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2016-17 Habs Lines


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9 hours ago, PuckPundit said:

This! Notwithstanding the trio represent the top 3 individual forwards of the roster, that line's performance has been abysmal! Output does not equal the sum of its parts. When secondary scoring is available to compensate, the team can still eke out a win. If not, it is the worst performing "top" line of any playoff bound team.

Please remove Weber from OT and replace him with Benn. Weber always give me the jitters in OT. If he loses the puck battle, it's basically gone case unless a forward rushes back in time to defend.

Another reason PK was a better player...  we miss him in OT

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On 3/21/2017 at 8:23 PM, RicochetII said:

Pacioretty - Galchenyuk - Gallagher
Lehkonen - Plekanec - Radulov
Byron - Danault - Shaw

Probably moot now since it looks like Chucky will be playing the wing for a while but yes, id like to try these lines.  

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1 hour ago, maas_art said:

Probably moot now since it looks like Chucky will be playing the wing for a while but yes, id like to try these lines.  

I'm disappointed, but have no problem with Galchenyuk playing wing, under the following conditions:

1. He produces better from the wing.
2. Playing wing doesn't affect his attitude (ie: He doesn't hate playing wing, or still view himself as a center).
3. We don't keep shifting him between wing and center. Once he's declared a winger, he stays there.
4. Bergevin brings in viable 1st and 2nd line centers, so there is no further need for Chucky to play there.

I'm actually somewhat interested in seeing Hockey Shaw (alter ego of Blundering Pest Shaw) at center, and how he performs there with Galchenyuk on his wing. Good opportunity for him. I don't think the likelihood of that line being productive is high, but I will be more than happy if it is. I don't like that we took apart The line with Danault, as they were proving to be an effective 3rd line.

If they were going to go that route however, I would have preferred Shaw between Galchenyuk and Gallagher. Call it the Scrambled eGG line. Shaw is the scrambler and the two Gally's are what's left of the former EGG line.

Pacioretty - Danault - Radulov
Galchenyuk - Shaw - Gallagher
Lehkonen - Plekanec - Byron

I would also prefer Lehkonen remain on the LW with Byron on the RW in that scenario. Lehkonen has just started looking dangerous again, and Byron can use his speed from either side of the ice. I think he plays right side on the PK anyway?
 

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14 minutes ago, RicochetII said:

Pacioretty - Danault - Radulov
Galchenyuk - Shaw - Gallagher
Lehkonen - Plekanec - Byron

Not too shabby actually.  Like you, id still prefer the third line like it was but I guess if Julien feels we need to switch around centres, Danault is probably the only guy who can move up to Chucky's spot.  

Its funny how line juggling under Julien isnt nearly the concern it was under Therrien simply because Julien knows how to line-match and deploy - oh, and he has a system. lol. 

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1 hour ago, maas_art said:

Not too shabby actually.  Like you, id still prefer the third line like it was but I guess if Julien feels we need to switch around centres, Danault is probably the only guy who can move up to Chucky's spot.  

Its funny how line juggling under Julien isnt nearly the concern it was under Therrien simply because Julien knows how to line-match and deploy - oh, and he has a system. lol. 

Agreed. CJ & MT are diametrically opposed. CJ=skill, communication & confidence VS MT=Pee-Wee hockey mentality, personal vendettas & lack of communication.

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15 hours ago, maas_art said:

Not too shabby actually.  Like you, id still prefer the third line like it was but I guess if Julien feels we need to switch around centres, Danault is probably the only guy who can move up to Chucky's spot.  

Its funny how line juggling under Julien isnt nearly the concern it was under Therrien simply because Julien knows how to line-match and deploy - oh, and he has a system. lol. 

I don't tend to mind the changes as much now, but I do want to see some consistency before the playoffs.

9 hours ago, PuckPundit said:

So the top line is completely broken and useless.

And nothing can be done about it.

Who dares break Radulov and Pacioretty up?

Radu to 2nd line and Lehkonen promoted to top?:4224:

It doesn't help that teams are able to pretty much focus on Radulov. It's nice when he can outmuscle and maneuver around 2-3 guys to come up with the puck, but Pacioretty needs to get in there to make it more of an even battle, more frequently. I feel like everyone thinks they should wait around an open area for Radulov to magically get them the puck sometimes. Radulov is great at one on one battles, but he's getting outnumbered with more frequency.

That line needs to simplify. Fight for the puck, get it back to the point, get open, pass pass shoot, fight for the puck, get it to the point, get open, pass pass shoot, repeat.

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I know many have lost complete faith in Tomas Plekanec as an offensive force (and perhaps overall player) and point quickly to his contract at 6 million. But I do not agree with this assessment all things considered...

He has had to contend with a revolving-door of players for the last few years and by choice of coach and management used in lessor offensive roles because it was determined he was the defacto two-way/leaning toward defensive center that could counter another team's top lines. Yes he is paid quite a bit under current circumstances... at no fault of his own IMHO.

