73 Michael Ryder 06-07

[Guest gottaHABit]

I'm saying that a handful of journalists with agendas are creating the ruckus and influencing perception of certain players in Montreal. Sometimes it's not subtle, but often it is. For example, the public will get the impression that Koivu isn't a good captain or a team player because all these stories conveniently surface right before training camp. So no one's coming out and saying Koivu should go, but someone is definitely making sure that Koivu gets as much negative press as possible, by any means necessary, even when the 'evidence' is just hearsay, fabrication, and innuendo.

In any case, I'm off-topic. Back to Ryder. I'm curious to see how he performs in a contract year. This is his chance to make a splash in the UFA market, but in order to do that, he has to erase that -25 and be consistently productive.

For goodness sakes guys, enough with the -25 already! That's like knocking a stay at home defenseman for not scoring enough. The argument becomes even sillier when you look at the overall team +/- performance. 18 out of 25 players were in negatives last year, and 9 of those 18 were double digit negatives. Ryder is by no means a perfect player, but his miserable +/- performance was as much an aberation for him as it was for our other forwards. If Gainey and Carboneau truly are the defensive specialists that people make them out to be, how is it that we're even be having this +/- discussion? When it comes to the miserable +/- TEAM performance last year, it's time to put the lion's share of the blame where it truly belongs!

The +/- stat isn't even meant to be a measure for offensive forwards, it's meant to measure defensemen and/or forwards who play a defensive role. Offensive forwards are measured by scoring statistics like goals and assists. The funny thing is that most people seem to have a really strong grasp of that concept ....when it comes to rest of our high +/- forwards.

[amp73]

For goodness sakes guys, enough with the -25 already!

lol......everyone keeps forgetting that 3/4 of the Team , including the Captain were " minuses " but yet getting rid of the only 25 to 30 goal scorer on the team , because he has a bad plus / minus will make the Team better

Does Ryder have to improve his + - ?

Of course, but other than Plekanec , Markov and komisreck , who doesn't ?

[habulator]

Back to Ryder. I'm curious to see how he performs in a contract year. This is his chance to make a splash in the UFA market, but in order to do that, he has to erase that -25 and be consistently productive.

Gotta take exception with this - no one is solely responsible for their +/-. It is not something that you can change all by yourself, it is a TEAM stat.

I am very surprised how many people don't understand this concept. While playing on a team like last seasons which didn't score 5 on 5, Jesus ***** himself would have been a minus player!

[fourtrax]

Whoa there, stallions. I never said Ryder was the only person with a poor plus-minus. Obviously the whole team has problems. But Ryder can do his own bit to improve defensively.

[Guest 1970 Habs]

It's not caused by the French fans, it's caused by the French media trying to make these guys that play for us into something their not. They set such high unrealistic ideals of these players and when they don't hit those high standards they come down on them, and in most cases they come down a lot harder on the non-French players than the French ones.

I mean come on, you'd have to be blind not to see it. How many times has the media in Quebec tried to make Koivu look like an idoit because he couldn't speak French?

I'm sure there are some French fans out there that would be a little more understanding towards Ryder's expectations if he was French, however, it's not all fans, and probalby not even a huge percentage of them.

It's mainly the media.

I wonder if the people who post some not so positive things about Ryder on the Forum are in this group.

[Guest 1970 Habs]

I am amazed once again with people continuing to slam Ryder's defensive game after reading some posts from people dismissing Kovalchuk's defensive game as not being an issue.

Fact is Ryder is the team's goal scorer. I wonder if he scored 40-50 goals whether his defensive game would really be an issue.

Geez.....can we cut the guy some slack and give him credit for what he does well...scores goals!

[Guest Anetéchrist]

Geez.....can we cut the guy some slack and give him credit for what he does well...scores goals!

If you would present yourself to an election, you'd have my vote for this. Let's cut Ryder, Koivu, Kovalev some slack. And bash Samsonov a bit. It's been a few weeks now. He's not dead, you know.

