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73 Michael Ryder 06-07


jl-1

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If I were to speculate on a reason why BG and MR did not get a long term deal done, one scenario that would come to mind is...BG didn't sign MR long term because he's waiting to see whom out of his youth talent pool is ready to step up. If he has 3 or 4 guys step up with 25+ goal seasons then he would definitely explore the possibility of moving Ryder for an upgrade at the 1st line LW position. Because if Say Higgins, Plekanec and Latendresse all step up with say 20 to 25+ goals then they should go after a scoring LW that's going to make the Habs better in the post-season.

Assuming you are right in you speculation. Why would Gainey not sign him to a long term fair price and then trade him if needed. He is worth a lot more in a trade if he is locked to a long term contract insted of being UFA at the end of the year.

This is why I don't understand this deal.

Go Ryder Go!

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Last year he scored 30 goals on 221 shots. His shooting percentage was 13.57.

Conversely Ovechkin scored 46 goals on 392 shots for a shooting percentage of 11.7 percent.

Now if you do the math if Ryder took 392 shots this season and maintained last years shooting %...he'd have 53 goals. Even if he only maintained his career average shooting % of 12.5; if he took 392 shots he'd have 49 goals. He needs to shoot more.

I don't think you can extrapulate that data and make such a conclusion. And, Ryder does shoot every chance he as. And that is good since he is our leading scorer, who better to shoot!

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The problem with that scenario is he is not good enough to get in the postition of Ovechkin to get that many shots.

I can appreciate the accolades some people throw at Ryder for scoring at or close to 30 goals a season since he has played in the NHL > there are however some tremdous downside to his game that is why Gainey has not thrown bags of money at him.

Tremendous downside!! What are you talking about? Hi s downside form what I read here is that he is not Ovechkin. Yes, we should shoot him for that.

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Guest rosalie52
Tremendous downside!! What are you talking about? Hi s downside form what I read here is that he is not Ovechkin. Yes, we should shoot him for that.

There's a lot of players on this team who are not like Ovechkin... ;)

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Guest Miltie01
Assuming you are right in you speculation. Why would Gainey not sign him to a long term fair price and then trade him if needed. He is worth a lot more in a trade if he is locked to a long term contract insted of being UFA at the end of the year.

This is why I don't understand this deal.

Go Ryder Go!

Maybe Ryder is the one who didn't want to sign long term........Maybe Bob said if you only want to sign for a year you don't get a ton of money.

We really have no way of knowing.

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Maybe Ryder is the one who didn't want to sign long term........Maybe Bob said if you only want to sign for a year you don't get a ton of money.

We really have no way of knowing.

So if we don't know we don't know. Which of the two should we crucify? We must crucify one.

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Ryder didnt sign to a long term deal probally because he gets no respect from so many habs fans. Im sorry, being the leadering goal scorer for 2 seasons now and he still only get slack. We are the worst fans in the league when you take into account we hate our leading goal scorer. And we all wonder why none of the big names want to come to montreal, because they become the most hated player on the team...

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Guest gottaHABit
The problem with that scenario is he is not good enough to get in the postition of Ovechkin to get that many shots.

I can appreciate the accolades some people throw at Ryder for scoring at or close to 30 goals a season since he has played in the NHL > there are however some tremdous downside to his game that is why Gainey has not thrown bags of money at him.

So exactly what his his "tremendous" downside? Scores too much, shooting percentage is too high, scores too many PP goals, throws too many body checks, doesn't get injured enough, doesn't log enough ice time during games, doesn't complain enough? Gainey's inability to lock up our leading scorer is a little puzzling actually, considering his willingness to throw bags of money at players like Kovalev, Samsonov, Bonk, Theodore.....

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So exactly what his his "tremendous" downside? Scores too much, shooting percentage is too high, scores too many PP goals, throws too many body checks, doesn't get injured enough, doesn't log enough ice time during games, doesn't complain enough? Gainey's inability to lock up our leading scorer is a little puzzling actually, considering his willingness to throw bags of money at players like Kovalev, Samsonov, Bonk, Theodore.....

852 second in the league in plus minus only six players worse.

Below average skater.

One of the last players coming back into his zone.

Is below average with the puck in all three zones. Creating and generating plays. ( I am not talking about shooting at the net because we all know how accurate he is. The guy can score and that is a quality that many don't have.)

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Guest gottaHABit
852 second in the league in plus minus only six players worse.

Below average skater.

One of the last players coming back into his zone.

Is below average with the puck in all three zones. Creating and generating plays. ( I am not talking about shooting at the net because we all know how accurate he is. The guy can score and that is a quality that many don't have.)

+/- is a team problem... Koivu is 839, Lats is 832, Kovalev is 824 . Not rocket science.

Below average skater .. Ok , whatever

One of the last forwards coming back into the zone.. Ok, can't argue that one

Below average with the puck in all three zones... Huh?? He was 1 st on the team in goals, 5th on the team in assists, 3rd on the team in shooting percentage, 6th on the team in takeaways, and 11 th on the team in giveaways ( 17 less than Kovalev and 24 less than Koivu).

I see a tremendous dislike here, but I don't see a tremendous down side.

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So exactly what his his "tremendous" downside? Scores too much, shooting percentage is too high, scores too many PP goals, throws too many body checks, doesn't get injured enough, doesn't log enough ice time during games, doesn't complain enough? Gainey's inability to lock up our leading scorer is a little puzzling actually, considering his willingness to throw bags of money at players like Kovalev, Samsonov, Bonk, Theodore.....

Theo was the best goalie in the league, cant blame him

Samsonov was a bust

Kovalev is talented enough to earn his money, he just doesnt play

Bonk's contract was from LA not by bob.

