Jump to content
The Official Site of the Montréal Canadiens
Canadiens de Montreal

Rumours


kinot-2
 Share

Recommended Posts

3 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

I just feel like Bergevin isn't going to be able to resolve the LD problem this season. It'll be Weber, Petry, Kulak, Reilly, Juulsen, Folin, and Mete. And we'll have to make do with that. Unfortunate.

Yes but signing Duchene to a long term big contract creates problems 2-3 years from now when guys like JK, Poehling, Suzuki and anybody else are coming off their ELCs.    Signing Duchene means you have 3 guys in their 30's on 10m+ contracts who are all declining.

If we're signing a UFA it should be for the hole we have, not at the expense of our future.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

49 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:

And this is how you screw up in the off season.    Our burning need is not a C ... we've addressed that through Domi, Danault and our prospect pool (JK, Poehling, Suzuki). 

Our burning need is not a forward either.

We need a LD ... and signing Duchene means we'll be giving up prospects to get a LD most likely, which will once again set us back years.

1. It still works though IF MB signs Duchene and then is able to trade another forward for a top-pairing LHD. Big IF, however.

2. I think MB has been turned down by so many big name free agents and didn't even get an interview with Tavares last year... I wonder how much of this is based on Bergevin's pride that maybe he can finally land a big fish and a player he likes, given he's tried to trade for him twice already.

3. We also have to keep in mind that we don't know how secure Bergevin's job is. He's missed the playoffs two consecutive years and 3 of the last 4, and that's one of the longest stretches of futility in Habs' history. He's told us he doesn't want to sacrifice prospects for big-name players who can't help long-term, but he might be completely fine with sacrificing cap space and years down the line when he may not be here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

54 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

1. It still works though IF MB signs Duchene and then is able to trade another forward for a top-pairing LHD. Big IF, however.

2. I think MB has been turned down by so many big name free agents and didn't even get an interview with Tavares last year... I wonder how much of this is based on Bergevin's pride that maybe he can finally land a big fish and a player he likes, given he's tried to trade for him twice already.

3. We also have to keep in mind that we don't know how secure Bergevin's job is. He's missed the playoffs two consecutive years and 3 of the last 4, and that's one of the longest stretches of futility in Habs' history. He's told us he doesn't want to sacrifice prospects for big-name players who can't help long-term, but he might be completely fine with sacrificing cap space and years down the line when he may not be here.

Good points. 

1. If we sign Duchene you have to think someone is getting dealt. There's just too many players that need good ice time.  And with the report they are still grooming Suzuki as a centre?  Thats a lot of pivots.

2. Yes, this is worrisome.  

3. I was also thinking about this.  Long term deals usually start hurting the team after a GM is gone.  I think most people would agree that adding Duchene to this roster can only make us better (he'd easily be one of the top 3 forwards on the team so no matter where he plays he's not bumping someone down the lineup who is better than him) but for how long? and at what point does the cap hit hurt us more than his skill helps us? Not this year or probably next but the following?  And will MB still be here?    Lots of questions for sure.

I honestly would be fine signing duchene for like 4 years but I am assuming he wants a 7 year deal and that is a big concern to me.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Good points. 

1. If we sign Duchene you have to think someone is getting dealt. There's just too many players that need good ice time.  And with the report they are still grooming Suzuki as a centre?  Thats a lot of pivots.

2. Yes, this is worrisome.  

3. I was also thinking about this.  Long term deals usually start hurting the team after a GM is gone.  I think most people would agree that adding Duchene to this roster can only make us better (he'd easily be one of the top 3 forwards on the team so no matter where he plays he's not bumping someone down the lineup who is better than him) but for how long? and at what point does the cap hit hurt us more than his skill helps us? Not this year or probably next but the following?  And will MB still be here?    Lots of questions for sure.

I honestly would be fine signing duchene for like 4 years but I am assuming he wants a 7 year deal and that is a big concern to me.  