[Guest habs_fan1160]

I wonder if the people who post some not so positive things about Ryder on the Forum are in this group.

I work in the media business, but we seem to have different morals than they do in Montreal regarding reporting.

[Guest habs_fan1160]

I am amazed once again with people continuing to slam Ryder's defensive game after reading some posts from people dismissing Kovalchuk's defensive game as not being an issue.

Fact is Ryder is the team's goal scorer. I wonder if he scored 40-50 goals whether his defensive game would really be an issue.

Geez.....can we cut the guy some slack and give him credit for what he does well...scores goals!

Excellent post.

[Guest JL]

I love Ryder and I've been one of his biggest defenders on this forum over the past couple of years... but the fact remains that since neither sides talked long term contracts during their last negotiations knowing that Ryder could become a UFA at the end, pretty much proves a bit of a lack of interest/commitment to staying together, especially knowing that we don't negotiate contracts during the season. One would think that one side or the other would have brought a long term deal on the bargaining table... Afterall, if we don't sign our best goals scorer over the last 3 years span to a long term deal, there's something fishy.

For that reason alone, in order to avoid losing one of our best assets for nothing, I'm now pushing to trade him while we can get something good in return, no other reasons (no +/-) as I really like what Ryder brings to the table and the improvements he's made to his game.

My two cents.

[Guest CanadianMike]

I love Ryder and I've been one of his biggest defenders on this forum over the past couple of years... but the fact remains that since neither sides talked long term contracts during their last negotiations knowing that Ryder could become a UFA at the end, pretty much proves a bit of a lack of interest/commitment to staying together, especially knowing that we don't negotiate contracts during the season. One would think that one side or the other would have brought a long term deal on the bargaining table... Afterall, if we don't sign our best goals scorer over the last 3 years span to a long term deal, there's something fishy.

For that reason alone, in order to avoid losing one of our best assets for nothing, I'm now pushing to trade him while we can get something good in return, no other reasons (no +/-) as I really like what Ryder brings to the table and the improvements he's made to his game.

My two cents.

could not have said it better myself.

I don't want to see him go, but I think he will be gone this season.

[fourtrax]

Agreed. I like Ryder a lot, but this no-long-term-deal thing is a bad sign. And I sure don't want to lose him for nothing like we did with Souray. Package him with other roster players and picks / prospects for something really good.

[Guest CanadianMike]

I know it doesn't always mean anything, but if he scores 30 with the Habs, can you imagine how many goals he would get on a very offensive-minded team? 45?

[hockey_gal89]

I know it doesn't always mean anything, but if he scores 30 with the Habs, can you imagine how many goals he would get on a very offensive-minded team? 45?

I think he could hit 45 with this team if he'd shoot more.

[Guest CanadianMike]

I think he could hit 45 with this team if he'd shoot more.

I know you love the guy, but 45 with the Habs?

[Guest MTL_HABS_24]

I love Ryder and I've been one of his biggest defenders on this forum over the past couple of years... but the fact remains that since neither sides talked long term contracts during their last negotiations knowing that Ryder could become a UFA at the end, pretty much proves a bit of a lack of interest/commitment to staying together, especially knowing that we don't negotiate contracts during the season. One would think that one side or the other would have brought a long term deal on the bargaining table... Afterall, if we don't sign our best goals scorer over the last 3 years span to a long term deal, there's something fishy.

For that reason alone, in order to avoid losing one of our best assets for nothing, I'm now pushing to trade him while we can get something good in return, no other reasons (no +/-) as I really like what Ryder brings to the table and the improvements he's made to his game.

My two cents.

You would think that Montreal had too many snipers judging by how Ryder's situation has been handled so far.

As I recall, he's our most dangerous scoring forward and, even if he's not the fleetest of foot I have seen him use the body on more than a few occasions. His positioning could be a bit better, but other than that I would say that he's a valuable member of the team and a potential 35-40 goalscorer.

I'm not comparing him to John LeClair, but if we don't lock this guy up long-term, we could be looking at facing him 8 times a year in different coloured uniform and we know damn well how that replay turns out don't we?

