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Habs Crowd Control Bill


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Not sure how I feel about this but on one hand its kind of unfair for the team to pay for idiotic behavior from the fans and tax payer dollars are supposed to pay for the police. Taxes are high enough in Quebec that extra police presence during the playoffs should be no problem. On the other hand this might be a preventative measue if the fans know their team will fit the bill if they do anything stupid like riot and loot.

"The city of Montreal’s finance committee has set the wheels in motion to start billing the Montreal Canadiens hockey club during 2011 for police measures to control crowds, which proved a particularly costly measure during the city’s recent playoff frenzy.A civic-budget recommendation expected to be adopted Friday would then be presented to city council Monday, and discussed by the city executive committee.

It would apply equally to other promoters of public events that charge admission, said Sammy Forcillo, the committee’s chairman.

Donald Beauchamp, vice-president of communications for the Habs, declined to comment Tuesday."

Habs to be dinged with crowd control bill next year

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Not sure how I feel about this but on one hand its kind of unfair for the team to pay for idiotic behavior from the fans and tax payer dollars are supposed to pay for the police. Taxes are high enough in Quebec that extra police presence during the playoffs should be no problem. On the other hand this might be a preventative measue if the fans know their team will fit the bill if they do anything stupid like riot and loot.

I think the whole thing is a joke. Those morons who actually went looting obviously don't care about the city, the shop owners, people around them, or the Canadiens organization for that matter. In most cases, those guys were bandwagon jumpers and not real Habs fans who care for their team and support it. That bill won't keep them from embarassing themselves in public and damaging the Canadiens reputation throughout the country IMO.

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Move the team. How about that?

Hey, I'm completely with you on this! This is plain old ridiculous.

Possibly a lot of people won't agree with but to me it's very comparable to an irrational young woman who decides to have a baby but is not ready to pass slpeeless nights and has no substantial income to take care of it...

I really don't see how the Canadiens organization can be held responsible for riots...

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Move the team. How about that?

Seems a lot like the Sens Scotiabank Center, but I'd might agree with you if Bell Center wasn't in a "few" km away from the City. But I still prefer Bell center where it is. Just a better security in local streets instead of just locked doors in open windows. Local stores should already know by now to increase their security after playoff games.

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It sounds to me like the person responsible for the idea of getting a business to pay for crowd control away from the event they stage is an imbecile. The people that riot are adults or at least capable of understanding they are breaking the law, in what society do the innocent pay for the crimes others commit. Who is going to pay if someone is murdered, the goalie because he couldn't stop the bullet, politicians think they can stick their hands in any person's pocket anytime for whatever reason they deem fit. Hogwash, Extortion comes to my mind when I read this article. Where on earth do these morons come from, fed with a silver spoon all their lives no doubt!!! Bah Humbug!!

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It sounds to me like the person responsible for the idea of getting a business to pay for crowd control away from the event they stage is an imbecile. The people that riot are adults or at least capable of understanding they are breaking the law, in what society do the innocent pay for the crimes others commit. Who is going to pay if someone is murdered, the goalie because he couldn't stop the bullet, politicians think they can stick their hands in any person's pocket anytime for whatever reason they deem fit. Hogwash, Extortion comes to my mind when I read this article. Where on earth do these morons come from, fed with a silver spoon all their lives no doubt!!! Bah Humbug!!

+ 1

That's why I would threaten to move the team. How much do the Montreal Canadiens sink into the local economy and I can only assume they are taxed accordingly.

As you say it's not the organization's fault crime is in the city. These people are opportunists and it's unfortunate but it's simply not the fault of the organization. Maybe if we'd go back to the days whereby you had a hand chopped off if you stole something this little problem would be easier to lick. LOL

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I think the whole thing is a joke. Those morons who actually went looting obviously don't care about the city, the shop owners, people around them, or the Canadiens organization for that matter. In most cases, those guys were bandwagon jumpers and not real Habs fans who care for their team and support it. That bill won't keep them from embarassing themselves in public and damaging the Canadiens reputation throughout the country IMO.

Yes, but it is fans flowing out of the arena creating an atmosphere of chaos that allows for the crimes to happen. If they really want to root out the crime in these situations, then everyone who enters the arena or any nearby bar to watch the game should have to register their name and fine everyone on the list. Now, the majority of people just want to celebrate and don't want a huge fine, so they will be inclined to not let things get out of hand. When they see someone trying to light a car on fire, they won't just stand by and watch it happen. If you have 20,000+ people on the hook to be responsible for the actions of those around them, things won't get so out of control. Call it giving people an incentive to have the courage to do the right thing.