My thinking... play him at a position that coincides more with his contract and give him greater offensive responsibility (ie. - 1st or 2nd line center)... then judge. He has had success before in that position and given the right opportunity could be effective again IMO.

Why would... Pacioretty-Plekanec-Radulov be such a bad choice as a top line? Or Pacioretty-Plekanec-Gallagher as another? Galchenyuk-Plekanec-Radulov? Galchenyuk-Plekanec-Gallagher?

I do not have an issue with this if we have such an abundance of 3rd-4th line centers and players.

 

 

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21 minutes ago, Habs_Hockey_Nutz said:

I know many have lost complete faith in Tomas Plekanec as an offensive force (and perhaps overall player) and point quickly to his contract at 6 million. But I do not agree with this assessment all things considered...

He has had to contend with a revolving-door of players for the last few years and by choice of coach and management used in lessor offensive roles because it was determined he was the defacto two-way/leaning toward defensive center that could counter another team's top lines. Yes he is paid quite a bit under current circumstances... at no fault of his own IMHO.

My thinking... play him at a position that coincides more with his contract and give him greater offensive responsibility (ie. - 1st or 2nd line center)... then judge. He has had success before in that position and given the right opportunity could be effective again IMO.

Why would... Pacioretty-Plekanec-Radulov be such a bad choice as a top line? Or Pacioretty-Plekanec-Gallagher as another? Galchenyuk-Plekanec-Radulov? Galchenyuk-Plekanec-Gallagher?

I do not have an issue with this if we have such an abundance of 3rd-4th line centers and players.

 

 

I actually like the idea of giving Pleks a chance with offensive line mates. We do have enough guys now that can play the defensive side. I also don't see the others having that much more offensive talent than Pleks. It couldn't hurt at this point to try!

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2 hours ago, Habs_Hockey_Nutz said:

Why would... Pacioretty-Plekanec-Radulov be such a bad choice as a top line? Or Pacioretty-Plekanec-Gallagher as another? Galchenyuk-Plekanec-Radulov? Galchenyuk-Plekanec-Gallagher?

I do not have an issue with this if we have such an abundance of 3rd-4th line centers and players.

Considering how well our 3rd line was working before, i dont see why not.  its worth a shot at least:

Pacioretty - Plekanec- Radulov
Byron - Galchenyuk - Gallagher
Lehkonen - Danault - Shaw

We get back that really effective 3rd line,  Galchenyuk reunites with Gallagher & has our #2 goal scorer on his left and the only real question is: can Pleks play a top 2 centre role again... but i dont think its much more of a risk than Danault there. 


Wont happen though, im sure. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Should use the remaining games for experiments and player auditions. Rest key players! If I was coach, the lines for games till end of season would be:

 

Lehkonen-Galchenyuk-Shaw

Hudon-Scherbak-Carr

King-McCarron-Mitchell 

Martinsen-Ott-Flynn

Beaulieu-Petry

Sergachev-Juulsen

Nesterov-Emelin 

Lindgren

Montoya

Forget the Ice Caps' PO hopes. They aren't going anywhere under Lefebvre.

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Other then the D being a mess,,,, doesn't look like we're resting anybody tonight up front.

Max Pacioretty - Phillip Danault - Alexander Radulov
Paul Byron - Tomas Plekanec - Brendan Gallagher
Alex Galchenyuk - Andrew Shaw - Artturi Lehkonen
Dwight King - Michael McCarron - Andreas Martinsen

Andrei Markov - Nikita Nesterov
Brandon Davidson - Jeff Petry
Nathan Beaulieu - Brett Lernout
Jordie Benn

Carey Price

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9 minutes ago, kinot-2 said:

Chuckie is being placed on the 4th line with Ott, and Martensen. 

Still?  I mean i get that Julien was not pleased with Chuck's effort and I didnt have a problem with it for a meaningless game but you'd think as we prep for the posts season we would see Chuck move up to at least top 9... 

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9 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Still?  I mean i get that Julien was not pleased with Chuck's effort and I didnt have a problem with it for a meaningless game but you'd think as we prep for the posts season we would see Chuck move up to at least top 9... 

According to CJ, (paraphrasing)," CJ wanted to spread out the scoring to the 4th line". 

Go figure. 

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32 minutes ago, kinot-2 said:

According to CJ, (paraphrasing)," CJ wanted to spread out the scoring to the 4th line". 

Go figure. 

I read a couple of articles about it - sounds like most observers think he's still trying to send a message to chuck (since the 4th liners are such high energy guys he has to 'hustle to keep up").

There seems to be a sense that we wont see Chuck on the 4th line when Wednesday's game rolls around.  We shall see. 


Its a slippery slope, since Chuck is still easily our most talented forward, but im willing to give Julien a lot more slack since he's doing almost everything else right. Hopefully he knows what he's doing. 

