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Nhl Rules Trivia


Wayne-1

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can any of you armchair Referees think of a situation in which a team can commit a rule violation, score a goal by shooting the puck into the opponent's net, then be assessed the penalty while having the goal count? :wacko:

I can think of only one, but maybe someone can think of a different one...

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A penalty is going to be called to Team A while Team B has control of the puck

Team B pulls their goalie , for the extra man, and inadvertently shoot the puck into their emtpy net

Goal counts ' cause Team A did not have control of the puck

Penalty still counts

I think

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can any of you armchair Referees think of a situation in which a team can commit a rule violation, score a goal by shooting the puck into the opponent's net, then be assessed the penalty while having the goal count? :wacko:

I can think of only one, but maybe someone can think of a different one...

Umm.. I can think of one maybe... delayed penalty against team A called and the team B goalie gets pulled, the puck then becomes loose around team B's end and team A pokes the puck in. It counts as a shot but they never had control.

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A penalty is going to be called to Team A while Team B has control of the puck

Team B pulls their goalie , for the extra man, and inadvertently shoot the puck into their emtpy net

Goal counts ' cause Team A did not have control of the puck

Penalty still counts

I think

incorrect -- well, incorrect in terms of the question I posed... the situation I described has Team A shooting the puck into Team B's net, not Team B shooting it into their own net...
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Umm.. I can think of one maybe... delayed penalty against team A called and the team B goalie gets pulled, the puck then becomes loose around team B's end and team A pokes the puck in. It counts as a shot but they never had control.
incorrect... that would count as 'control' by Team A and the play would be whistled dead...

a hint: the O'Byrne situation isn't the answer -- in fact, if O'Byrne had shot the puck off an opponent before it went into the net on the delayed penalty, the 'goal' would have been waived off... an 'own goal' like O'byrne's has to go in 'cleanly'...

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incorrect... that would count as 'control' by Team A and the play would be whistled dead...

a hint: the O'Byrne situation isn't the answer -- in fact, if O'Byrne had shot the puck off an opponent before it went into the net on the delayed penalty, the 'goal' would have been waived off... an 'own goal' like O'byrne's has to go in 'cleanly'...

Why? I'm not saying they shoot it, but if its a loose puck and a stick just taps it that doesn't count as control.

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Why? I'm not saying they shoot it, but if its a loose puck and a stick just taps it that doesn't count as control.

as I indicated in the hint, any contact by the opponent will cause the 'goal' to be waived off...

78.5 Disallowed Goals

(xi) During the delayed calling of a penalty, the offending team cannot

score unless the non-offending team shoots the puck into their own

net. This shall mean that a deflection off an offending player or

goalkeeper, or any physical action by an offending player that may

cause the puck to enter the non-offending team’s goal, shall not be

considered a legal goal. Play shall be stopped before the puck enters

the net (whenever possible) and the signaled penalty assessed to the

offending team.

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can any of you armchair Referees think of a situation in which a team can commit a rule violation, score a goal by shooting the puck into the opponent's net, then be assessed the penalty while having the goal count? :wacko:

I can think of only one, but maybe someone can think of a different one...

The penalty is called after the shot, before the goal.

Scoring a goal on a delayed penalty is otherwise deemed as having control and the goal is negated.

If the infraction occurs in a manner that causes the puck to go into the net, the goal is negated.

The only way you get to score is if you make contact with the puck, it is not recognized as control and the puck ends up in the net as a result of a redirection by the opposing team. Otherwise, if the ref has raised or is in the process of raising his arm when you make contact, you cannot score a goal without the assistance of the opposing team.

From what I understand anyway. If you have a scenario that breaks the rules, I'd be interested in hearing it though.

Edit : Italicized part doesn't apply. Just caught your last post.

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The penalty is called after the shot, before the goal.

From what I understand anyway. If you have a scenario that breaks the rules, I'd be interested in hearing it though.

I'll give you half marks for now, because I'm not sure the goal would count in that situation, I have to check the Rulebook for that scenario... it may get waived off under the same Rule as I quoted since the puck entered the net during a delayed penalty due to the action of the offending team, even though that action came before the penalty...

actually, I'll give you quarter marks for now :P since I meant the shot came after the Rule violation (should have been clearer ;) )...

btw, I'm not thinking of a scenario that 'breaks' the Rules, the situation I'm thinking of is specifically in the Rulebook, I was just wondering if anyone could think of it or come up with a second scenario that has similar elements...

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I think you are referring to a linesman's inability to stop play for certain infractions, but I'm unsure which infractions fall outside of their jurisdiction. I would guess that unsportsmanlike conduct would fall under those guidelines, as it could be a verbal assault on the linesman that did not impact the current play and the linesman would have to consult with the referee to have the call made.