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Guest gottaHABit
Theo was the best goalie in the league, cant blame him

Samsonov was a bust

Kovalev is talented enough to earn his money, he just doesnt play

Bonk's contract was from LA not by bob.

Theo was a flash in the pan who never deserved that kind of money, Samsonov never put of the numbers to justify the contract he was offered to come here, Kovalev has never really played to his potential anywhere, and Bonk was brought here from Ottawa, not LA.

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Theo was a flash in the pan who never deserved that kind of money, Samsonov never put of the numbers to justify the contract he was offered to come here, Kovalev has never really played to his potential anywhere, and Bonk was brought here from Ottawa, not LA.

Actually Bonk was brought to Montreal via LA. He was first traded to the Kings on draft day of '04 for a 3rd round pick; he was then flipped to MTL with Cristobal Huet for Mathieu Garon and a 3rd rounder.

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Theo was a flash in the pan who never deserved that kind of money, Samsonov never put of the numbers to justify the contract he was offered to come here, Kovalev has never really played to his potential anywhere, and Bonk was brought here from Ottawa, not LA.

You can say that now about Theo, but BG didnt know he was going to tank so badly.

And every single UFA signing is overpayed, Sammy didnt work out, but the fans where starving for a UFA signing and all BG could get was an overpayed Sammy, but he did fix his own mistake.

And Kovalevs contract is fine when he was signed, he was worth that money on a team with no one really to play with him minus Koviu at the time.

And ya, Bonk was drafted by Ottawa but traded to LA.

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Guest MTL_HABS_24
852 second in the league in plus minus only six players worse.

Below average skater.

One of the last players coming back into his zone.

Is below average with the puck in all three zones. Creating and generating plays. ( I am not talking about shooting at the net because we all know how accurate he is. The guy can score and that is a quality that many don't have.)

OK, I'll defend Ryder again. As I stated previously, he's our leading goalscorer over the past 3 years and as such the man gets a pass from me in several areas a lot of people believe he's deficient in.

-- don't blame a single player for his +/- stats if the majority of the players on the team are also minuses (Koivu, Kovalev, Latendresse, etc, etc...) since +/- is more a function of a team's 5 on 5 offense-defense ratio.

-- the fact that you believe Ryder to be a below-average skater did not preclude him from scoring 30 goals over the last 2 years. If we wanted a better skater we should have drafted one since we knew how poor Ryder was on his skates.

-- the great majority of snipers are usually the last ones to come back into their own zones, in essence because they're not usually defensive specialists. We also knew this about Ryder when we drafted him. A Selke winner he will never be, but neither will players like Hull, LeClair, Jagr (no, I'm not comparing those players to Ryder, I'm simply making a point).

-- to say that he's below-average with the puck in all three zones is, in my opinion, not fair. No, he's not a playmaker and probably will never be, but again, we knew that about him and that's not what we drafted him for.

In short, we knew the type of player Ryder was/is. He'll never lead the league in assists or +/-, he'll never win a Selke trophy, or dazzle us with his puck-handling skills and end-to-end rushes (man I miss Guy Lafleur), but what he does is valuable to our current team and not having him would make the Habs worse, not better.

So, let's stop hating on the man and hope that he lights it up this season and helps our Canadiens make the playoffs and maybe even get his detractors off his back because I believe he's been unfairly criticized for the whole team's shortcomings.

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The constant infatuation in trying to find ways to put Ryder down is nothing short of mind boggling if you ask me. The guy was a late draft pick who has performed well beyond anyone's expectations so far in his career, and he has scored more goals for this team than anyone (first round picks and high priced players included) in the past 3 years! On top of that, in spite of his poor +/- stats, he's improved in every facets of his game last season, improving on his speed, defensive play and overall game. Using the +/- without considering the other players on the team such as Koivu, Kovalev, Higgins, Latendresse, Souray and company is, in my humble opinion, totally unfair and makes me question the agenda of those making those comments.

Cut the guy a bit of a break! It's not like he's going out to the media putting his foot in his mouth, it's not like he's disturbing the chemistry on the team, he's only playing above the original expectations everyone had on him before he made the team and that's no reason to think he's Ovechkin!

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Bonk's contract was from LA not by bob.

Bonk was part of a 3 way deal (Ottawa, LA and Mtl) - Bonk was in Ottawa and handed up in Mtl. Bonks contract was made by Ottawa. Am I missing something?

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852 second in the league in plus minus only six players worse.

Below average skater.

One of the last players coming back into his zone.

Is below average with the puck in all three zones. Creating and generating plays. ( I am not talking about shooting at the net because we all know how accurate he is. The guy can score and that is a quality that many don't have.)

Below average skater? If he's below average, it'd be scary to see an elite skater.

I think it is complete ***** to call the teams top goal getter below average with the puck in all 3 zones. He's obviously above average in the offensive zone if he can put it in the net with greater consistency than any other player on the team. He finds ways to score...I could grocery list a bunch of players who weren't doing so for us last season but I'll keep this about Ryder instead.

You noted in your post that he was 852nd in plus mibnus...better only than 6 players. Well here's some number crunching of my own for your consideration from last season:

Ryder was tied for 37th in the LEAGUE in goalscoring. He was tied with names like: Gaborik, Staal (Eric), and Jagr.

He was also tied for 78th in the LEAGUE points alongside names like: Tkachuk and Getzlaf.

I know you're most likely going to say that you can't compare Ryder to those names (Eventhough his offensive output in at least one category was equal to there's :rolleyes: )...And you're most likely going to find a way to illustrate how these stats don't mean anything (eventhough you use stats like +/- to prove how horrible Ryder is...Which by the way couldn't you at least find a new stat to use? +/- honestly seems to be the only evidence statistically you have against Ryder).

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