Marian Hossa

[royownsall]

Were going to have lots of cap space also . About 4-5 million with expensive resignings.

As of now: 32 million

Estimated Resignings: 7.8 million

Cap hit: 39.8

Estimated Cap: 54 million

+ cap cushion = even more

[jl-1]

Again whats Boston know about pitsburg sources..

They speak to people in every organization... They have friends working in those organization. Just like I wouldn't mortgage my house on that source, I wouldn't brush it off that easily either.

[Fanpuck33]

What I don't understand is why Jordan Staal is always mentioned as being able to command huge money in the near future. Sure, he had an impressive rookie season, but what was so impressive about his sophomore campaign? He only scored 12 goals, despite playing more minutes this season as a result of Crosby's injury. He was a -5, the lowest on the team. He took twice as many penalties this season. He scored no shorthanded goals, which was what put him on the map last season. In two full seasons he only has 29 assists. What exactly has he done to be deserving of the type of money that people seem to think he will be commanding?

[fourtrax]

What I don't understand is why Jordan Staal is always mentioned as being able to command huge money in the near future. Sure, he had an impressive rookie season, but what was so impressive about his sophomore campaign? He only scored 12 goals, despite playing more minutes this season as a result of Crosby's injury. He was a -5, the lowest on the team. He took twice as many penalties this season. He scored no shorthanded goals, which was what put him on the map last season. In two full seasons he only has 29 assists. What exactly has he done to be deserving of the type of money that people seem to think he will be commanding?

His last name is Staal, and Canadian commentators love to work themselves into a quasi-religious fervor over Canadian-born hockey families (the Sutters, the Staals, etc.). Following this playoff run, I've read articles referring to him as "one of the most complete centers in the game". Not sure how scoring a whopping 7 points in 20 playoff games makes you a 'complete' center. To me, he's a good checking-line center. He may turn into a great scorer, but there really isn't any evidence to suggest that yet. But God forbid we refer to a member of hockey's first family as a checking center.

In any case, getting back to Hossa, I wouldn't be surprised to see him land in a place like Buffalo, where ownership has finally committed to spending more money, they have a veteran coach and a good young core of players, and they play an uptempo, exciting style of hockey.

[gracie12]

My guess is that IF hossa is willing to take a 1 year deal, he will stay in pittsburg. They cannot afford to lock him up long term with several of their key players being eligable to walk in a year.

Obviously this makes sense for pittsburg, but one might wonder why would Hossa sign a one year deal (even for league max) when he could surely sign a very lucrative long term deal elsewhere? well, 2 reasons: 1) he has about as good a shot of winning a cup in pittsburg as he does anywhere in the league. Staying put might land him lord stanley. 2) Hossa is already considered elite talent. imagine what sort of numbers he will put up with a FULL year beside Corsby and/or Malkin? He could command great money long term right now - but after a 140pt season or something (not out of the question on that line) he would command HUGE money long term.

It will be interesting to see. If nothing else, the long playoff run has helped the chances of the pens landing Hossa imho.

[babinator77]

My guess is that IF hossa is willing to take a 1 year deal, he will stay in pittsburg. They cannot afford to lock him up long term with several of their key players being eligable to walk in a year.

Obviously this makes sense for pittsburg, but one might wonder why would Hossa sign a one year deal (even for league max) when he could surely sign a very lucrative long term deal elsewhere? well, 2 reasons: 1) he has about as good a shot of winning a cup in pittsburg as he does anywhere in the league. Staying put might land him lord stanley. 2) Hossa is already considered elite talent. imagine what sort of numbers he will put up with a FULL year beside Corsby and/or Malkin? He could command great money long term right now - but after a 140pt season or something (not out of the question on that line) he would command HUGE money long term.

It will be interesting to see. If nothing else, the long playoff run has helped the chances of the pens landing Hossa imho.

i was wondering something similar: if pittsburgh wants to make another run at the cup and only has to sign big money next season why wouldn't they try to sign hossa to a lucrative contract and then trade him next off season so they can get something in return for him (after losing a good deal of their youth to get him in the first place)? i guess, teams don't trade anymore?