IMHO signing Duchene is not really that big of deal even at 9-9.5 Mil for 7 years. Lets look at it from another angle, next year I would be surprised if Peca, Deslauriers, Weise, Thompson and Folin get another contract that right there saves you 6.4 Mil plus Mason's contract is off the books that's almost  enough to upgrade Domi and Mete. The following year we probably won't have Petry or resign Weal and can move any other number of fringe contracts like Drouin, Shaw, Lehkonen, Armia, Danault, Byron, Tatar, Reilly and Kulak to easily make up what you need to resign the rest of the core. After that Weber and Price will be considering retirement or have like 3 years left on their contracts. Maybe I am an optimist but I feel like adding Duchene is a yes every time. I know there is concern about his compete or if he plays just for himself but you also have to consider this is 1. HIS JOB! and 2. It may be different for him to play for his boyhood team.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, campabee82 said:

IMHO signing Duchene is not really that big of deal even at 9-9.5 Mil for 7 years. Lets look at it from another angle, next year I would be surprised if Peca, Deslauriers, Weise, Thompson and Folin get another contract that right there saves you 6.4 Mil plus Mason's contract is off the books that's almost  enough to upgrade Domi and Mete. The following year we probably won't have Petry or resign Weal and can move any other number of fringe contracts like Drouin, Shaw, Lehkonen, Armia, Danault, Byron, Tatar, Reilly and Kulak to easily make up what you need to resign the rest of the core. After that Weber and Price will be considering retirement or have like 3 years left on their contracts. Maybe I am an optimist but I feel like adding Duchene is a yes every time. I know there is concern about his compete or if he plays just for himself but you also have to consider this is 1. HIS JOB! and 2. It may be different for him to play for his boyhood team.

the first million dollars of any contract basically doesn't count. We are going to have cap trouble if we sign Duchene, there is no question about that. How much you paying Domi? Gallagher? JK? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, HabsAlways said:

Yes but signing Duchene to a long term big contract creates problems 2-3 years from now when guys like JK, Poehling, Suzuki and anybody else are coming off their ELCs.    Signing Duchene means you have 3 guys in their 30's on 10m+ contracts who are all declining.

If we're signing a UFA it should be for the hole we have, not at the expense of our future.

Agreed. And just to be clear, I certainly wouldn't advocate signing Duchene just because we can't solve a problem at a position of need. Although, I'm sure it will look bad if Bergevin has cap space AGAIN and fails to make the playoffs AGAIN. But maybe it looks worse if he has no cap space, a new seven year deal for Duchene, AND we miss the playoffs. :blink:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

Agreed. And just to be clear, I certainly wouldn't advocate signing Duchene just because we can't solve a problem at a position of need. Although, I'm sure it will look bad if Bergevin has cap space AGAIN and fails to make the playoffs AGAIN. But maybe it looks worse if he has no cap space, a new seven year deal for Duchene, AND we miss the playoffs. :blink:

How can we possibly miss the playoffs with our new slogan?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

42 minutes ago, habsisme said:

the first million dollars of any contract basically doesn't count. We are going to have cap trouble if we sign Duchene, there is no question about that. How much you paying Domi? Gallagher? JK? 

My short-to-medium term concerns would be:

  1. Resigning Max Domi next season. Just imagine if you sign Duchene and Domi out-performs him!
  2. Resigning Brendan Gallagher in two seasons. He'll be an UFA and certainly someone we would like to keep.
  3. Upping both Jesperi Kotkaniemi and Ryan Poehling in two seasons.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, HabsRuleForever said:

How can we possibly miss the playoffs with our new slogan?

Easy. We already know we're not entitled to make the playoffs. And we'll only earn it if we out-hockey several other teams in our division and conference. And let's face it, we aren't going to out-hockey several of those teams. :lol:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sebastion Aho is getting offered 6 million a year for 8 years... that's the guy you offer sheet. 10 x 5, it would only cost us 2 firsts, a second and a third... But Aho is an elite player, Duch is crap. Domi won't outplay Aho, Gallagher just isn't as good. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

The Leafs re-upped Johnsson and Kapanen today. Their cap outlook is now just under $7 million in space available. That's with 11 forwards, five defenders, and two goaltenders. So, they still have some work to do. Is Marner getting an offer sheet? Who knows? I guess we'll find out soon.

No they can fit him. That cap space doesn't include the LTIR they have. Horton i believe ~5million

The player to offer sheet is Aho and I would be all over that

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, jennifer_rocket said:

My short-to-medium term concerns would be:

  1. Resigning Max Domi next season. Just imagine if you sign Duchene and Domi out-performs him!
  2. Resigning Brendan Gallagher in two seasons. He'll be an UFA and certainly someone we would like to keep.
  3. Upping both Jesperi Kotkaniemi and Ryan Poehling in two seasons.

 

Not to mention Suzuki ... what if he out performs Domi, JK and Poehling.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, habsisme said:

Sebastion Aho is getting offered 6 million a year for 8 years... that's the guy you offer sheet. 10 x 5, it would only cost us 2 firsts, a second and a third... But Aho is an elite player, Duch is crap. Domi won't outplay Aho, Gallagher just isn't as good. 

