opinion if its demonstrably wrong.  Period.

The type of person who won't get a vaccine, I suspect is not the type of person you want as your coworker. At the bare minimum there's and intelligence problem.

 

58 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Wouldnt be surprised at all if MB considered it.  Im not sure how that would affect his trade value to be honest.   I suppose if he went to a US based team he would be more valuable since he could probably play up to 60-70 games.  On any canadian team he's going to miss at least 30+ games because of the border restrictions/quarantine time.


Im not really sure if he has much value tbh. He's a good prospect but i doubt if he's on many teams' radars.   That said, maybe Ylonen + Chiarot would bring back a PMD.  Who knows. While i dont agree with his decision, It would be a shame to lose him for nothing or a low value return. 

Yeah i agree probably doesn't have to much value. But I wouldn't have invited him to camp

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1 hour ago, campabee82 said:

Seriously! Do we even know why he isn't vaccinated yet? Or are you just saying that everyone should be vaccinated no matter what even if it means the government can come in and hold you down and vaccinate you against your will? What happened to our rights and freedoms? The way you are talking makes you sound no better than the EDIT (in this case they are against mass vaccinations so lets trade them). Come on people, lets slow the role and maybe wait until we find out what the circumstances are behind his decision.  

There really aren't any reasons not to get the vaccine. I've yet to hear a good reason for anybody. I can forgive being a bit gun shy at first but there's no excuse anymore

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7 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:

Its  a Vaccination and there is no legitimate good excuse to not have gotten it yet, period.   You are free to choose not to get it but that choice, like any choice in life, comes with consequences and benefits.

If Ylonen is showing himself to be a science denying antivaxxer then yes, trade him.   Its time we stopped tolerating people who want to ignore facts and try and twist it into a "difference of opinion".    It's not an opinion if its demonstrably wrong.  Period.

If it's just a political stand then i agree. If it's fear, then go do the research. If it was a medical reason, then you would think the Club would have stipulated that.

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4 minutes ago, H_T_L said:

If it's just a political stand then i agree. If it's fear, then go do the research. If it was a medical reason, then you would think the Club would have stipulated that.

The only valid reason would be medical ...and that reason is rare to almost non-existant.      

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We're 18 months into a pandemic, a year since the Vaccine rolled out ... millions of doses world wide ... so Vaccine hesitancy isn't a legitimate excuse anymore.   If you're failing to get vaccinated its a willful choice to be disingenuously ignorant in the face of overwhelming proof that it is safe, effective and needed.    Not to mention the right thing to do.

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14 minutes ago, habsisme said:

Yeah i agree probably doesn't have to much value. But I wouldn't have invited him to camp

Considering how Covid affected this team last year Im surprised too, but perhaps they feel like their best chance to educate him is to do so in person.  Maybe they are hoping they can convince him to get vaxxed. 

 

7 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:

The only valid reason would be medical ...and that reason is rare to almost non-existant.      

Yeah and more and more true experts - not just people on the interweeb - are saying there's virtually no reason that is valid.  If you suffered a severe reaction to the first shot like Anaphylaxis then yes, you have a valid reason but for all those who say "well i have this disorder or this disease" -  every association and medical group representing those illnesses and predispositions have said the vaccine side effects are far less risky than the risks of contracting covid and suffering through it AND your disease 

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4 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:

We're 18 months into a pandemic, a year since the Vaccine rolled out ... millions of doses world wide ... so Vaccine hesitancy isn't a legitimate excuse anymore.   If you're failing to get vaccinated its a willful choice to be disingenuously ignorant in the face of overwhelming proof that it is safe, effective and needed.    Not to mention the right thing to do.

2.5 billion actually. 

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6 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:

Yeah didn't bother to look it up ... guessed it was in the 100s of millions at the least

For sure. And i mean there's dozens of different vaccine manufacturers, so not all 2.5b of those are the same ones -  although there are only 4 basic "types": whole virus protein subunit viral vector and nucleic acid (rna and dna)

Even breaking them down, thats 10s - even hundreds - of millions of each type in arms of people for nearly a year.   Most clinical trials are done on thousands of patients, not hundreds of millions.  

I can understand vaccine hesitancy in the early months but now?   

 

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Just now, maas_art said:

For sure. And i mean there's dozens of different vaccine manufacturers, so not all 2.5b of those are the same ones -  although there are only 4 basic "types": whole virus protein subunit viral vector and nucleic acid (rna and dna)

Even breaking them down, thats 10s - even hundreds - of millions of each type in arms of people for nearly a year.   Most clinical trials are done on thousands of patients, not hundreds of millions.  