[teststory]

i was wondering something similar: if pittsburgh wants to make another run at the cup and only has to sign big money next season why wouldn't they try to sign hossa to a lucrative contract and then trade him next off season so they can get something in return for him (after losing a good deal of their youth to get him in the first place)? i guess, teams don't trade anymore?

Another option as mentioned would be to keep Hossa to play with Crosby and possible trade Malkin for a few second line players. That would be great for the Habs because they have a few guys the Pens might be intested in that could play second fiddle to Crosby and Hossa.

[franck5890]

I truly think Pittsburgh would rather keep Malkin than Hossa in the long term. Malkin looks to be developing into an even more complete player than Hossa; that's no knock against Hossa, just a testament of how good Evgeni Malkin really is. If the decision comes down to Malkin vs. Hossa, I'd be extremely shocked if the latter was chosen.

[fourtrax]

I truly think Pittsburgh would rather keep Malkin than Hossa in the long term. Malkin looks to be developing into an even more complete player than Hossa; that's no knock against Hossa, just a testament of how good Evgeni Malkin really is. If the decision comes down to Malkin vs. Hossa, I'd be extremely shocked if the latter was chosen.

I actually think Pittsburgh would be making a mistake keeping Malkin over Hossa, and here's why:

Even without Malkin, the Penguins are still very strong down the middle with Crosby, one of the best centers in the game and only 20 years old, and Jordan Staal. If they really want to, they can go out and add a veteran centre like Robert Lang to provide some experience in the short term as their kids mature.

On the other hand, take Hossa away and there's no one to finish for Crosby. Malone is UFA and might not be back. Roberts is no longer what he once was. Dupuis is a roleplayer, nothing more. Sykora is a second-line winger at best.

If Hossa stays in Pittsburgh, they have an elite center ANd an elite winger. If Malkin stays and Hossa goes, they have two elite centers, and you never want to overload at any one position.

And here's the thing: any offer sheet tendered to Malkin is going to be a crazy one, so the Pens would be well-compensated. Moreover, the team that goes after Malkin hard is going to be a non-playoff team that needs a superstar around which to build, so in all likelihood they aren't going to improve in the season following the signing, which means that at least one of the draft picks in the compensation package is likely to be very high.

As for completeness, I'd argue that Hossa is still the more complete player right now. He can score but he also plays a very good defensive game, whereas defense is definitely not Malkin's strong point.

[Johnny_rudeboy]

For me comparing Hossa with Malkin is like comparing apples and oranges. There is an 8 year age difference as well as a 7 year experience difference in favour of Hossa.

Malkin is only 21 years old. He has "just two seasons" under his belt and has tallied 191 pts (80 of them goals) in 160 regular season games. It took Hossa 3.5 years to get 191 points. As well up until this year's playoffs Hossa has had a knock on him about being a good playoff performer. Personally I believe Crosby was a large part of the reason Hossa had a good playoffs.

Malkin tallied 22 points (only 4 less than Hossa 10 goals compared to Hossa's 12) in 20 games in the playoffs in only his 2nd year. While he had only 3 pts in the Detroit series he tallied 7 pts in both the Ottawa (4 games) and NYR (5 games) series and 5 pts in the Philly series. Hossa on the other hand had 5 pts in the Ottawa and NYR series, 9 points in the Philly series and 7 pts in the Detroit series. The only series of real difference for point production was the Detroit series and Malkin did not have the luxury of playing with Crosby on a regular basis in the playoffs.

But what really sold me on Malkin's value to the team is how he played without Crosby in the line up during the regular season. To me he is the type of player who makes the players he plays with better; so for my money I would take Malkin over Hossa in a heart beat.

[jl-1]

Let the real speculations begin...

But Hossa? No chance. He is a world-class goal scorer and will get the silly money as a free agent July 1. The Penguins can't pay him and keep Fleury, Malkin and Staal. Shero's trade to bring Hossa here in February still will be remembered as a great one because Hossa helped the team get to the final.

Source...