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Yes, but it is fans flowing out of the arena creating an atmosphere of chaos that allows for the crimes to happen. If they really want to root out the crime in these situations, then everyone who enters the arena or any nearby bar to watch the game should have to register their name and fine everyone on the list. Now, the majority of people just want to celebrate and don't want a huge fine, so they will be inclined to not let things get out of hand.

Actually, I don't think that's a fair assessment. I'm not saying some fans from the game weren't involved, but I am pointing out that there are a lot of other venues in the vicinity, all of whose patrons I'm sure didn't stand around in shock while the rioting went on. I remember reading somewhere after the stupid 1st round riot after scraping by Boston in 7 games 2 years ago regarding how none of those arrested had a ticket stub on them.

When they see someone trying to light a car on fire, they won't just stand by and watch it happen. If you have 20,000+ people on the hook to be responsible for the actions of those around them, things won't get so out of control. Call it giving people an incentive to have the courage to do the right thing.

One of the best ways to get yourself seriously hurt - or worse - is to get yourself in the way of someone whose just smashed open a store window in front of thousands of people while they are trying to run off with their loot. There is absolutely no fear of consequences in that individual at that time. If there were any concern for 'appropriate behaviour', they probably wouldn't have started smashing windows or lighting cars on fire or whatever. There aren't a lot of people willing to commit a crime that are ready to stop just because someone asks them.

There probably isn't a lot of respect for authority, either. I don't imagine yelling "Citizen's arrest!" would help, given the lack of respect demonstrated by their actions in front of an already increased police presence.

It would have to be some hefty fine to get me to risk my personal welfare over a pair of shoes or some booze. The individuals might be Habs fans but they aren't celebrating. Their actions are calculated attempts at profiting as much as possible with little effort, pure and simple.

To the point of the thread: it's just sheer idiocy, a cash grab. I know it's expensive and I know the world is short on cash but there's got to be another way. It's hard enough making a Canadian team competitive these days.

The only added cost for attending a good hockey game should be the hangover the next day. :D

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Guest habs1952
Not sure how I feel about this but on one hand its kind of unfair for the team to pay for idiotic behavior from the fans and tax payer dollars are supposed to pay for the police. Taxes are high enough in Quebec that extra police presence during the playoffs should be no problem. On the other hand this might be a preventative measue if the fans know their team will fit the bill if they do anything stupid like riot and loot.

I can only assume the Habs organization would ONLY be responsible for the cost of the extra security after the games which I think would be fair. I don't see how they could be liable for damages caused by hooligans after the game unless the Bell Center staff served those hooligans too much alcohol. Also, the Habs have absolutely no control over bar patrons leaving bars. Again that would be the bars serving their customers too much alcohol. The only way to solve the issue IMO is to have the extra security and if anyone causes any damage they(the criminal) would make full restitution for such damages.

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Guest habs1952
One of the best ways to get yourself seriously hurt - or worse - is to get yourself in the way of someone whose just smashed open a store window in front of thousands of people while they are trying to run off with their loot. There is absolutely no fear of consequences in that individual at that time. If there were any concern for 'appropriate behaviour', they probably wouldn't have started smashing windows or lighting cars on fire or whatever. There aren't a lot of people willing to commit a crime that are ready to stop just because someone asks them.

I agree with not interfering while the looting is going on for personal safety but just about everyone today has a camera in their cell phone with which they could take pictures of the criminal acts. The city of Montreal should also think about installing video surveillance cameras in the neighbourhood. Oh yeah, bring out the police dogs. Now they would be a deterrent.

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It sounds to me like the person responsible for the idea of getting a business to pay for crowd control away from the event they stage is an imbecile. The people that riot are adults or at least capable of understanding they are breaking the law, in what society do the innocent pay for the crimes others commit. Who is going to pay if someone is murdered, the goalie because he couldn't stop the bullet, politicians think they can stick their hands in any person's pocket anytime for whatever reason they deem fit. Hogwash, Extortion comes to my mind when I read this article. Where on earth do these morons come from, fed with a silver spoon all their lives no doubt!!! Bah Humbug!!

Great points, S.Bah! I agree completely.

