Report: Kovalchuk To Montreal Or Toronto?

[animerules1x3]

*watches the top 10 highlight video on NHL.com, specifically the number one click showcasing Kovalchuk's wicked goal*

And here we are debating if we should attempt to make a pitch for him, really?

We aren't debating the player's skill, but the pros and the cons of overpaying to get him, and his usefulness. We aren't in need of scoring. It's one of our strengths.

[captainjack22]

Exactly, and lest we forget, Gainey was prepared to give up multiple assets for Hossa at last year's trade deadline until the Penguins came in with the drunken-sailor option. People keep acting like trading for someone to put your team over the top is this crazy venture that will gut our system for years to come, but it can't be that crazy, or Gainey wouldn't have put those offers in play in the first place.

What offer was this anyway?, to this day only Gainey and Wodell(and maybe a few others) know what we were offering. We still dont know what assests these were.

[gracie12]

im starting to think that there isnt a single superstar out there that we would go after, not even malkin,crosby or ovechkin. The price would be too much any way we look at it. We might aswell just forget any rumours about a star player coming here through trade because we will never be willing to lose players to acquire them.

No matter what the trade is, there is always risk. sure things dont happen but one thing is for sure, either it works or it doesnt. If we dont make risks now, will there ever be a time to take risks? Kovalchuk might score 50+ goal seasons and win the cup for us OR he might not. Whoever we would trade for him, might make atlanta a powerhouse OR it might not.

Ex1: boston trading joe thornton for Wayne Primeau, Brad Stuart and Marco Sturm. Who won that deal so far?

San Jose!

Ex2: Quebec trading eric lindros for Chris Simon, Mike Ricci, Kerry Huffman, Ron Hextall, Peter Forsberg, Steve Duchesne, future considerations, round 1 pick in the 1994 draft, round 1 pick in the 1993 draft and cash.

who won that one?

Quebec!

Now could for example the kostitsyn's with mcdonagh and a 1st rounder be like ex1 or ex2? who knows! but they found out because they tried.

Finally IMO, im not up for trading for kovalchuk at the moment because i feel we dont need scoring, we need a top 4 d-man. But had this offer come to me the same time last year, this deal would of already been done. Thats if atlanta is actually indeed shopping kovy and it seems they arent.

I get what you're saying but you have to remember that this year's Canadiens are a LOT different than the bruins/sharks in the thornton deal OR the flyers/Nordiques in the Lindros deal.

People have concerns about resigning Komi and/or Higgins so ive heard some say "lets package them and a few other players & go hard after a guy like Malkin etc" - and while Id consider that last year- we are actually in a position to challenge for the cup this year.

I dont see any huge impact moves from Gainey. I suspect you will see a typical "Detroit-type" of move come trade deadline. We might shed some salary or get some depth along the way, but for the most part I would be shocked, after the way we have started this year, to see a guy like Kovalchuk wearing bleu blanc & rouge - for this season at least.

[357908_1475251331]

I get what you're saying but you have to remember that this year's Canadiens are a LOT different than the bruins/sharks in the thornton deal OR the flyers/Nordiques in the Lindros deal.

People have concerns about resigning Komi and/or Higgins so ive heard some say "lets package them and a few other players & go hard after a guy like Malkin etc" - and while Id consider that last year- we are actually in a position to challenge for the cup this year.

I dont see any huge impact moves from Gainey. I suspect you will see a typical "Detroit-type" of move come trade deadline. We might shed some salary or get some depth along the way, but for the most part I would be shocked, after the way we have started this year, to see a guy like Kovalchuk wearing bleu blanc & rouge - for this season at least.

this is true that it wont happen for a while, but it wont happen at all if we dont move in the direction of making a deal for him.

my opinion: we wont suffer by looking forward to acquiring him, as yet there are no pieces that make rejection of his salary an option, but he will provide a peg from which to build a team anew should it amount to it.

[RSD]

that thorton to san jose deal ... i duno if you can say san jose won ... they havent won a cup and neither has boston ... so who won? ... san jose because they made it to the playoffs more?? still got eliminated, still dont have a cup ...