But a Pittsburgh source said the Penguins won’t make any real effort to re-sign the unrestricted free agent: They simply can’t afford to pay Hossa, along with Sidney Crosby, Evgeni Malkin, Marc-Andre Fleury and Jordan Staal. His acquisition from Atlanta in February, thus, was a one-time shot at winning the Cup.

Source...

So it looks like Pittsburgh is out of the running, as some of us expected. Now who? And at what price?

To add to this:

But Hossa is a free agent, and it's hard to imagine Pittsburgh has the money to sign him when it has to find a way to sign Evgeny Malkin and Staal (after next season) and goaltender Marc-Andre Fleury, a restricted free agent. With Crosby, Malkin, Staal, Fleury and defencemen Sergei Gonchar and Ryan Whitney potentially signed for the long-term, it doesn't give Shero much room for salary manipulation in the future.

Hossa and Ryan Malone, possibly the best wingers on the Pens, are both free agents come July 1. Orpik, one half of the No. 1 defence pairing, is also free as are many of the character players such as Gary Roberts, Pasqual Dupuis, Jarkko Ruutu, Adam Hall and Georges Laraque.

In addition, the Pens have Darryl Sydor signed for next season at $2.5 million US, a contract they may buy out for the part-time defenceman.

Source...

[teststory]

For me comparing Hossa with Malkin is like comparing apples and oranges. There is an 8 year age difference as well as a 7 experience diffrence in favour of Hossa.

Malkin is only 21 years old. He has "just two seasons" under his belt and has tallied 191 pts (80 of them goals) in 160 regular season games. It took Hossa 3.5 years to get 191 points. As well up until this year's playoffs Hossa has had a knock on him about being a good playoff performer. Personally I believe Crosby was a large part of the reason Hossa had a good playoffs.

Malkin tallied 22 points (only 4 less than Hossa 10 goals compared to Hossa's 12) in 20 games in the playoffs in only his 2nd year. While he had only 3 pts in the Detroit series he tallied 7 pts in both the Ottawa (4 games) and NYR (5 games) series and 5 pts in the Philly series. Hossa on the other hand had 5 pts in the Ottawa and NYR series, 9 points in the Philly series and 7 pts in the Detroit series. The only series of real difference for point production was the Detroit series and Malkin did not have the luxury of playing with Crosby on a regular basis in the playoffs.

But what really sold me on Malkin's value to the team is how he played without Crosby in the line up during the regular season. To me he is the type of player who makes the players he plays with better; so for my money I would take Malkin over Hossa in a heart beat.

This is true though we can always dream of the Habs making a trade for Malkin.

[Johnny_rudeboy]

This is true though we can always dream of the Habs making a trade for Malkin.

I would take Malkin in a Habs uniform in a heartbeat too!

[QbGamer]

Why would he take a 1 year deal. Its kinda a risk on his part.

But @ the same time if he wanted another decent chance to win the cup...... Hmm.

Rather interesting theory actually, if we didnt know hossa was a money hungry creature it would make alot of sense for him to sign a 1 year conract.

Reasons why he should sign 1 year deal

1) He has another chance @ the cup, They came close this year, with the core of young super stars on there team gaining playoff XP

2) He will be playin with crosby next year. Crobsy gets a ton of ice time + a ton of points. He will most likely Rack up a TON of points, possibly giving him the best season of his career

3) You figure the salary cap has been moving up year after year, meaning the player has the rights to earn more and more each year. Last year the max was 10 million, they will probably be able to earn more next seaosn, and the season following next.

4) So technically if he was to sign his huge long term contract next year, he should be able to sign for more, as he will gain a ton of points in the season, the cap will be even higher then the projected 56 million that is going to happen this year, and he could technically win the stanley cup next year which would increase his value even more

That all being said, He is known to be all about the benjamins.

So i doubt he will even think about any of that

[tmash]

I actually think Pittsburgh would be making a mistake keeping Malkin over Hossa, and here's why:

Even without Malkin, the Penguins are still very strong down the middle with Crosby, one of the best centers in the game and only 20 years old, and Jordan Staal. If they really want to, they can go out and add a veteran centre like Robert Lang to provide some experience in the short term as their kids mature.