Although I suppose there is at least a bit of precedent for this sort of law. If you drive home from a bar after they've served you too much liquor and you hit somebody, the bar (and if I'm not mistaken the actual bartender or server) can be held criminally responsable in addition to the driver.

I guess it could be argued that the bar helped put you in a state where you were less able to make a good decision (which is not the case with the rioters). Anyway though, I'm just rambling. This whole security thing is ridiculous.

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Yes, but it is fans flowing out of the arena creating an atmosphere of chaos that allows for the crimes to happen. If they really want to root out the crime in these situations, then everyone who enters the arena or any nearby bar to watch the game should have to register their name and fine everyone on the list. Now, the majority of people just want to celebrate and don't want a huge fine, so they will be inclined to not let things get out of hand. When they see someone trying to light a car on fire, they won't just stand by and watch it happen. If you have 20,000+ people on the hook to be responsible for the actions of those around them, things won't get so out of control. Call it giving people an incentive to have the courage to do the right thing.

IMO Fans flowing out of the arena don't create an atmosphere of chaos. I was there that night, Families were present, lots of young kids were around, 95% of people were celebrating. It was a great party, you hug strangers, high-five them, sing along, and have a good time. IMO there was no atmosphere of chaos, if that's chaos, we need to ban the Montreal Jazz Festival right away. They got twice the amount of people in the streets dancing and partying.

I'm not going to register my name and whatnot because I watch a hockey game at a bar or at the Bell Center, to me that's simply unacceptable. We're talking about isolated incidents that mostly happend long after the majority of hockey fans went home because they actually have a job and need to take care of other things instead of looting shops. The pictures of those guys are all over the internet, not your average Habs fan, that's for sure. If you wanna change that, increase police presence at strategic positions, i.e. shops/corners that are known to be in the center of attention. Many shops have metal gates that keep vandals from entering even if they try to break the windows, I wonder why the SAQ or Footlocker don't install them.

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who ever this was probably an american and on hearing that we get dissed all the time decided to get his/her revenge.

put into the constitution of canada that you will respect the peoples of nations to their own selves within their own territory- like i've been suggesting we should do for the last 20 years- and the problem will take care of itself. or not, in which case the person suggesting this was indeed an imbecile, but just calling somebody a name is kind of putting the horse before the cart.

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Sorry, but that level of chaos isn't just the result of a few people. Sure, a few people get it started, but drunk fans just join in and compound the situation. It only takes one person to bust into a liquor store or the Footlocker, but there were tons of other people taking advantage of the situation. They were asking for trouble when they allowed people to watch Game 7 in the arena - the outcome was quite predictable.

Anyways, there's an even simpler solution - enact a curfew. Starting at 9 PM, nobody is allowed to enter an X block radius of the Bell Centre. No loitering outside of the arena after the game. If you're on the street, you need to be working towards getting yourself home. Prevent any sort of environment that would lead to things getting so out of control.

I just have no tolerance for such behavior. Those who just sit by and do nothing are just as guilty as those who actually commit the crimes. Everyone has a cell phone these days. Report things as they're happening. Take pictures or video of the perpetrators. If you make it impossible for people to get away with the crimes, then it will stop. Just like when my car got broken into - my neighbor saw it happen and didn't call the cops. The crooks started getting bolder and started entering homes. Luckily, one night I got home real late and happened to see a break-in in progress and called the cops. They ran before the cops got there, but the break-ins stopped because they knew the area was no longer an easy target. Crime only stops if people stand up to it.

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Where would the Habs build a new arena if even 21,273 seats wasn't enough?

LOL Beat's me.

When I initially posted that it was really a sarcastic remark in response to the government wanting the Canadiens to foot their bill. And when I posted "move the team", I meant move the team to another city. I know it will never happen. It was a remark made out of frustration at perhaps a police department that was ill prepared for the consequences when the Habs won. I can only assume the Habs feed the local economy very generously not to mention their chariitable contributions. I just don't think it's right to present them a bill for hoodlums they or nobody else for that matter has control over in the city of Montreal. Maybe if some other folks in the judicial system(s) would do their jobs to begin with there would less of this activity to tolerate.

I watch too much Law & Order. :lol:

The curfew idea that another poster had is interesting though. They maybe could make their $ 305,000 by actually working at it instead of just plopping a bill on someone's lap and saying "here it's your fault for the crime in the world, pay up." <heavy, heavy sarcasm>

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