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I think you are referring to a linesman's inability to stop play for certain infractions, but I'm unsure which infractions fall outside of their jurisdiction. I would guess that unsportsmanlike conduct would fall under those guidelines, as it could be a verbal assault on the linesman that did not impact the current play and the linesman would have to consult with the referee to have the call made.
actually, I'm not thinking of that... the situation I'm thinking of is very specific and unique -- I don't know if it has ever occurred in the NHL but it is in the Rulebook...

VERY good try though :D I thought you might have found something for the 'similar elements' category... however:

Rule 33 – Linesmen

33.4 Reporting to Referee

The Linesman must report upon completion of play, any

circumstances pertaining to:

(i) Major penalties Rule 20

(ii) Match penalties Rule 21

(iii) Misconduct penalties Rule 22

(iv) Game Misconduct penalties Rule 23

(v) Abuse of Officials Rule 40

(vi) Physical Abuse of Officials Rule 41

(vii) Unsportsmanlike Conduct Rule 75

(viii) Double-minor penalty when it is apparent that an

injury has resulted from a high-stick that has

gone undetected by the Referees Rule 60

Should a Linesman witness a foul (above) committed by an

attacking player or goalkeeper (undetected by the Referees) prior to

the attacking team scoring a goal, the Linesman shall report what he

witnessed to the Referees, the goal shall be disallowed and the

appropriate penalty assessed.

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here's a big hint: I think something happened in one of the Sunday games that is required for this scenario to occur -- and considering what elements are required, it shouldn't be too hard to figure out what that 'thing' is ;)

That's not a big hint, especially considering you didn't say what game. That's a tiny hint.

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That's not a big hint, especially considering you didn't say what game. That's a tiny hint.

Go watch NHL on the fly for about an hour until you see every highlight from every game ;)
that won't help you, I don't think it'll appear in any highlight package except maybe one produced for the local news... :P

you have to look at the boxscores... and I'll even narrow it down for you, it was an inter-conference game... :rolleyes:

you'll see something you probably haven't seen before... I wouldn't be surprised if it (the specific situation) happens less than a handful of times a decade :o

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that won't help you, I don't think it'll appear in any highlight package except maybe one produced for the local news... :P

you have to look at the boxscores... and I'll even narrow it down for you, it was an inter-conference game... :rolleyes:

you'll see something you probably haven't seen before... I wouldn't be surprised if it (the specific situation) happens less than a handful of times a decade :o

No clue, I looked through the 4 boxscores and nothing looked out of place to me.

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this post contains the answer to the trivia question:

what is (apparently) the only situation in which a team can:

1) commit a rule violation

2) score a goal by shooting/directing the puck into the opponent's net (as opposed to an 'own goal' by the non-offending team)

3) at the stoppage, be assessed a penalty for the above violation, but have the goal still count

the extremely rare event required for the situation to occur happened in Sunday's Atlanta-Anaheim game but no goal was scored in that instance...

the detailed answer is below the pics in case you still want to try to figure it out for yourself

funny-pictures-your-cat-is-making-a-bomb.jpg

funny-pictures-cat-beeps-nose-of-other-cat.jpg

if a team starts the incorrect line-up, i.e. different from the one provided to the Official Scorer, they will be assessed an 'Illegal substitution' minor penalty at the first stoppage assuming the non-offending team brings it to the attention of the Referees since it is an appeal play... Atlanta started the incorrect line-up against Anaheim Sunday...

if the offending team scores on the first shift of the game ('shift' is used in the Rulebook but I think it should state 'before the first stoppage in play' since more than one 'shift' can occur before there is a stoppage for the penalty to be called), they will be penalized for the violation but the goal will be allowed...

Rule 7 - Starting Line-up, 7.2 Violation

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  • 4 weeks later...

I think I may have finally found another situation in which a rule violation occurs, a goal is scored, then the penalty is assessed but with the goal still counting:

if immediately after a goal has been scored, a team requests a stick measurement and the goal scorer is found to be using an illegal stick, I think the goal still counts...

it definitely counts in this situation, though technically, the goal is scored after the violation has been corrected:

10.6 Stick Measurement – Prior to Penalty Shot – A stick measurement request may be made prior to a penalty shot following the guidelines below:

First Stick

If the stick is “legal” the complaining Club is assessed a bench minor penalty, a player is placed in the penalty box immediately. Regardless as to the result of the penalty shot, the bench minor penalty is assessed and served.

If the stick is “illegal” the player will be assessed a minor penalty. He will be ordered to obtain a new (second) stick prior to the penalty shot. After he takes the shot he will be required to serve his penalty.

Second stick

The player will be told that the second stick will be measured prior to the penalty shot to verify the legality of the stick.

If the second stick is “legal”, proceed with the penalty shot.

If second stick is “illegal”, disallow the opportunity for the penalty shot and assess one minor penalty for the first illegal stick.

If the player refuses to surrender his stick for measurement prior to the penalty shot, the penalty shot shall not be permitted and the player shall be assessed a misconduct penalty.

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