Aho 83pts in 82 games ... 12pts in 15 in PO

Domi 72 in 82 

So while Aho got 10 more pts, I don't think he's Elite by any stretch of the imagination ... having said that, I'd take Aho over Duchene easily.

The question is do we need Aho?  The resounding answer should be No.    We have Domi, Danault and 3 prospects that could be as good or better than Aho in JK, Poehling and Suzuki.   Our need is D and I don't understand why everyone seems to think we should be pursuing forwards.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, HabsAlways said:

So while Aho got 10 more pts, I don't think he's Elite by any stretch of the imagination ... having said that, I'd take Aho over Duchene easily.

I stopped reading once he said Duchene was "crap."  You may not like the guy, you may think he's overrated and is going to be vastly overpaid but we're talking about a player who is a career .75ppg player.  To call him "crap" is well.. you know. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, maas_art said:

I stopped reading once he said Duchene was "crap."  You may not like the guy, you may think he's overrated and is going to be vastly overpaid but we're talking about a player who is a career .75ppg player.  To call him "crap" is well.. you know. 

Yeah, Duchene isn't crap ... I just don't understand the infatuation of pursuing a Center at all ... I can see us going for a winger and then trading Drouin/Byron/Shaw etc for a LD though

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, HabsAlways said:

Aho 83pts in 82 games ... 12pts in 15 in PO

Domi 72 in 82 

So while Aho got 10 more pts, I don't think he's Elite by any stretch of the imagination ... having said that, I'd take Aho over Duchene easily.

The question is do we need Aho?  The resounding answer should be No.    We have Domi, Danault and 3 prospects that could be as good or better than Aho in JK, Poehling and Suzuki.   Our need is D and I don't understand why everyone seems to think we should be pursuing forwards.

Aho is 21, I have no doubt that he will be scoring at 100pts a season in the next 2 years. Domi is great but i doubt at 24 he is going to take anymore significant steps. He's in his prime now. Aho is about to step into his prime

 

55 minutes ago, maas_art said:

I stopped reading once he said Duchene was "crap."  You may not like the guy, you may think he's overrated and is going to be vastly overpaid but we're talking about a player who is a career .75ppg player.  To call him "crap" is well.. you know. 

He's a second line center. He's not crap but at 9 million a year, he's crap. This is going to be the Gomez contract. I'd much rather go after Aho even if we lose some picks

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, HabsAlways said:

oh and Aho had 24 points on the PP to Domi's 11 ... if our PP was better Domi would have matched Aho for points I reckon ... especially if Domi got 20 mins a game like Aho did.    Domi average 17:23, Aho just over 20.

see i think Aho makes our power play better

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, H_T_L said:

Reimer has 2 seasons left at 3.4 mill and the Panthers seem desperate to move him. If they withhold a chunk of that salary he could be a possibility for our backup spot. 

yeah, i think that could be something. We have to protect our greatest asset and that is Price. LOAD MANAGEMENT! :4322:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

At the end of the 2019 season Drouin, Gallagher and Danault may become prime trade candidates to make some room and get a  return some  prospects or draft picks. We will need to make some room at forward and while I am not anticipating all 3 to be moved one or 2 depending upon the return could easily be playing their last seasons here unless we have a great playoff run. This would be the easiest way to make room for the number of forwards we have waiting in the wings. By the end of the upcoming season Bergevin should have an excellent idea about who is ready to make the jump. I don't see too many of our prospects getting moved other than say an Evans.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's clear the 2021 off-season is shaping up to be a big one. JK and Poehling are RFA's. Tatar, Petry, Gallagher, and Danault are all UFA's. And there's also an expansion draft. As it stands right now, without re-signing any of those players, these are the guys I'd protect:

7F: Drouin, Domi (who will be re-signed), Kotkaniemi, Lehkonen, and 3 more (who could be Armia, Byron, and Shaw barring another player being added to the mix).

3D: Mete, Juulsen, and one wild card, maybe Fleury. But yeah, I'm not protecting Petry as a UFA and I'm not protecting Weber, who will be 36 heading into the season after, and if another team wants 36-year old Weber (whose salary will take a nosedive after 2021-22, which means he might opt for retirement a year later) then let them.

1G: No choice but to protect Price given he has a NMC; Lindgren and McNiven get exposed.