[CdnDollar_6]

http://www.ajc.com/services/content/printe.../thrashers.html

“No truth to it,” Thrashers general manager Don Waddell said. “There was the same thing out of Toronto [on Saturday]. I haven’t talked to anybody, nor do I have any plans to talk to anybody. You see games like tonight’s, he’s a game breaker for you. He’s not going anywhere.”

I posted this earlier, here is the link. Kovalchuk isnt going anywhere

[jl-1]

I think our offense is good enough. If we do a trade it must be for a #4 D man. Trading the brothers plus ... for a player like Kovalchuck that is a superstar that is perceived to be somewhat of a head case is too much risk. The team has a good chemistry now and we already score a ton of goals.

Just out of curiosity, this is the only place where I've ever read that Kovalchuk was a head case. Where did that come from?

We aren't debating the player's skill, but the pros and the cons of overpaying to get him, and his usefulness. We aren't in need of scoring. It's one of our strengths.

Until we hit the playoffs and face better teams, that is...

[animerules1x3]

Just out of curiosity, this is the only place where I've ever read that Kovalchuk was a head case. Where did that come from?

Until we hit the playoffs and face better teams, that is...

Only time will tell. This team has rearmed since last year. And Biron isn't likely pull another one a second time.

[Bourne]

Only time will tell. This team has rearmed since last year. And Biron isn't likely pull another one a second time.

Would it not be wise to instead of waiting on the hopeful possibility we rebound from last season, we come in flying high? I concede at this point it is mere guesswork from both sides however I cannot help but wonder how dominating this team would become with an allstar sniper or another elite defenseman to compliment Markov.

[jl-1]

Would it not be wise to instead of waiting on the hopeful possibility we rebound from last season, we come in flying high? I concede at this point it is mere guesswork from both sides however I cannot help but wonder how dominating this team would become with an allstar sniper or another elite defenseman to compliment Markov.

Hear hear!

[animerules1x3]

Would it not be wise to instead of waiting on the hopeful possibility we rebound from last season, we come in flying high? I concede at this point it is mere guesswork from both sides however I cannot help but wonder how dominating this team would become with an allstar sniper or another elite defenseman to compliment Markov.

At the cost of the depth that took us there. Was is 7 50-pt players last season ?

If you had 2, and the sum of what you give up to do the change is 4, then you're not progressing. You're not flying high.

The proof is in the pudding, the Penguins last year tried to go in flying high, and they discovered in the end that Penguins don't fly

We don't just have to rebound from last season. We did significant additions, with Tanguay over Ryder, and Lang over Smolinski. What we need now is to replace O'Byrne with a 4th D who do the job right away. But a 4th D isn't supposed to cost the moon. Unlike players you want to add.

Your eyes are greater than the Hab's purse.

[jl-1]

At the cost of the depth that took us there. Was is 7 50-pt players last season ?

If you had 2, and the sum of what you give up to do the change is 4, then you're not progressing. You're not flying high.

The proof is in the pudding, the Penguins last year tried to go in flying high, and they discovered in the end that Penguins don't fly

We don't just have to rebound from last season. We did significant additions, with Tanguay over Ryder, and Lang over Smolinski. What we need now is to replace O'Byrne with a 4th D who do the job right away. But a 4th D isn't supposed to cost the moon. Unlike players you want to add.

Your eyes are greater than the Hab's purse.

Huh? If we had 7 and we trade one (Andrei Kostitsyn) and pick up one more (Kovalchuk) who will get more, how do we jump down to 2?

[animerules1x3]

Huh? If we had 7 and we trade one (Andrei Kostitsyn) and pick up one more (Kovalchuk) who will get more, how do we jump down to 2?

The 2 and 4 metaphor wasn't related to the number of 50-pt players we had. It was something else I'm tired, and my metaphors are beginning to mesh together without the will of old me

To answer the part of your question that responded to my point, I'd say that since Kovalchuk would cost more than Andy Kosty, way more, then we'd be regressing. If you add a great player, and lose two good players, a 1st rd draft pick that is, with TT in the house a probable hit, a possible home run, and then add a good prospect, you give more than you receive in the long end, with absolutely no insurance Kovalchuk will stick long term.