On the other hand, take Hossa away and there's no one to finish for Crosby. Malone is UFA and might not be back. Roberts is no longer what he once was. Dupuis is a roleplayer, nothing more. Sykora is a second-line winger at best.

If Hossa stays in Pittsburgh, they have an elite center ANd an elite winger. If Malkin stays and Hossa goes, they have two elite centers, and you never want to overload at any one position.

And here's the thing: any offer sheet tendered to Malkin is going to be a crazy one, so the Pens would be well-compensated. Moreover, the team that goes after Malkin hard is going to be a non-playoff team that needs a superstar around which to build, so in all likelihood they aren't going to improve in the season following the signing, which means that at least one of the draft picks in the compensation package is likely to be very high.

As for completeness, I'd argue that Hossa is still the more complete player right now. He can score but he also plays a very good defensive game, whereas defense is definitely not Malkin's strong point.

I actually think this could be a very good idea for Pittsburgh. I don't think they'll actually do it because no GM wants to have "trading Malkin" on their record. But Pittsburgh could reasonably sign Hossa knowing they can afford him this season, then next offseason, when they do start getting into some cap trouble, they can trade the rights to Malkin or let him go by offer sheet. Offer sheet would be 5 first round picks, but I think PIttsburgh could do better in a trade.

The major benefits are:

- Pittsburgh gets one season with both Malkin and Hossa

- Pittsburgh fixes an area of weakness (wingers) by losing at an area of strength (center)

- Pittsburgh gets a more well rounded team and probably a couple future draft picks by trading Malkin. Hossa has almost no trade value, while Malkin has tons. It's not really Malkin vs Hossa, but moreso Malkin vs Hossa + what you'd get in return for Malkin

[tmash]

My guess is that IF hossa is willing to take a 1 year deal, he will stay in pittsburg. They cannot afford to lock him up long term with several of their key players being eligable to walk in a year.

Obviously this makes sense for pittsburg, but one might wonder why would Hossa sign a one year deal (even for league max) when he could surely sign a very lucrative long term deal elsewhere? well, 2 reasons: 1) he has about as good a shot of winning a cup in pittsburg as he does anywhere in the league. Staying put might land him lord stanley. 2) Hossa is already considered elite talent. imagine what sort of numbers he will put up with a FULL year beside Corsby and/or Malkin? He could command great money long term right now - but after a 140pt season or something (not out of the question on that line) he would command HUGE money long term.

It will be interesting to see. If nothing else, the long playoff run has helped the chances of the pens landing Hossa imho.

No way he signs a 1 year deal. Yes there is some merit to it, but overall it is a huge risk. He has a chance to get a guaranteed 50 million or so dollars (this is being very conservative, realistically it's more like 75 million +), no way he risk at least 38 million of that just to get another couple million more or win a cup.

Okay and I'm predicting right now that Hossa signs the second largest contract in NHL history after Ovechkin.

[QbGamer]

Ouch if thats the case, id rather take ovy over hossa any day

[Late-Apex]

I hope he ends up in chicago, or the leafs,

Some loser team, where he will never end up doing much,

Even Philly.

I hope someone spends the max on him like 10 million for 7-8 years. and he becomes a huge flop on a loser team

Chicago is on the rise. I expect them to make the playoffs next season, with or without Hossa.

[johnny_canuck_21]

No way he signs a 1 year deal. Yes there is some merit to it, but overall it is a huge risk. He has a chance to get a guaranteed 50 million or so dollars (this is being very conservative, realistically it's more like 75 million +), no way he risk at least 38 million of that just to get another couple million more or win a cup.

Okay and I'm predicting right now that Hossa signs the second largest contract in NHL history after Ovechkin.

Also, his new contract will be with the highest bidder. I can't see Gainey signing him long term for that kind of money, and Hossa is going to sign where he can get a long term, high dollar, contract. That will not be Montreal, and I don't think it will be Pittsburgh. If he can't come to terms with Boston, I can see him going out west with a team like San Jose, which has lots of cap room, and a big need for some offense.