I can understand vaccine hesitancy in the early months but now?   

 

Exactly.   The wife and I were discussing it on the eve of the election ... and at this point if you're unvaccinated without a valid medical reason (and I'm hard pressed to find info on what that valid reason would be) then it's just selfish willful ignorance

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Wow what a bunch of dictatorship views there are above! Get the vaccine or be excluded from society, seriously Hitler types of statements. Everyone has a right to their own views and opinions but to say that the unvaccinated are ignorant, selfish or unintelligent is ridiculous antisemitism at its finest. Let's just throw the constitution out the window and pass all over it. 

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time to change topic

 

https://www.prohockeyrumors.com/2021/09/poll-are-the-montreal-canadiens-a-playoff-team-in-2021-22.html

Poll: Are The Montreal Canadiens A Playoff Team In 2021-22?

After making it all the way to the 2021 Stanley Cup Final, losing in five games to the Tampa Bay Lightning, the Montreal Canadiens have had one of the most interesting offseasons of any team. That much roster turnover is unusual for a team that made it that far in the playoffs, but a decent portion of it has been out of their control.

A good portion of Montreal’s starting 12 forwards will look different next season. Gone down the middle are Phillip DanaultJesperi Kotkaniemi, and Eric Staal. Dvorak will attempt to replace Danault’s shutdown role with a little more offensive touch but less defensive prowess. Kotkaniemi’s third-line role is likely to be replaced by another young center, most probably Jake Evans. Staal’s fourth-line role will likely be comprised of a more defensive-minded pivot in Cedric Paquette. Their group of wingers will look different too, losing out on Tomas Tatar’s two-way play in favor of a power-play specialist in Mike Hoffman. Gone is veteran Corey Perry in the bottom six, being replaced by another veteran presence in Mathieu Perreault.

The team’s defense faces the loss of the team’s captain in Shea Weber. His injury will keep him out for at least this entire season and puts the rest of his career in jeopardy. His absence will be replaced by committee, as youngster Alexander Romanov and new addition David Savard should see more minutes. The left side stays relatively constant from last season, and overseas addition Chris Wideman could challenge for some games as well.

A tandem of Carey Price and Jake Allen returns after a successful regular season campaign.

However, a team that barely squeaked into the playoffs last season returns with some question marks. Full seasons of Jonathan Drouin and Cole Caufield help boost the team, but downgrades from Danault to Dvorak and Tatar to Hoffman raise near-negating doubts. The success of youngsters like Evans and Romanov will be crucial if Montreal wants to make a return to the playoffs in 2022, and they’ll need repeat performances from players such as Jeff Petry and Josh Anderson.

So the question to you, PHR readers, is this: has Montreal done enough this offseason to yield a playoff team in an increasingly competitive Eastern Conference? Make your voice heard below:

Do The Montreal Canadiens Make The Playoffs In 2022?

 

I say " No "

 

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19 minutes ago, Regis22 said:

time to change topic

 

https://www.prohockeyrumors.com/2021/09/poll-are-the-montreal-canadiens-a-playoff-team-in-2021-22.html

Poll: Are The Montreal Canadiens A Playoff Team In 2021-22?

After making it all the way to the 2021 Stanley Cup Final, losing in five games to the Tampa Bay Lightning, the Montreal Canadiens have had one of the most interesting offseasons of any team. That much roster turnover is unusual for a team that made it that far in the playoffs, but a decent portion of it has been out of their control.

A good portion of Montreal’s starting 12 forwards will look different next season. Gone down the middle are Phillip DanaultJesperi Kotkaniemi, and Eric Staal. Dvorak will attempt to replace Danault’s shutdown role with a little more offensive touch but less defensive prowess. Kotkaniemi’s third-line role is likely to be replaced by another young center, most probably Jake Evans. Staal’s fourth-line role will likely be comprised of a more defensive-minded pivot in Cedric Paquette. Their group of wingers will look different too, losing out on Tomas Tatar’s two-way play in favor of a power-play specialist in Mike Hoffman. Gone is veteran Corey Perry in the bottom six, being replaced by another veteran presence in Mathieu Perreault.

The team’s defense faces the loss of the team’s captain in Shea Weber. His injury will keep him out for at least this entire season and puts the rest of his career in jeopardy. His absence will be replaced by committee, as youngster Alexander Romanov and new addition David Savard should see more minutes. The left side stays relatively constant from last season, and overseas addition Chris Wideman could challenge for some games as well.

