weepingminotaur Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 Engqvist is playing well in Hamilton, I'd like to see him given some ice time as the 4th line center. I like White a lot better on the wing anyway where he can get in on the forecheck. Schultz isn't really a priority at this point but if you're dead set on him, scratch Darche. Scratch Darche? You, sir, have gone stark raving mad!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennifer_rocket Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 Ummmmmmmmmmmm. So, Darche, Plekanec, and Bourque weren't really "on" last night. Maybe we should break THAT line up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weepingminotaur Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 Ummmmmmmmmmmm. So, Darche, Plekanec, and Bourque weren't really "on" last night. Maybe we should break THAT line up. It's pointless to flank Tomas with Darche and Bourque in any context, even a checking role. Darche is a slower, less physical version of Steve Begin, an energy guy you use sparingly against weak matchups, not a forward you feed 20 minutes a night in all situations. It's absolute madness to keep doing this. I never thought I'd long for the days of Moen in a top-six role, but Moen at least has some skill and has better positional awareness than Darche, whose chief characteristics are 1. running around chasing the puck, Begin style, instead of playing disciplined, assignment-sharp hockey 2. fanning on shots and passes and 3. falling down. He's 33, a journeyman AHLer, and we are giving him prime minutes alongside our top center when guys like Kostitsyn, Eller, and Leblanc can't buy their way into the top six for more a shift here and there. I can't even convey what a bad decision this has been. Bourque hasn't been better, really. Last night, he was actively bad. As in, he sabotaged offensive-zone drives and didn't respect his coverage assignment in the defensive zone. I'm really starting to dislike this trade. He hasn't shown anything since he came here and I actually find him the least physical of our bigger forwards. I'm not trying to absolve Tomas of all responsibility here, because last night wasn't his best game, but he has zero support from his linemates at the moment and the D was primarily at fault on at least two of the Jersey goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grecohab Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 It's pointless to flank Tomas with Darche and Bourque in any context, even a checking role. Darche is a slower, less physical version of Steve Begin, an energy guy you use sparingly against weak matchups, not a forward you feed 20 minutes a night in all situations. It's absolute madness to keep doing this. I never thought I'd long for the days of Moen in a top-six role, but Moen at least has some skill and has better positional awareness than Darche, whose chief characteristics are 1. running around chasing the puck, Begin style, instead of playing disciplined, assignment-sharp hockey 2. fanning on shots and passes and 3. falling down. He's 33, a journeyman AHLer, and we are giving him prime minutes alongside our top center when guys like Kostitsyn, Eller, and Leblanc can't buy their way into the top six for more a shift here and there. I can't even convey what a bad decision this has been. Bourque hasn't been better, really. Last night, he was actively bad. As in, he sabotaged offensive-zone drives and didn't respect his coverage assignment in the defensive zone. I'm really starting to dislike this trade. He hasn't shown anything since he came here and I actually find him the least physical of our bigger forwards. I'm not trying to absolve Tomas of all responsibility here, because last night wasn't his best game, but he has zero support from his linemates at the moment and the D was primarily at fault on at least two of the Jersey goals. I agree with this, and i don't understand why Cunneyworth avoids shuffling his lines. Plekanec with Pacioretty and Cole, might have worked better breaking the Devils barrier, because Desharnais didn't look sharp either... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedimaas Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 It's pointless to flank Tomas with Darche and Bourque in any context, even a checking role. Darche is a slower, less physical version of Steve Begin, an energy guy you use sparingly against weak matchups, not a forward you feed 20 minutes a night in all situations. It's absolute madness to keep doing this. I never thought I'd long for the days of Moen in a top-six role, but Moen at least has some skill and has better positional awareness than Darche, whose chief characteristics are 1. running around chasing the puck, Begin style, instead of playing disciplined, assignment-sharp hockey 2. fanning on shots and passes and 3. falling down. He's 33, a journeyman AHLer, and we are giving him prime minutes alongside our top center when guys like Kostitsyn, Eller, and Leblanc can't buy their way into the top six for more a shift here and there. I can't even convey what a bad decision this has been. Agreed on Darche. Especially when you consider some of the other players we have in the so-called "bottom 6" putting Darche on a 20 minute + a night line is ludicrous. Bourque hasn't been better, really. Last night, he was actively bad. As in, he sabotaged offensive-zone drives and didn't respect his coverage assignment in the defensive zone. I'm really starting to dislike this trade. He hasn't shown anything since he came here and I actually find him the least physical of our bigger forwards. IMHO Bourque is not and will never be a first line player. Stop playing him like one. Yes we gave up a #1 winger for him. That doesnt change the quality of the player we received in turn. A line of