You know full well that Waddell won't give up a 2yrs signed Kovalchuk for Kostitsyn alone. He ***** the Penguins for Hossa only just several months ago, and Kovalchuk's contract makes him an even more valuable asset to the receiving team.

There's two way to see a team :

2 stars at the top

5 great supporting cast around them

4 other decent to good support cast

The best 12 you can get to round out the team, including young players, and grinders

Or

3 stars at the top

4 great supporting cast around them

2 other decent to good support cast

The best 14, you can get to round out the team, including young players, grinders and some bums because you have no money left

I prefer the first idea. More stars might shine more than two, but if it needs less planets gravitating around them to happen, then they are less useful, since they are providing life to fewer systems.

[Habcup]

Just out of curiosity, this is the only place where I've ever read that Kovalchuk was a head case. Where did that come from?

Until we hit the playoffs and face better teams, that is...

I am old so my memory is not good but there were several times. The only time I can now remember is when he played for Russia a few years ago. Sorry if I can't back up my staement any better. Maybe other can help support my perception?

that thorton to san jose deal ... i duno if you can say san jose won ... they havent won a cup and neither has boston ... so who won? ... san jose because they made it to the playoffs more?? still got eliminated, still dont have a cup ...

So is winnig a cup the only gage to conclude on a trade? Not sure this is correct.

[hockey_gal89]

So is winnig a cup the only gage to conclude on a trade? Not sure this is correct.

But the Cup is the reasoning a lot of people in this thread are using for acquiring Ilya Kovalchuck...A lot of people have stated in this thread that the reason to trade for a Kovalchuk is to get that bonefied sniper that can get us over the playoff hump and get us deep into the post season.

[Habcup]

The 2 and 4 metaphor wasn't related to the number of 50-pt players we had. It was something else I'm tired, and my metaphors are beginning to mesh together without the will of old me

To answer the part of your question that responded to my point, I'd say that since Kovalchuk would cost more than Andy Kosty, way more, then we'd be regressing. If you add a great player, and lose two good players, a 1st rd draft pick that is, with TT in the house a probable hit, a possible home run, and then add a good prospect, you give more than you receive in the long end, with absolutely no insurance Kovalchuk will stick long term.

You know full well that Waddell won't give up a 2yrs signed Kovalchuk for Kostitsyn alone. He ***** the Penguins for Hossa only just several months ago, and Kovalchuk's contract makes him an even more valuable asset to the receiving team.

There's two way to see a team :

2 stars at the top

5 great supporting cast around them

4 other decent to good support cast

The best 12 you can get to round out the team, including young players, and grinders

Or

3 stars at the top

4 great supporting cast around them

2 other decent to good support cast

The best 14, you can get to round out the team, including young players, grinders and some bums because you have no money left

I prefer the first idea. More stars might shine more than two, but if it needs less planets gravitating around them to happen, then they are less useful, since they are providing life to fewer systems.

Aneté***** I really respect your knowledge of the game and the players and you bring great value to this site. I just think you fall in love too much with our prospects. Prospects have value in two ways. What they will bring if we keep them (if they make it to the NHL) and the value we get by trading them.

Don't get me wrong I don't believe in taking wild risk and moving too much depth but there is a balance between winning today at the expense of tomorrow. I think we have enough depth (at forwards) and trading quantity for quality is a good idea this year. We have 6 players fighting for the 4th line and we have players in the AHL that are ready for the NHL. And we have a lot of players that are going to be ready in a few years.

The hard part is fitting everyone under the CAP and I believe we need a Top D first - The better the D the happier I will be. However, if Gainey as the option to bring in a Superstar sniper (we have a lot of play makers) he needs to look at it and evaluate the deal. Live today and save for tomorrow too!! Like RRSPs

[Habcup]

But the Cup is the reasoning a lot of people in this thread are using for acquiring Ilya Kovalchuck...A lot of people have stated in this thread that the reason to trade for a Kovalchuk is to get that bonefied sniper that can get us over the playoff hump and get us deep into the post season.