A tandem of Carey Price and Jake Allen returns after a successful regular season campaign.

However, a team that barely squeaked into the playoffs last season returns with some question marks. Full seasons of Jonathan Drouin and Cole Caufield help boost the team, but downgrades from Danault to Dvorak and Tatar to Hoffman raise near-negating doubts. The success of youngsters like Evans and Romanov will be crucial if Montreal wants to make a return to the playoffs in 2022, and they’ll need repeat performances from players such as Jeff Petry and Josh Anderson.

So the question to you, PHR readers, is this: has Montreal done enough this offseason to yield a playoff team in an increasingly competitive Eastern Conference? Make your voice heard below:

Do The Montreal Canadiens Make The Playoffs In 2022?

 

I say " No "

 

Good Call. I like to start out being optimistic.  I still believe,  we really,  really,  really  NEED a PMD.  I  don't think it's fair,  hoping that it is Norlinder. If the Habs are coached with blind trust in the vets, instead of development,  I won't be happy. I think this team WILL  score goals, I'm just not convinced,  that we will get it out of our end. So, unless we get a PMD, I think that we will be very, very,  very,  lucky to make the playoffs. 

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1 hour ago, campabee82 said:

Wow what a bunch of dictatorship views there are above! Get the vaccine or be excluded from society, seriously Hitler types of statements. Everyone has a right to their own views and opinions but to say that the unvaccinated are ignorant, selfish or unintelligent is ridiculous antisemitism at its finest. Let's just throw the constitution out the window and pass all over it. 

So this is a hockey forum not really a place to have this argument but to play in the NHL is not a right it is a privilege. The player has the right to not get vaxed the team has the right not to play him.

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59 minutes ago, Regis22 said:

time to change topic

 

https://www.prohockeyrumors.com/2021/09/poll-are-the-montreal-canadiens-a-playoff-team-in-2021-22.html

Poll: Are The Montreal Canadiens A Playoff Team In 2021-22?

After making it all the way to the 2021 Stanley Cup Final, losing in five games to the Tampa Bay Lightning, the Montreal Canadiens have had one of the most interesting offseasons of any team. That much roster turnover is unusual for a team that made it that far in the playoffs, but a decent portion of it has been out of their control.

A good portion of Montreal’s starting 12 forwards will look different next season. Gone down the middle are Phillip DanaultJesperi Kotkaniemi, and Eric Staal. Dvorak will attempt to replace Danault’s shutdown role with a little more offensive touch but less defensive prowess. Kotkaniemi’s third-line role is likely to be replaced by another young center, most probably Jake Evans. Staal’s fourth-line role will likely be comprised of a more defensive-minded pivot in Cedric Paquette. Their group of wingers will look different too, losing out on Tomas Tatar’s two-way play in favor of a power-play specialist in Mike Hoffman. Gone is veteran Corey Perry in the bottom six, being replaced by another veteran presence in Mathieu Perreault.

The team’s defense faces the loss of the team’s captain in Shea Weber. His injury will keep him out for at least this entire season and puts the rest of his career in jeopardy. His absence will be replaced by committee, as youngster Alexander Romanov and new addition David Savard should see more minutes. The left side stays relatively constant from last season, and overseas addition Chris Wideman could challenge for some games as well.

A tandem of Carey Price and Jake Allen returns after a successful regular season campaign.

However, a team that barely squeaked into the playoffs last season returns with some question marks. Full seasons of Jonathan Drouin and Cole Caufield help boost the team, but downgrades from Danault to Dvorak and Tatar to Hoffman raise near-negating doubts. The success of youngsters like Evans and Romanov will be crucial if Montreal wants to make a return to the playoffs in 2022, and they’ll need repeat performances from players such as Jeff Petry and Josh Anderson.

So the question to you, PHR readers, is this: has Montreal done enough this offseason to yield a playoff team in an increasingly competitive Eastern Conference? Make your voice heard below:

Do The Montreal Canadiens Make The Playoffs In 2022?

 

I say " No "

 

I say yes.  I think this team will be better than many think. 

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16 minutes ago, ramcharger440 said:

So this is a hockey forum not really a place to have this argument but to play in the NHL is not a right it is a privilege. The player has the right to not get vaxed the team has the right not to play him.

I wasn't the one who started the debate just responding to it. Maybe you should tell the ones who started the debate the same thing.