[gracie12]

I would take Malkin in a Habs uniform in a heartbeat too!

I still wonder if there was any truth to that silly rumor two summers ago of Ribeiro, Souray, Ryder, Aebischer & a 1st round pick for Malkin - the summer before he played a game in the NHL. At the time people were saying "oh god how could you trade half the team for a guy whos never played in the nhl" - how sweet that deal would look now!!

Anyway, back to Hossa - Weep makes some interesting points. Logically it probably DOES make more sense for Pittsburg to try to move Malkin & sign hossa long term. Malkin would bring back even more in a trade than hossa and as mentioned, pittsburg doesnt need more elite playmakers- they need elite finishers.

Will be interesting to see how things pan out in Pittsburg over the next year or 2. They could either create a mini-dynasty...or totally flop, depending upon the moves they make.

[babinator77]

I actually think this could be a very good idea for Pittsburgh. I don't think they'll actually do it because no GM wants to have "trading Malkin" on their record. But Pittsburgh could reasonably sign Hossa knowing they can afford him this season, then next offseason, when they do start getting into some cap trouble, they can trade the rights to Malkin or let him go by offer sheet. Offer sheet would be 5 first round picks, but I think PIttsburgh could do better in a trade.

The major benefits are:

- Pittsburgh gets one season with both Malkin and Hossa

- Pittsburgh fixes an area of weakness (wingers) by losing at an area of strength (center)

- Pittsburgh gets a more well rounded team and probably a couple future draft picks by trading Malkin. Hossa has almost no trade value, while Malkin has tons. It's not really Malkin vs Hossa, but moreso Malkin vs Hossa + what you'd get in return for Malkin

wm made a good argument about trading malkin but if i was shero, as i noted earlier, i'd sign hossa to a ridiculous contract keep both for a year and then trade hossa, not malkin. i understand that hossa is the finisher and i guess the value of trading one of the top centres of the league might help them regain some youth but i'm with 1970's hab in terms of malkin's value.

No way he signs a 1 year deal. Yes there is some merit to it, but overall it is a huge risk. He has a chance to get a guaranteed 50 million or so dollars (this is being very conservative, realistically it's more like 75 million +), no way he risk at least 38 million of that just to get another couple million more or win a cup.

Okay and I'm predicting right now that Hossa signs the second largest contract in NHL history after Ovechkin.

i guess that's the added bonus of being a lone star on the market in any given ufa year. good grief.

[tmash]

wm made a good argument about trading malkin but if i was shero, as i noted earlier, i'd sign hossa to a ridiculous contract keep both for a year and then trade hossa, not malkin

I guarantee Hossa gets a no trade or no movement clause if they are serious about signing him. Malkin won't be under contract at the time, so he can be traded at will.

[babinator77]

I guarantee Hossa gets a no trade or no movement clause if they are serious about signing him. Malkin won't be under contract at the time, so he can be traded at will.

ah yes, i forgot about those nightmarish clauses. that does change things a bit.

as a habs fan i want malkin traded but i'm not sure pitts will choose hossa over him; i wouldn't.

[tmash]

ah yes, i forgot about those nightmarish clauses. that does change things a bit.

as a habs fan i want malkin traded but i'm not sure pitts will choose hossa over him; i wouldn't.

If it were a case of one for one trade: neither would I, even given the great points weeping brought up. Malkin's potential is just so high, while Hossa has likely peaked (playing with Crosby may inflate his points, but we know how good he is as a player).

However, when I think about the potential return Malkin would fetch Pittsburgh, which they'd have difficulty getting with Hossa, plus the play of Hossa, if I were Pittsburgh I'd consider it.

[fourtrax]

Hossa is now saying he's willing to take a pay cut to stay in Pittsburgh. How much that paycut would entail is anybody's guess. His cap hit this year was already $6 million. Let's say he re-signs with Pittsburgh for that same amount. It's just possible they may be able to get Fleury squared away and still have the necessary cash next year for Malkin. However, doing so all but guarantees that guys like Malone, Orpik, Ruutu, and Laraque will walk, and it provides no certainty that they can re-sign Staal next summer.