Winning the cup is not a guarantee. I think Detroit's odds for winning th ecup this year is 1 in 10 per Vegas. Adding a Kovalchuk only increases the odds of the Habs winning the cup. BG's job is to increase the odds. Would the odds of the Habs go up if we had Kovalchuk. Or are we just ading another player who's last name starts with a K!!

[hockey_gal89]

Winning the cup is not a guarantee. I think Detroit's odds for winning th ecup this year is 1 in 10 per Vegas. Adding a Kovalchuk only increases the odds of the Habs winning the cup. BG's job is to increase the odds. Would the odds of the Habs go up if we had Kovalchuk. Or are we just adding another player who's last name starts with a K!!

I think we're in agreement because I don't believe we should necessarily go after Kovachuck for the simple fact that we may be tinkering too much with our line up and still miss the boat on the cup. However a lot of people here feel a Kovalchuk make us instantly a cup winner.

[jl-1]

Winning the cup is not a guarantee. I think Detroit's odds for winning th ecup this year is 1 in 10 per Vegas. Adding a Kovalchuk only increases the odds of the Habs winning the cup. BG's job is to increase the odds. Would the odds of the Habs go up if we had Kovalchuk. Or are we just ading another player who's last name starts with a K!!

Good post. In my opinion, we would do both. Increase our odds and add one more puch for the KO.

[westernleafsfan]

Good post. In my opinion, we would do both. Increase our odds and add one more puch for the KO.

it always depends on what he'll cost... i'm not saying don't go after kovalchuk if he's on the market. all i'm saying is be carefull. kovalchuk has not been able to help atlanta to the postseason more than once, and back then they still had hossa on their team. that's not because kovalchuk is a bad player. he's arguably one of the best in the league. it is because atlanta doesn't have the supporting cast for a high-end player like him. we as of right now, have the supporting cast for markov, kovalev, koivu et al. so what we were to trade for kovalchuk we would have to make sure that we don't rid ourselfs of too many important players. the closer the skill levels of your scoring lines are, the more difficult is the job for opposing D's. In our case, all of our 3 offensive lines are very capable of scoring, so our opponents have to be very carefull against 3 of our 4 lines. It's so much easier to defend against a team that has one very dangerous line and then a big drop of skill level and scoring touch. That's our strength. We have very balanced skill.

[jl-1]

Last night was yet another example of a team with lots of debt, but with no finisher, no sniper to turn the red light on and making the opposing goalie look like an all-star.

[animerules1x3]

Last night was yet another example of a team with lots of debt, but with no finisher, no sniper to turn the red light on and making the opposing goalie look like an all-star.

Mason played a great game.

[fourtrax]

Last night was yet another example of a team with lots of debt, but with no finisher, no sniper to turn the red light on and making the opposing goalie look like an all-star.

Yup. Imagine it's Kovalchuk one-timing that pass from Saku in the slot. Probably it's a goal.

[BadBrains]

Kovalchuk is an absolute beast. 25 years old. 6'2", 220lbs. Right handed shot and can play either wing. A point per game player who has not yet reached his prime.

If this guy is available at any point he is a guy to pursue very aggressively. He's is a game breaker type of player with explosive speed and a freakish goal scoring touch. Playing on a team like Atlanta is a waste of his talent and superstar marketability.

While many feel that teams like Atlanta need this type of player to sell the game in the American market, I disagree. I feel superstar players are better for the league when playing for teams like the Canadiens or the Red Wings, a traditional hockey market. What better way to sell the game than to have star players playing for "star" franchises?

Powerhouse and dynasty type teams are good for the league. Take the Chicago Bulls of the Michael Jordan era, for example. Basketball reached a peak during a time when no other team had a legitimate chance of winning. People love stars and they love them even more when they play for a powerhouse team.

Back to Kovalchuk, I won't pretend to know what it would take to get this guy out of Atlanta, but we all know it would tale a lot. We also know that Gainey is not the type to unload the future for the present but if there was ever justification to do so it would be to get Kovalchuk.

Forget Gaborik. And as much as I feel we need a D-man, that goes out the window if an opportunity to get this guy presents itself.

[tony1234]

I did not realize he can play either wing.