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Canadiens name Bergevin new GM


roy_133

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Cool B)

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I'm somewhat surprised to be honest, he's clearly not the most experienced guy around and -- I'm shocked -- has no previous ties to the organization.

That said, it's refreshing to see that ownership is apparently willing to change their approach after the disaster of a season we just had.

Frankly, I know nothing about Bergevin and I'm likely not the only one. Here's an article from a month ago: http://blogs.edmontonjournal.com/2012/04/04/is-marc-bergevin-ready-to-run-an-nhl-team/

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Lack of cap savvy, inexperience, and lack of higher education are concerns, but as long as he's smart enough to hire good people under him to address his deficits, we should be fine. He's risen quickly in the hockey world and that has to be for a good reason.

Here's hoping a capologist is the first hire then!

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Most teams have cap specialists. I don't think it's a big deal as long as he pays attention to his capologist and factors cap into his decision-making. That was the Achilles heel of both Gainey and Gauthier IMO.

It was bad but the more I think about it, a big part of it also stems from poor pro scouting IMO. They were clearly misjudging player's value. It wasn't like they consistently had us so tight to the cap we had to send guys up and down on off days, it was just as much that they were flat out acquiring players who weren't that good in a lot of cases and had big salaries. It goes to both, cap management and scouting but the capologist will probably only tell you how to stay under the cap and it was not like we had to lose players because we signed ourselves into a corner cap wise, the capologist probably won't tell you, yeah go get Gomez he's a good player or avoid Gomez because his play is regressing. I assumed he told Bob what he had to work with and Bob went out and blew it by signing bad contracts. The worst form of cap management is in the poor layering of contracts, having every contract expire at the same time and then putting yourself under the gun to go replace half of your roster in 24 hours.

I guess BriseBois is more of a hockey mind too, and he was our capologist so I may just be underrating the value of a good one but it was at least as much of a problem that we just weren't properly scouting.

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It was bad but the more I think about it, a big part of it also stems from poor pro scouting IMO. They were clearly misjudging player's value. It wasn't like they consistently had us so tight to the cap we had to send guys up and down on off days, it was just as much that they were flat out acquiring players who weren't that good in a lot of cases and had big salaries. It goes to both, cap management and scouting but the capologist will probably only tell you how to stay under the cap and it was not like we had to lose players because we signed ourselves into a corner cap wise, the capologist probably won't tell you, yeah go get Gomez he's a good player or avoid Gomez because his play is regressing. I assumed he told Bob what he had to work with and Bob went out and blew it by signing bad contracts. The worst form of cap management is in the poor layering of contracts, having every contract expire at the same time and then putting yourself under the gun to go replace half of your roster in 24 hours.

I guess BriseBois is more of a hockey mind too, and he was our capologist so I may just be underrating the value of a good one but it was at least as much of a problem that we just weren't properly scouting.

Oh, no question the pro scouting was awful. From Samsonov to Gomez to Laraque, it just seemed like we were always spending too much for players whose best days were behind them. Gauthier bears the brunt of that responsibility, since he was head of pro scouting under Gainey.

And yes, those who know me here will remember my diatribes against poor contract layering in the summer of 2009. Bad foresight there, and one of the biggest 'tells' that Gainey had no idea how to be a good GM in a cap world.

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Article is up on the NHL website.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=630394

From the limited info I've seen, he seems like a solid choice. Good going Molson! Plus, he's picked long enough in advance that he has time to get to know the organization before the big summer decisions (the draft, re-signing contracts, July 1st, etc.).

I'm pleased. Now time to see if Bergevin's decisions will leave me feeling that way too.

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As I think about it, wouldn't a good capologist be on top of stuff like poor contract layering? If he sees a problem -- like, say, signing forward X would mean we'd have 5 contracts expiring in the same summer three years from now -- shouldn't he say something to the GM?

Yeah, that's the one part that I don't know and it's why I mentioned it specifically. I'd have to guess it should be mentioned but at the end of the day, Bob was free to do as he pleased so maybe he just though he'd cross that bridge when he got to it? TBH I don't even know how far ranging a capologists role would be within an organization. BriseBois ran the Bulldogs and he's got a high up hockey ops role with the Lightning now, so clearly he has some hockey acumen beyond simply the cap. Was he giving his input on which players to acquire, or whether or not the players talked about were worth the cap space? Or was he simply telling Bob how to make the pieces he/Gauther wanted to bring in fit and letting them take it from there?

It's hard to say, but the fundamental flaw looks to be we weren't properly assessing player's ability and thus their cap value. There was clearly a flaw in our cap management and our pro scouting and when both of those things fail, yeesh.

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Yeah, that's the one part that I don't know and it's why I mentioned it specifically. I'd have to guess it should be mentioned but at the end of the day, Bob was free to do as he pleased so maybe he just though he'd cross that bridge when he got to it? TBH I don't even know how far ranging a capologists role would be within an organization. BriseBois ran the Bulldogs and he's got a high up hockey ops role with the Lightning now, so clearly he has some hockey acumen beyond simply the cap. Was he giving his input on which players to acquire, or whether or not the players talked about were worth the cap space? Or was he simply telling Bob how to make the pieces he/Gauther wanted to bring in fit and letting them take it from there?

Yes, it's hard to say because the capologist is really a recent phenomenon and as fans we have very little idea of what a capologist's day-to-day job is like.

It's hard to say, but the fundamental flaw looks to be we weren't properly assessing player's ability and thus their cap value. There was clearly a flaw in our cap management and our pro scouting and when both of those things fail, yeesh.