Bourque-Eller-AK could actually work quite well. Bourque/Plekanec is never going to work imho. I'm not trying to absolve Tomas of all responsibility here, because last night wasn't his best game, but he has zero support from his linemates at the moment and the D was primarily at fault on at least two of the Jersey goals. He deserves criticism for some of the games this year, no doubt, but he's been doing the best he can with what he's been given on most nights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weepingminotaur Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 IMHO Bourque is not and will never be a first line player. Stop playing him like one. Yes we gave up a #1 winger for him. That doesnt change the quality of the player we received in turn. A line of Bourque-Eller-AK could actually work quite well. Bourque/Plekanec is never going to work imho. Yes, although there you're loading up three bigger forwards. I'd want to give AK to Pleks, since they have history together, and use Eller on the wing with Tomas for the remainder of the season (Gionta can fill Eller's winger spot next year and Lars can slide back to center, assuming we get rid of Gomez). Gomez becomes the third-line center right now, and we activate Nokelainen for fourth-line center duty instead of this idiotic 7 d-men business. I also don't even think Bourque is a good second-line player. He's either a subpar second-line winger or a good third-line winger. Not someone I want to count on for goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeanCountingHab Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 So we're all agreed then? Darche's icetime should be scaled back to around 18:00 per game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weepingminotaur Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 So we're all agreed then? Darche's icetime should be scaled back to around 18:00 per game? Baby steps for our sniper forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roy_133 Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 Baby steps for our sniper forward. I want to make sure he's fresh come late May - June. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weepingminotaur Posted February 20, 2012 Report Share Posted February 20, 2012 I want to make sure he's fresh come late May - June. But you can't take away his momentum either. It's a balancing act. We need a healthy but focused Darche to break open our conference-final series and get us to within four wins of the Cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weepingminotaur Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 Forget this 7 d-men and checking line stuff. It's time to create, as CRB said, two scoring lines, one checking line, and one energy line composed ENTIRELY of natural forwards. So here goes: Pacioretty-Desharnais-Cole: This is clearly our top scoring line, so let's go power on power. These guys should all get minutes, regardless of what enemy line is on the ice. Let them take on other teams' checking lines or top lines, it doesn't matter. First unit on the PP, this whole line, as well. Kostitsyn-Plekanec-Eller: This is a scoring line. Not a checking line, but a scoring line that will hopefully benefit from weaker matchups. For heaven's sake, it's time to flank Tomas with skilled talent. He's meshed well with Kostitsyn in the past. Bourque-Gomez-Moen: Your default checking line. Fourth line comprised of whoever's health: Nokelainen, Darche, Leblanc, Engqvist, Palushaj, White, etc. Gorges-Subban: Just give them the minutes. 25+ a night or bust. Emelin-Diaz: 18-20 minutes a night. Kaberle-St. Denis: Just don't get scored on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennifer_rocket Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 Max Pacioretty - Scott Gomez - Erik Cole (Let's get Scott some value heading into the summer). Lars Eller - Tomas Plekanec - Andrei Kostitsyn (Secondary scoring). Rene Bourque - David Desharnais - Louis Leblanc Ryan White - Petteri Nokelainen - Mathieu Darche Assuming Nokelainen is almost healthy. Once Travis Moen is healthy I replace Darche in the lineup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwdemonwolf Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 Completely agree! For D, I would like: Emelin-Subban Gorges-Kaberle Diaz-Campoli Scratch Weber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIASUN Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 Pacioretty Desharnais Cole Bourque Plekanec Leblanc Kostisyn Eller Palushaj Darche Gomez White G - S Emelin - Diaz Kaberle - Campoli Get campoli value and trade him within the next 3 days. Sorry Jenn, there's no building up Gomez. After you don't score for a year nobody cares if you score ten goals in ten games, they're not paying you 7 million dollars! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTed3 Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 With the trade deadline showcasing about to end, we need to now focus solely on playing lines that can help build chemistry for next season or evaluate talent/combos to help management build for next season. So I'd go with... Pacioretty-Plekanec-Cole (Can this be a 1st line?) Bourque-DD-LL (Can this be our 3rd line next season?) AK46-Eller-Palushaj (give these guys some PP time and see what they can do) Darche-Geoffrion-White (evaluate BG in the NHL and see if he has chemistry with White and Darche) Emelin-Subban (could be a shutdown 1st pairing... basically all we have right now) Gorges-Diaz (would be nice to find another top 4 guy to slot in here, allowing Diaz to slide down but for this season, these are the guys with a future here who we should give minutes to) Kaberle-Weber (again, we ideally deal Weber and move Diaz down here, but for now, it's all we have) To sit: - Gomez, despite being one of our top 9 forwards this year, will likely not be back next season, so it serves us little purpose to play him in a 4th line role. I'd rotate him into the line-up and see if he can put a few decent games in. If we deal AK, then Gomez slots in on the wing there. - Noke: not much to add here. Won't be back. - Campoli: also won't be back. Expect him to be traded anyways... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roy_133 Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 With the trade deadline showcasing about to end, we need to now focus solely on playing lines that can help build chemistry for next season or evaluate talent/combos to help management build for next season. So I'd go with... Pacioretty-Plekanec-Cole (Can this be a 1st line?) Bourque-DD-LL (Can this be our 3rd line next season?) AK46-Eller-Palushaj (give these guys some PP time and see what they can do) Darche-Geoffrion-White (evaluate BG in the NHL and see if he has chemistry with White and Darche) Emelin-Subban (could be a shutdown 1st pairing... basically all we have right now) Gorges-Diaz (would be nice to find another top 4 guy to slot in here, allowing Diaz to slide down but for this season, these are the guys with a future here who we should give minutes to) Kaberle-Weber (again, we ideally deal Weber and move Diaz down here, but for now, it's all we have) To sit: - Gomez, despite being one of our top 9 forwards this year, will likely not be back next season, so it serves us little purpose to play him in a 4th line role. I'd rotate him into the line-up and see if he can put a few decent games in. If we deal AK, then Gomez slots in on the wing there. - Noke: not much to add here. Won't be back. - Campoli: also won't be back. Expect him to be traded anyways... Not sure why Engqvist wouldn't get a shot on the 4th line in that scenario, he's produced in Hamilton and Darche is (hopefully?) not going to be back next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weepingminotaur Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 Darche is (hopefully?) not going to be back next year. BLASPHEMY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roy_133 Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 BLASPHEMY. I just meant because IMO we use him as the piece to get Columbus' first round pick. I know he's a UFA but I figure his rights are worth that alone. They'll need a new face of the franchise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weepingminotaur Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 I just meant because IMO we use him as the piece to get Columbus' first round pick. I know he's a UFA but I figure his rights are worth that alone. They'll need a new face of the franchise. First-rounder AND a blue-chip prospect already in the system. Man, you clearly don't understand Darche's value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nine1One Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 Leblanc Plekanec Bourque 2.5 Palushaj Eller Moen darche white staubitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTed3 Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 We're getting a bit thin up front to close out the season, at least in terms of NHL-quality guys. At this point, I wouldn't be surprised to see us sink right to the bottom of the standings, but the most important thing is to evaluate our young talent. With what we have (Gio and likely Moen done for the season and Darche out), I'd go Pacioretty-Plekanec-Leblanc Bourque-Desharnais-Cole Gomez-Eller-Palushaj Staubitz-Engqvist-White Emelin-Subban Gorges-Diaz Kaberle-Weber At this point, we may as well send Campoli and Noke down to the minors, given they have no value now to us as trade bait nor any utility going forward. I'd rather see guys like Geoffrion, Engqvist, Dumont, Schultz, and St-Denis get shots over the last portion of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weepingminotaur Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 Time to build around our star forwards. Enough messing around. Darche-Desharnais-Moen Pacioretty-Plekanec-Cole Bourque-Eller-White Darche (double-shift)-Nokelainen-Weber We absolutely need to get Mathieu out against weaker matchups where his talent allows us to dominate the play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roy_133 Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 Time to build around our star forwards. Enough messing around. Darche-Desharnais-Moen Pacioretty-Plekanec-Cole Bourque-Eller-White Darche (double-shift)-Nokelainen-Weber We absolutely need to get Mathieu out against weaker matchups where his talent allows us to dominate the play. TBH I don't love Desharnais as our first line center. Can we convert Darche to center like we did Damphousse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weepingminotaur Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 TBH I don't love Desharnais as our first line center. Can we convert Darche to center like we did Damphousse? The question isn't 'can we'. The question is 'why haven't we already'? #greatminds Being conservative, I'm thinking Darche is good for 35 goals and 80 points next season centering Cole and Moen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roy_133 Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 #Habs officially announce Geoffrion call-up and Leblanc sent down. Gauthier said Geoffrion and Palushaj are up until Moen and Darche healthy So basically the plan is to round out the season playing veteran scrubs instead of kids. Edit: I'm not talking about Moen being a scrub, but the fact that both Geoffrion and Palushaj will be sent down when Moen and Darche are back, like we can't find room for them on this roster? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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