I'm not sure what the problem is, but it seems to me that perhaps Ryder just isn't feeling the love in Montreal, from the GM, coach, the media AND the fans. Do we hate on Ryder because he hasn't put up the same numbers as, say, Kovachuk, or Ovechkin? Or because he's not as fast as those guys? Or because he doesn't have the speed to kill penalties? Or he's not exactly a tough guy? Who knows, maybe it's a combination of all of those things. The point is he's an integral part of our offense, as enemic as it is, and if he were to walk away from Montreal at the conclusion of the regular season, he'd take his 30+ goals with him. Can we really aford to let that happen, just 1 year removed from losing Souray and his 20 goals? I, for one, say NO!

Any team could use more scoring and it's not more evident than it is in Montreal, where we haven't had anyone lead the league in goal and/or assists since the days of Guy Lafleur.

I hope that whatever problem may exist between management and Ryder is settled this season because if it is not, we're doomed to repeating the same mistake that was made when we lost a LeClair.

[Guest Miltie01]

You would think that Montreal had too many snipers judging by how Ryder's situation has been handled so far.

As I recall, he's our most dangerous scoring forward and, even if he's not the fleetest of foot I have seen him use the body on more than a few occasions. His positioning could be a bit better, but other than that I would say that he's a valuable member of the team and a potential 35-40 goalscorer.

I'm not comparing him to John LeClair, but if we don't lock this guy up long-term, we could be looking at facing him 8 times a year in different coloured uniform and we know damn well how that replay turns out don't we?

I'm not sure what the problem is, but it seems to me that perhaps Ryder just isn't feeling the love in Montreal, from the GM, coach, the media AND the fans. Do we hate on Ryder because he hasn't put up the same numbers as, say, Kovachuk, or Ovechkin? Or because he's not as fast as those guys? Or because he doesn't have the speed to kill penalties? Or he's not exactly a tough guy? Who knows, maybe it's a combination of all of those things. The point is he's an integral part of our offense, as enemic as it is, and if he were to walk away from Montreal at the conclusion of the regular season, he'd take his 30+ goals with him. Can we really aford to let that happen, just 1 year removed from losing Souray and his 20 goals? I, for one, say NO!

Any team could use more scoring and it's not more evident than it is in Montreal, where we haven't had anyone lead the league in goal and/or assists since the days of Guy Lafleur.

I hope that whatever problem may exist between management and Ryder is settled this season because if it is not, we're doomed to repeating the same mistake that was made when we lost a LeClair.

Who says there is a problem between Ryder and Management ?

Who says the deal reached this summer isn't mutually satisfying ?

Until one side or the other comes out and says there is a problem, who are we to read the situation that way ?

Are we not just creating more drama when we do so ?

[Guest habs_fan1160]

I really like Ryder, but honestly, does anyone blame him if he does decide to go?

He's a tallented player on a team with average players. He does great here and get's ragged on all the time. There's really no questions in my mind why he didn't sign long-term.

[Guest MTL_HABS_24]

Who says there is a problem between Ryder and Management ?

Who says the deal reached this summer isn't mutually satisfying ?

Until one side or the other comes out and says there is a problem, who are we to read the situation that way ?

Are we not just creating more drama when we do so ?

We're speculating that there is a problem between Ryder and Management, otherwise he'd be locked in to a long-term contract that would be mutually beneficial.

We're speculating that, because a long-term deal wasn't reached, there's a problem between Ryder and management.

This is a hockey forum and 99% of what we write is pure speculation. I believe that is the raison d'etre of these boards.

Do you really think that Gainey or Ryder read these posts?

[Guest habsfan7344]

I LOVE RYDER and i believe that he is ganna stay on montreal he is ganna be a great player!!! and i hate when people wanna get rid of him!! HE IS AMAZING!!!! RIFFLE RYDER RULES + HE IS MY FAVORITE PLAYER!!!!!!!

can't wait til the season!!!