Train-wreck, unfortunatey. Let's hope digging our way out of this mess doesn't take too long. Good news is that thanks to Timmins our drafting has been good, judging from most of the core of the current team: Price, Subban, and Pacioretty.

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Train-wreck, unfortunatey. Let's hope digging our way out of this mess doesn't take too long. Good news is that thanks to Timmins our drafting has been good, judging from most of the core of the current team: Price, Subban, and Pacioretty.

Yep, I was thinking about that when I heard the news right before bed last night, Bergevin isn't coming into the worst situation in the world by any means. We have good young pieces in place, we're not there yet but it's a real good start, good young guys at every position. Our system isn't completely bare, we have a ton of money to get creative if we want to and be a cap team and bury past mistakes and most importantly he's inheriting a top 3 pick with a chance to add a star player to our core and with that top 3 pick follows high picks in every round, our 2nd pick will feel like a late 1st, we have an additional 2nd, our 3rd feels like a late 2nd ect. and we have a few 2nds next year.

There's assets here, big time. We don't need a long term rebuilding plan. TBH, looking at our goal differential and injury situation last year, we were probably the best last place team in the expansion era. We really aren't that bad.

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I'm happy with the choice. He's young, but he's acquired a lot of great experience in a short time and has risen through the ranks very quickly. He's worked as part of a strong management team in Chicago so hopefully he's prepared to build a great group here.

Ultimately, I think I would have been happy with most choices because we've seen strong evidence that the process was done right this time around (ie: thorough search, extensive list of candidates including those who didn't speak French, no placing absurd weight on former players)

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Yep, I was thinking about that when I heard the news right before bed last night, Bergevin isn't coming into the worst situation in the world by any means. We have good young pieces in place, we're not there yet but it's a real good start, good young guys at every position. Our system isn't completely bare, we have a ton of money to get creative if we want to and be a cap team and bury past mistakes and most importantly he's inheriting a top 3 pick with a chance to add a star player to our core and with that top 3 pick follows high picks in every round, our 2nd pick will feel like a late 1st, we have an additional 2nd, our 3rd feels like a late 2nd ect. and we have a few 2nds next year.

There's assets here, big time. We don't need a long term rebuilding plan. TBH, looking at our goal differential and injury situation last year, we were probably the best last place team in the expansion era. We really aren't that bad.

Yes, definitely, Bergevin will have assets to work with. And I too feel that we weren't as bad as a last-place finish in 2011-12. We lost a ton of one-goal games and TBH if Gauthier doesn't lose his head by firing Martin and making those idiotic Kaberle and Bourque trades we might have stayed well clear of the conference basement.

We'll need to hit a home run with the #3 pick, though, and to a lesser extent succeed with the rest of our picks this year. Opportunities to add a star player from the ground up don't come along every day, and we are not a market that will tolerate failure for more than a season at most.

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Excited. :D I'm ready for the Molson/Bergevin era to begin. I'm not worried about his lack of experience or his "number crunching" shortcomings. I'm just excited to see how well he performs in righting this listing CH ship. It looks like the team really did their homework and put the work into making a good hire.

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It looks like the team really did their homework and put the work into making a good hire.

Well, we don't know if it's a good hire per se, but as you noted, the team has done its homework through this process and that's a good sign IMO. There's an inherent risk in any hire TBH -- sometimes the perfect candidate turns out to be a dud -- but what makes me feel confident is the due diligence. They didn't just hire Savard's buddy's ex-roommate or recyle someone from within the organization, they didn't only talk to 1-2 people, they cast a VERY wide net (including some anglo candidates) and took a lengthy but not ridiculous span of time making the decision. The timing is actually excellent IMO. If they'd hired sooner I would have had concerns about the process; later and it would have looked like dithering and an inability to make a clear decision based on clear criteria. Early May for the hire is perfect. Bergevin can hit the ground running well ahead of the draft.

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Well, we don't know if it's a good hire per se, but as you noted, the team has done its homework through this process and that's a good sign IMO. There's an inherent risk in any hire TBH -- sometimes the perfect candidate turns out to be a dud -- but what makes me feel confident is the due diligence. They didn't just hire Savard's buddy's ex-roommate or recyle someone from within the organization, they didn't only talk to 1-2 people, they cast a VERY wide net (including some anglo candidates) and took a lengthy but not ridiculous span of time making the decision. The timing is actually excellent IMO. If they'd hired sooner I would have had concerns about the process; later and it would have looked like dithering and an inability to make a clear decision based on clear criteria. Early May for the hire is perfect. Bergevin can hit the ground running well ahead of the draft.

Sorry. I didn't mean "good hire" as in Bergevin will be good in his position (he might be terrible), but that the team did a good job in the hiring process. I should have typed that out a little more clearly. I was excited. :lol: I am, however, fully confident that they made a smart decision based on the optics of the process. You have hit the nail on the head by pointing out the casting of a wide net, and the period of time with which it took them to make a decision. I'm really happy to see, IMO, that the Molson era has started off well. I really feel like now our new ownership group has a chance to put their stamp on the team and I look forward to seeing how the team changes, develops, and performs in the next few years.

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Lack of cap savvy, inexperience, and lack of higher education are concerns, but as long as he's smart enough to hire good people under him to address his deficits, we should be fine. He's risen quickly in the hockey world and that has to be for a good reason.

Pierre Lebrun has spoken very highly of him so far this morning, so I have some hope!

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