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#67 Max Pacioretty 2015-2016


ColRouleBleu

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  • 4 weeks later...
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Not sure if it was noted after the awards but i was just going through the voting totals and Pacioretty was 6th in Selke voting, which is a nice nod. Bergeron & Toews were miles ahead (getting almost all the first place votes) but there wasnt a huge difference between 3rd and 6th. Another strong 2 way season & i could easily see him creeping into the top 3 or 4.

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Amazing.....great start to the season, and he's the new Captain, and no posts here since September? I guess maybe that's a good sign in these forums.....a sign of not having done anything really bad to complain of.

Or, now that he's no longer on pace for 82 goals, perhaps he's been relegated to the "what have you done for me lately" thread.

I think he just might hit the 40-goal milestone this year, if things keep up. Rolling four good lines should make things at least somewhat easier.

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In Max's post-game comments he immediately pointed out how the team has been crap in the past two games. At least they recognize that fact.

Good to hear because sometimes we think it is the coach and the players don't say too much. Patches and Price will need to point that out a little more I think. It has more impact when the captain is saying it.

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In Max's post-game comments he immediately pointed out how the team has been crap in the past two games. At least they recognize that fact.

Specifically, he mentioned they didn't like the number of chances and shots they gave up, and that one of their goals was to win the possession game. Nice to know that the attitude towards possession has changed this year. Last season, Therrien stated possession didn't mean very much, so it seems like there's been a bit of a culture shift for the better.

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Three games in a row now he's taken a bad penalty in the offensive zone. Last night he let his man go for the goal against. He hasn't been great the last few games.

Probably frustrated because he isn't carrying the team offensively. If I could, I would tell him not to worry because he will have to do it again eventually.

I posted a lot of numbers in the past about how Plekanec and Pacioretty are not well suited to playing with each other, so I thought I would check back to see if that has changed.

I wasn't aware until now that last season, when with Plekanec, Pacioretty was only producing at a rate of 1.66 G/60 at even strength.

The year before it was 0.96.

Despite their end of season point totals, it apparently had little to do with playing on a line together.

Pacioretty's 8 year even strength production rate is 2.68 G/60.

With Plekanec, it is 2.33 over an 8 year period.

This season it is 2.43, so we could potentially see further regression in production from that line, either slightly closer to the career average, or a more precipitous drop toward the numbers from the last 2 seasons.

For comparison, Pacioretty's career rate is 3.10 G/60 with Gallagher and 3.15 with Desharnais.

There are good reasons for separating Pacioretty and Desharnais, but decreasing Pacioretty's production isn't supposed to be one of them.

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Probably frustrated because he isn't carrying the team offensively. If I could, I would tell him not to worry because he will have to do it again eventually.

I posted a lot of numbers in the past about how Plekanec and Pacioretty are not well suited to playing with each other, so I thought I would check back to see if that has changed.

I wasn't aware until now that last season, when with Plekanec, Pacioretty was only producing at a rate of 1.66 G/60 at even strength.

The year before it was 0.96.

Despite their end of season point totals, it apparently had little to do with playing on a line together.

Pacioretty's 8 year even strength production rate is 2.68 G/60.

With Plekanec, it is 2.33 over an 8 year period.

This season it is 2.43, so we could potentially see further regression in production from that line, either slightly closer to the career average, or a more precipitous drop toward the numbers from the last 2 seasons.

For comparison, Pacioretty's career rate is 3.10 G/60 with Gallagher and 3.15 with Desharnais.

There are good reasons for separating Pacioretty and Desharnais, but decreasing Pacioretty's production isn't supposed to be one of them.

I think you need to take those numbers with a grain of salt. The straight-up comparison shows you Pacioretty does better with other guys than with Plekanec BUT let's take into account why that might be. Desharnais is a weak defensive player. Even Therrien knows it, and he's always done his best to shelter DD and give him a high percentage of O-zone starts. Plekanec, on the other hand, is our best defensive center and frequently draws D zone starts and shifts at tough times in the game (increased minutes defending leads late in games, when the goal of shifts is really not to score as much). If you look at opposition match-ups, this also does a disservice to Plekanec, as he is often picked to go head-to-head with better players. So Pacioretty's offensive production may be a bit lower with Plekanec than with Desharnais, but I don't think the situational play of lines like that are comparable because the coach is employing those two lines in very different manners. The Pacman-Pleks line was one of the hottest lines to start this season, with lots of goals and the best production numbers on the team, and they were doing that despite really tough D zone starts (the DD and Galchenyuk lines were getting the O zone starts). I think the question here is not which center is the best fit for playing with Pacioretty, but what situation you want him playing in, a two-way role or a strictly offensive one.

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I think you need to take those numbers with a grain of salt. The straight-up comparison shows you Pacioretty does better with other guys than with Plekanec BUT let's take into account why that might be. Desharnais is a weak defensive player. Even Therrien knows it, and he's always done his best to shelter DD and give him a high percentage of O-zone starts. Plekanec, on the other hand, is our best defensive center and frequently draws D zone starts and shifts at tough times in the game (increased minutes defending leads late in games, when the goal of shifts is really not to score as much). If you look at opposition match-ups, this also does a disservice to Plekanec, as he is often picked to go head-to-head with better players. So Pacioretty's offensive production may be a bit lower with Plekanec than with Desharnais, but I don't think the situational play of lines like that are comparable because the coach is employing those two lines in very different manners. The Pacman-Pleks line was one of the hottest lines to start this season, with lots of goals and the best production numbers on the team, and they were doing that despite really tough D zone starts (the DD and Galchenyuk lines were getting the O zone starts). I think the question here is not which center is the best fit for playing with Pacioretty, but what situation you want him playing in, a two-way role or a strictly offensive one.

Valid points, but the larger the drop-off gets, the more you have to re-consider the role you are placing our best offensive forward in. Considering deployment as a contributing factor, I would argue even more strongly against a Pacioretty and Plekanec combination.

As for their work together early this season, they aren't exactly playing off each other to get those contributions. It's more a sum total of individual efforts. So I would argue further that they didn't need to be playing on the same line to produce the majority of their goals.

I agree that the line performs well in all other aspects, but I also believe we could separate them and create a better overall picture. The alternative is relying on our 3rd line to do the majority of our scoring, as we don't really have a second line right now, just a mish-mash of players Therrien doesn't know how to use.

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I think you need to take those numbers with a grain of salt. The straight-up comparison shows you Pacioretty does better with other guys than with Plekanec BUT let's take into account why that might be. Desharnais is a weak defensive player. Even Therrien knows it, and he's always done his best to shelter DD and give him a high percentage of O-zone starts. Plekanec, on the other hand, is our best defensive center and frequently draws D zone starts and shifts at tough times in the game (increased minutes defending leads late in games, when the goal of shifts is really not to score as much).

This makes me wish there was publicly available zone-start adjusted line statistics, which I can't seem to find anywhere. That would be very illuminating, I think.

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