[hockey_gal89]

We're speculating that there is a problem between Ryder and Management, otherwise he'd be locked in to a long-term contract that would be mutually beneficial.

We're speculating that, because a long-term deal wasn't reached, there's a problem between Ryder and management.

This is a hockey forum and 99% of what we write is pure speculation. I believe that is the raison d'etre of these boards.

Do you really think that Gainey or Ryder read these posts?

If I were to speculate on a reason why BG and MR did not get a long term deal done, one scenario that would come to mind is...BG didn't sign MR long term because he's waiting to see whom out of his youth talent pool is ready to step up. If he has 3 or 4 guys step up with 25+ goal seasons then he would definitely explore the possibility of moving Ryder for an upgrade at the 1st line LW position. Because if Say Higgins, Plekanec and Latendresse all step up with say 20 to 25+ goals then they should go after a scoring LW that's going to make the Habs better in the post-season.

[hockey_gal89]

I know you love the guy, but 45 with the Habs?

Last year he scored 30 goals on 221 shots. His shooting percentage was 13.57.

Conversely Ovechkin scored 46 goals on 392 shots for a shooting percentage of 11.7 percent.

Now if you do the math if Ryder took 392 shots this season and maintained last years shooting %...he'd have 53 goals. Even if he only maintained his career average shooting % of 12.5; if he took 392 shots he'd have 49 goals. He needs to shoot more.

[Guest caperns]

Last year he scored 30 goals on 221 shots. His shooting percentage was 13.57.

Conversely Ovechkin scored 46 goals on 392 shots for a shooting percentage of 11.7 percent.

Now if you do the math if Ryder took 392 shots this season and maintained last years shooting %...he'd have 53 goals. Even if he only maintained his career average shooting % of 12.5; if he took 392 shots he'd have 49 goals. He needs to shoot more.

The problem with that scenario is he is not good enough to get in the postition of Ovechkin to get that many shots.

I can appreciate the accolades some people throw at Ryder for scoring at or close to 30 goals a season since he has played in the NHL > there are however some tremdous downside to his game that is why Gainey has not thrown bags of money at him.

[Guest caperns]

I love Ryder and I've been one of his biggest defenders on this forum over the past couple of years... but the fact remains that since neither sides talked long term contracts during their last negotiations knowing that Ryder could become a UFA at the end, pretty much proves a bit of a lack of interest/commitment to staying together, especially knowing that we don't negotiate contracts during the season. One would think that one side or the other would have brought a long term deal on the bargaining table... Afterall, if we don't sign our best goals scorer over the last 3 years span to a long term deal, there's something fishy.

For that reason alone, in order to avoid losing one of our best assets for nothing, I'm now pushing to trade him while we can get something good in return, no other reasons (no +/-) as I really like what Ryder brings to the table and the improvements he's made to his game.

My two cents.

I have to go along with JL on this one. Although I am not one of Ryders biggest supporters, I have to give him credit for what he has accomplished.

I am like JL that I think Ryder is a tradeable assest. I just don't see him signing with us in the future and I don't want to see another Souray Fiasco.

You take take a stab at a little older player who may have some juice left in the body like Naslund in Vancouver or you try to package Ryder and Goalie and some top end prospects for a home run type player. Either way I think you have to move Ryder early in the season becuase as the year progresses I think his value will drop.

[hockey_gal89]

The problem with that scenario is he is not good enough to get in the postition of Ovechkin to get that many shots.

I can appreciate the accolades some people throw at Ryder for scoring at or close to 30 goals a season since he has played in the NHL > there are however some tremdous downside to his game that is why Gainey has not thrown bags of money at him.

I'm not sure if I completely agree with you. Sure, Ryder does not have the same level of skill set that Ovechkin does. However it doesn't take a young phenom to fire shots on net. And when Ryder has fired shots on net, he's shown he does it better than just about anyone on this team. A goalscorer is still a goalscorer no matter what name is on the back of the jersey. If Ryder shoots more he will put himself in one of the upper classifications of goalscorer within the league.