Bourne Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 I'd do this in a second, but I really doubt Florida would. To trade Jaybo and Horton I think they need at least another proven, yet younger player. In the last trade this need may have been mitigated since I think Pleks is worth more than Higgins and Kovalev worth more than Lang, but this trade just looks a bit too weak from our end. What if we added Patches or another prospect player that would not immediately effect our roster? Horton looks to become a fantastic player and while we may appear to be selling quite a large amount, we are bringing in much more. I have honestly contemplated including Komisarek in some deals because frankly I am not impressed with him at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbarker78 Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 What if we added Patches or another prospect player that would not immediately effect our roster? Horton looks to become a fantastic player and while we may appear to be selling quite a large amount, we are bringing in much more. I have honestly contemplated including Komisarek in some deals because frankly I am not impressed with him at all. It's early in the season but you're right Komi was more effective last season.He will turn it around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainjack22 Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 Because Horton adds a huge physical force in addition to offense at center, something that killed us last playoffs, and continues to haunt us now. And Bouwmeester gives us the best defense in the east, something else that would have been helpful last playoffs. We loose a good center, but his production will be replaced. With the added size at center that line scores more and gets scored on less, so in theory, Kovalev's loss isn't harmful if the replacment can have decent production. While I doubt either Kovy or Pleks will ever score 100 points, who cares if Bouwmeester walks....if we gain the cup? So your in the "I would trade it all away for 1 Stanley cup" boat eh, see now, myself I would much rather have a winning, contending team for years to come, much more satisfying for me. And you prove my point for me when you say if kovy's replacment can come in and have a decent production, IF IF, I wouldnt be willing to bet that someone will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony1234 Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 So your in the "I would trade it all away for 1 Stanley cup" boat eh, see now, myself I would much rather have a winning, contending team for years to come, much more satisfying for me. And you prove my point for me when you say if kovy's replacment can come in and have a decent production, IF IF, I wouldnt be willing to bet that someone will. Every scenario is based on ifs, even our current team is based on ifs !!! It is also a big if whether Kovy's wonky knee gives out or not. You are aware that everything is done on ifs ? I would not trade it all away, but if the right return is out there, I would trade to get the cup. If it is the right return, we will get the cup, and still be contending in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmash Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 Every scenario is based on ifs, even our current team is based on ifs !!! It is also a big if whether Kovy's wonky knee gives out or not. You are aware that everything is done on ifs ? I would not trade it all away, but if the right return is out there, I would trade to get the cup. If it is the right return, we will get the cup, and still be contending in the future. But that ignores odds. It's like that joke from Corner Gas: "What are the odds of a riot breaking out in Dog River? 50/50, either we have a riot or we don't" Everything is based on ifs, but there are obviously odds attached to everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jl-1 Posted November 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 So your in the "I would trade it all away for 1 Stanley cup" boat eh, see now, myself I would much rather have a winning, contending team for years to come, much more satisfying for me. And you prove my point for me when you say if kovy's replacment can come in and have a decent production, IF IF, I wouldnt be willing to bet that someone will. What are you talking about, trading it all away? Horton is signed to a long term contract and believe it or not, we'd have a chance at re-signing Bouwmeester. Kovalev is over the hill and a UFA this summer and we'll be hardpressed to re-sign him if we want to keep our best forward (Tanguay). So we're basically sacrificing Plekanec, a good player but yet another dipsy-doodler which we have plenty of, and replacing him with a big strong center who can also put up points on the board! And don't forget Bouwmeester, who would automatically become our #1 or #2 defenseman! PP? He can man the point! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainjack22 Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 What are you talking about, trading it all away? Horton is signed to a long term contract and believe it or not, we'd have a chance at re-signing Bouwmeester. Kovalev is over the hill and a UFA this summer and we'll be hardpressed to re-sign him if we want to keep our best forward (Tanguay). So we're basically sacrificing Plekanec, a good player but yet another dipsy-doodler which we have plenty of, and replacing him with a big strong center who can also put up points on the board! And don't forget Bouwmeester, who would automatically become our #1 or #2 defenseman! PP? He can man the point! Yeah a chance to resign Bouwmeester until he gets tired of the media pressure and hassle of living in a hockey crazy city and wants out. All im saying is why do we want a person who does not have the decency to commit to a team, a whiner and complainer, why give up some high end talent for a guy who may just walk cause he doesnt like it here, doesnt make sense. There has to be another solution then giving up kovy and pleks and a ton of prospects all in the same package. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jl-1 Posted November 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 Yeah a chance to resign Bouwmeester until he gets tired of the media pressure and hassle of living in a hockey crazy city and wants out. How do you know that? What if he likes playing in a hockey market as he's done throughout his junior hockey career? All im saying is why do we want a person who does not have the decency to commit to a team, a whiner and complainer, why give up some high end talent for a guy who may just walk cause he doesnt like it here, doesnt make sense. There has to be another solution then giving up kovy and pleks and a ton of prospects all in the same package. Find another solution. How's the team doing right now WITH those guys in the line-up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hockey_gal89 Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 How do you know that? What if he likes playing in a hockey market as he's done throughout his junior hockey career? Find another solution. How's the team doing right now WITH those guys in the line-up? What about this: To FLA: Thomas Plekanec, Andrei Kostitsyn, To MTL: Jay Bouwmeester Post trade line up: Latendresse, Koivu, Tanguay Higgins, Lang, Kovalev S. Kostitsyn, Lapierre, D'Agostini Begin, Lehoux, Laraque Markov, Komisarek Bouwmeester, Hamrlik Georges, O'Byrne Price Halak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jl-1 Posted November 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 What about this: To FLA: Thomas Plekanec, Andrei Kostitsyn, To MTL: Jay Bouwmeester Post trade line up: Latendresse, Koivu, Tanguay Higgins, Lang, Kovalev S. Kostitsyn, Lapierre, D'Agostini Begin, Lehoux, Laraque Markov, Komisarek Bouwmeester, Hamrlik Georges, O'Byrne Price Halak It would certainly work cap-wise, but I see a few problems with that. By trading Plekanec and not getting another center in return, we're back in the same position where we have to use Lapierre on an offensive line in case of an injury to Koivu or Lang. By trading Plekanec and not getting another center in return, it also leaves us in a vulnerable position at center for next year as we have no offensive center signed, although I do believe that Koivu will re-sign. I highly doubt that we'd trade one Kostitsyn without the other. I'm afraid that the one staying would be quite unhappy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bourne Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 As JL noted, you trade one Kostitsyn you might as well trade the other because odds are the one remaining will demand a trade or play half asked until his contract is out. Definitely not an option if we intend to maintain chemistry within our roster. I could deal with the possible gamble of losing Plekanec, run with Chipchura and no backup centermen. Worst case scenario Sergei, Higgins and Begin could substitute should one of our main centers drop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmash Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 What about this: To FLA: Thomas Plekanec, Andrei Kostitsyn, To MTL: Jay Bouwmeester No way would we hav eot give two young, yet established players, either of who could eaisly be a PPG player; for a rental. Even were he signed for 5 years I'm not sure it's entirely fair for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hockey_gal89 Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 No way would we hav eot give two young, yet established players, either of who could eaisly be a PPG player; for a rental. Even were he signed for 5 years I'm not sure it's entirely fair for us. Aren't you glad I'm not GM? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmash Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 Aren't you glad I'm not GM? I think we're all glad none of us are GM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gracie12 Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 What about this: To FLA: Thomas Plekanec, Andrei Kostitsyn, To MTL: Jay Bouwmeester Oh totally. Then we could turn around & trade Kovalev, Sergei & Boullion for Shea Weber and maybe Obyrne, Gorges & Lats for Scott Hannan Our line up (blueline back) would be: Markov-Komi Hamrlik-Bouwmeester Weber-Hannan Who cares who's up front cuz we'd be giving up ZERO goals a game! Im sure Koivu-Tanguay would be good for at least 1 GPG hehe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stbvoyageur Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 Oh totally. Then we could turn around & trade Kovalev, Sergei & Boullion for Shea Weber and maybe Obyrne, Gorges & Lats for Scott Hannan Our line up (blueline back) would be: Markov-Komi Hamrlik-Bouwmeester Weber-Hannan Who cares who's up front cuz we'd be giving up ZERO goals a game! Im sure Koivu-Tanguay would be good for at least 1 GPG hehe. That's harsh . I'm not sure Bowmeester solves any of the Canadiens problems. We have Markov, Gorges, and Bouillon who are all good skating d-men. We have Hamlik and Komisarek who are physically imposing, but injury prone of late. Bowmeester is not exactly a defensive gem, and the team is pretty good offensively, however lacking chemistry right now, which takes time...and mostly importantly misfiring on the PP. Perhaps Bowmeester could help but you have to subtract some pretty good players off the roster to get him. Personally I would be looking to add one good d-man with a point shot (maybe Foster) for a prospect (Chipchura or D'Agostini), and not changing the whole dressing room which you just built... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gracie12 Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 That's harsh . Oh you know I was playing. You guys have to cut me some slack because after 2 years of being a mod & being on my best behavior I can finally let loose a little with some jokes No ill-will intended to the OP. It was just playing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hockey_gal89 Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 Oh you know I was playing. You guys have to cut me some slack because after 2 years of being a mod & being on my best behavior I can finally let loose a little with some jokes No ill-will intended to the OP. It was just playing Yeah for real! This is like Jedi's spring break: "MODS GONE WILD!" WOOOO! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamesgal1 Posted November 18, 2008 Report Share Posted November 18, 2008 So your in the "I would trade it all away for 1 Stanley cup" boat eh, see now, myself I would much rather have a winning, contending team for years to come, much more satisfying for me. And you prove my point for me when you say if kovy's replacment can come in and have a decent production, IF IF, I wouldnt be willing to bet that someone will. I don't agree much with some of the posters who proposed the trade with Florida for Nathan Horton and the bowman, but i certainly do I this one. If we worked out a deal like that...We become not only the team to beat in the east..but probably the league. Kovalev is an aging forward with tremendous skill...may not be signed anyway... Even if Bowman leaves...Its like you swapped Bowman for Kovalev and as much as I like Kovalev...You just don't get a defenseman that good for that little. As for Nathan Horton well this kid has all the tools to be a top 5 player in the league....size, speed, good hands,he has already scored 30 plus goals on a team that does not know how to score and he is only 23, I think he would be a dominat playoff player he is built for that type of game....Players as good as Bowman and Horton don't deserve to play in a market like florida...there talent does not get recognised...they are two good to be there. Pleks, Kovalev, obryne, carle, I would even give them lang if we signed bowman to a 3 or 4 year deal. We have young players on our team in the AHL that would likely be playing on any other teams 3rd and 4th line...We have enough veterans in players like Koivu, tanguay etc. The size and skill that those two player would add. I don't think it would take but 10 games to forget about pleks and Kovalev. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jl-1 Posted November 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2008 Oh you know I was playing. You guys have to cut me some slack because after 2 years of being a mod & being on my best behavior I can finally let loose a little with some jokes No ill-will intended to the OP. It was just playing Mods can't joke around? Yeah for real! This is like Jedi's spring break: "MODS GONE WILD!" WOOOO! :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flames4eva Posted November 18, 2008 Report Share Posted November 18, 2008 The Kos-Bros and Franky Bubbles for the Meester and Anthony Stewart (see Habs-Market thread for the details) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leafs_rock_go_mccabe Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 Boy oh Boy do we need better D right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habcup Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 It is becoming very obvious that we need a #4 D (or better!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franck5890 Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 Oh you know I was playing. You guys have to cut me some slack because after 2 years of being a mod & being on my best behavior I can finally let loose a little with some jokes I know eh, we're all just a bunch of stiffs! It is becoming very obvious that we need a #4 D (or better!!) I think what we should look for over simply a top-four d-man, is a true puck-moving d-man. There's a glaring hole previously occupied by Souray and Streit, and our offensive output is sorely lacking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habcup Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 I know eh, we're all just a bunch of stiffs! I think what we should look for over simply a top-four d-man, is a true puck-moving d-man. There's a glaring hole previously occupied by Souray and Streit, and our offensive output is sorely lacking. We need a top 4 D that can man the point with a blaster to help the PP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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