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1 hour ago, campabee82 said:

Wow what a bunch of dictatorship views there are above! Get the vaccine or be excluded from society, seriously Hitler types of statements. Everyone has a right to their own views and opinions but to say that the unvaccinated are ignorant, selfish or unintelligent is ridiculous antisemitism at its finest. Let's just throw the constitution out the window and pass all over it. 

Can we please refrain from the Hitler and Nazi analogies when referring to members? I'm sure it wasn't your intention but those are offensive comparisons. 

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Just now, H_T_L said:

Can we please refrain from the Hitler and Nazi analogies when referring to members? I'm sure it wasn't your intention but those are offensive comparisons. 

So is saying that people are ignorant and unintelligent because they have a different view on a subject than you do. (not you specifically just you as in a general person)

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4 minutes ago, campabee82 said:

So is saying that people are ignorant and unintelligent because they have a different view on a subject than you do. (not you specifically just you as in a general person)

I didn't see any direct posts from members quoting you, that would lead me to believe someone was calling you out as being ignorant or unintelligent. They were generalizations of anti vaxers as far as i can see. Please PM me otherwise, as i would like this discussion to come to an end before it escalates.

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2 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Ylonen has decided to get the vaccine after all and should get first dose today. Sounds like they told him he wouldn't be allowed to stay at camp without it... good for the Habs.

Good for him. His logic for not getting it was likely flawed and i would assume the Habs educated him and put his mind at ease. 

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5 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Ylonen has decided to get the vaccine after all and should get first dose today. Sounds like they told him he wouldn't be allowed to stay at camp without it... good for the Habs.

Sounds like good decisions by both Ylonen and the Habs.

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16 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Ylonen has decided to get the vaccine after all and should get first dose today. Sounds like they told him he wouldn't be allowed to stay at camp without it... good for the Habs.

Kind of figured (or at least hoped!) it would go that way.  A little education goes a long way - I assume he was allowed to give them his concerns and they could explain the risks (and potential career risks) of not getting the jab.  

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3 hours ago, Regis22 said:

time to change topic

https://www.prohockeyrumors.com/2021/09/poll-are-the-montreal-canadiens-a-playoff-team-in-2021-22.html

Poll: Are The Montreal Canadiens A Playoff Team In 2021-22?

After making it all the way to the 2021 Stanley Cup Final, losing in five games to the Tampa Bay Lightning, the Montreal Canadiens have had one of the most interesting offseasons of any team. That much roster turnover is unusual for a team that made it that far in the playoffs, but a decent portion of it has been out of their control.

A good portion of Montreal’s starting 12 forwards will look different next season. Gone down the middle are Phillip DanaultJesperi Kotkaniemi, and Eric Staal. Dvorak will attempt to replace Danault’s shutdown role with a little more offensive touch but less defensive prowess. Kotkaniemi’s third-line role is likely to be replaced by another young center, most probably Jake Evans. Staal’s fourth-line role will likely be comprised of a more defensive-minded pivot in Cedric Paquette. Their group of wingers will look different too, losing out on Tomas Tatar’s two-way play in favor of a power-play specialist in Mike Hoffman. Gone is veteran Corey Perry in the bottom six, being replaced by another veteran presence in Mathieu Perreault.

The team’s defense faces the loss of the team’s captain in Shea Weber. His injury will keep him out for at least this entire season and puts the rest of his career in jeopardy. His absence will be replaced by committee, as youngster Alexander Romanov and new addition David Savard should see more minutes. The left side stays relatively constant from last season, and overseas addition Chris Wideman could challenge for some games as well.

A tandem of Carey Price and Jake Allen returns after a successful regular season campaign.

However, a team that barely squeaked into the playoffs last season returns with some question marks. Full seasons of Jonathan Drouin and Cole Caufield help boost the team, but downgrades from Danault to Dvorak and Tatar to Hoffman raise near-negating doubts. The success of youngsters like Evans and Romanov will be crucial if Montreal wants to make a return to the playoffs in 2022, and they’ll need repeat performances from players such as Jeff Petry and Josh Anderson.

So the question to you, PHR readers, is this: has Montreal done enough this offseason to yield a playoff team in an increasingly competitive Eastern Conference? Make your voice heard below:

Do The Montreal Canadiens Make The Playoffs In 2022?

I say " No "

As a fan but also as a realist, I remain optimistic that the Habs will make the playoffs. I have to believe that Ducharme and his communication style and systems will be better than the Julien experience. Turning Caufield and Romanov loose along with Drouin should be positives. There’s many ifs but I expect us to make it. 

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