 

I'm frankly not too concerned about exposing any of Byron, Armia, or Shaw... you protect them if you have no one else, but if they're lost, they're lost. I would attempt to re-sign and protect Gallagher. I can't tell in two years whether Tatar will still have value to re-sign to a new deal, and I wonder if Danault will price himself out of our ability to sign him, in addition to becoming expendable if our younger centers develop. So I would partly agree with Habberwacky, that maybe you look at trading Danault and/or Tatar during the 2020 off-season or at the trade deadline in 2021 if you're not a legit Cup candidate. I also wonder if we shouldn't be looking to deal Weber at one of those times too and perhaps Petry.

So yes, that summer is going to be a huge decision point for us. We can theoretically let a lot of our big name guys walk or we can trade them before, in addition to losing someone via the ED. And everyone in the league expects a new US tv deal that summer to cause a big jump in the cap. All that to say that I'm actually not as concerned as some about signing a big name to a big deal now, be it a UFA or RFA. Say you offersheet Aho or Laine or Point or someone now and you can keep the AAV down low enough to not give up the 4 first rounders... well we have the cap space this year. And next year, we only owe a re-up to Domi, Mete, and Juulsen (the latter two of which should be small raises). Weise's money will come off the books. Mason's buyout hit will be off the books after this year too. So we probably have the room to add someone and be okay for the next two years and after that, you're going to get a lot of flexibility in 2021. Maybe it means we lose a Tatar or a Petry, but by then, the reserves from our recent drafts should be here (Romanov and Brook and Suzuki and Ylonen and so on will get a chance) and we'd have a big name free agent to add to the mix who might just be a better keep.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

It's clear the 2021 off-season is shaping up to be a big one. JK and Poehling are RFA's. Tatar, Petry, Gallagher, and Danault are all UFA's. And there's also an expansion draft. As it stands right now, without re-signing any of those players, these are the guys I'd protect:

7F: Drouin, Domi (who will be re-signed), Kotkaniemi, Lehkonen, and 3 more (who could be Armia, Byron, and Shaw barring another player being added to the mix).

3D: Mete, Juulsen, and one wild card, maybe Fleury. But yeah, I'm not protecting Petry as a UFA and I'm not protecting Weber, who will be 36 heading into the season after, and if another team wants 36-year old Weber (whose salary will take a nosedive after 2021-22, which means he might opt for retirement a year later) then let them.

1G: No choice but to protect Price given he has a NMC; Lindgren and McNiven get exposed.

 

I'm frankly not too concerned about exposing any of Byron, Armia, or Shaw... you protect them if you have no one else, but if they're lost, they're lost. I would attempt to re-sign and protect Gallagher. I can't tell in two years whether Tatar will still have value to re-sign to a new deal, and I wonder if Danault will price himself out of our ability to sign him, in addition to becoming expendable if our younger centers develop. So I would partly agree with Habberwacky, that maybe you look at trading Danault and/or Tatar during the 2020 off-season or at the trade deadline in 2021 if you're not a legit Cup candidate. I also wonder if we shouldn't be looking to deal Weber at one of those times too and perhaps Petry.

So yes, that summer is going to be a huge decision point for us. We can theoretically let a lot of our big name guys walk or we can trade them before, in addition to losing someone via the ED. And everyone in the league expects a new US tv deal that summer to cause a big jump in the cap. All that to say that I'm actually not as concerned as some about signing a big name to a big deal now, be it a UFA or RFA. Say you offersheet Aho or Laine or Point or someone now and you can keep the AAV down low enough to not give up the 4 first rounders... well we have the cap space this year. And next year, we only owe a re-up to Domi, Mete, and Juulsen (the latter two of which should be small raises). Weise's money will come off the books. Mason's buyout hit will be off the books after this year too. So we probably have the room to add someone and be okay for the next two years and after that, you're going to get a lot of flexibility in 2021. Maybe it means we lose a Tatar or a Petry, but by then, the reserves from our recent drafts should be here (Romanov and Brook and Suzuki and Ylonen and so on will get a chance) and we'd have a big name free agent to add to the mix who might just be a better keep.

 

 

That's exactly my point we can and should sign someone now. I totally get not wanting to give up the future in a trade but at some point the future has to be now. We have to take a shot at a cup at some point. I am more afraid of MB deciding in 2-4 years that we need another reset. Pushing us out of Price and Weber and Petry's window than I am about the cap hits going forward.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • H_T_L locked this topic
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...