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2 minutes ago, maas_art said:

I read a couple of articles about it - sounds like most observers think he's still trying to send a message to chuck (since the 4th liners are such high energy guys he has to 'hustle to keep up").

There seems to be a sense that we wont see Chuck on the 4th line when Wednesday's game rolls around.  We shall see. 


Its a slippery slope, since Chuck is still easily our most talented forward, but im willing to give Julien a lot more slack since he's doing almost everything else right. Hopefully he knows what he's doing. 

CJ has tried just about everything to get Chuck moving in the right direction. Chuck has been on every line both at center and wing. This is about the last option. 

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47 minutes ago, kinot-2 said:

CJ has tried just about everything to get Chuck moving in the right direction. Chuck has been on every line both at center and wing. This is about the last option. 

At a certain point though, you have to let your players work out of their slumps.   

You can argue that he was not as effective on the top line with Radu/Patches (although i think a little more time when the games were meaningless would have been good) but can anyone actually say he's a detriment to the shaw/lehkonen line?  Slumping or not, Galchenyuk is still a top 9 forward on this team. If it werent for the fact that Byron-Pleks-Gallagher has looked so good, id make him mandatory in my top 6 but you have to at least give Chuck the talent level of Shaw/Leks to play with.  Give him Martinsen and Ott & he'll never break out of his slump. 


That said, I understand this is not simply about a slump.  Julien clearly has concerns (they seem to centre around effort) and as I said earlier, I willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.  All i know is that this is a much better team with an engaged and effective Galchneyuk than it is without him. 

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46 minutes ago, kinot-2 said:

CJ has tried just about everything to get Chuck moving in the right direction. Chuck has been on every line both at center and wing. This is about the last option. 

Don't get this "moving in the right direction" business. He was the team's 3rd leading point-getter despite injuries and 2nd leading player in PPG. He did this despite the linemate AND position shuffle. His defensive play wasn't fantastic but the same can be said of King, Martinsen, Ott, Flynn, Mitchell, and so on. The thing I don't get is that skill players get judged more harshly on every other aspect of their game, yet a guy like King can be promoted and isn't required to produce goals or points or even play an all-around game to the extent Chucky is. It's like passing the message is more important than actual play.

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I'll never understand why there's so much negativity around Galchenyuk. Is it just jealousy because Matthews is better? Like yeah he'll never be the elite top center we hoped for and he'll never be on Matthews' level but he's a bonafide top line forward and putting him on the 4th line doesn't help short, medium, or long term. I jsut don't get this idea he's some massive bust that needs to get his game together or whatever. No he's not Matthews and he'll never be at that level but he is demonstrably a Duchene level player which is still really valuable.

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37 minutes ago, Noob616 said:

I'll never understand why there's so much negativity around Galchenyuk. Is it just jealousy because Matthews is better? Like yeah he'll never be the elite top center we hoped for and he'll never be on Matthews' level but he's a bonafide top line forward and putting him on the 4th line doesn't help short, medium, or long term. I jsut don't get this idea he's some massive bust that needs to get his game together or whatever. No he's not Matthews and he'll never be at that level but he is demonstrably a Duchene level player which is still really valuable.

But what's tough to understand is why that's 2 completely different coaches that felt essentially the same way, heck even the stupid under 23 World Cup team didn't want him as an injury replacement. It's not an isolated incident with 1 iffy coaching decision, it's a few now. I don't really understand it.

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17 minutes ago, roy_133 said:

But what's tough to understand is why that's 2 completely different coaches that felt essentially the same way, heck even the stupid under 23 World Cup team didn't want him as an injury replacement. It's not an isolated incident with 1 iffy coaching decision, it's a few now. I don't really understand it.

Yeah same here, maybe there's something we don't know about because I can't make sense of it otherwise. Like I understand why Therrien didn't like Galchenyuk's game but it's very strange to me that Julien has him on the 4th line ~6 weeks in.

I really do expect he'll get traded and end up getting 1st line minutes and 65+ points somewhere else though.

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Lines at practice today.

Pacioretty-Danault-Radulov
Byron-Plekanec-Gallagher
King-Shaw-Lehkonen
Galchenyuk-Ott-Martinsen

 

Markov - Weber
Benn - Petry
Beaulieu - Nesterov

Price
Montoya

Missing: Emelin (LBI), Davidson, flu.

power play:
Pacioretty - Shaw - Radulov
Markov - Weber

Lehkonen - Galchenyuk - Gallagher
Beaulieu - Petry

 

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1 hour ago, roy_133 said:

But what's tough to understand is why that's 2 completely different coaches that felt essentially the same way, heck even the stupid under 23 World Cup team didn't want him as an injury replacement. It's not an isolated incident with 1 iffy coaching decision, it's a few now. I don't really understand it.

Agreed. Its very very odd.  It reminds me a little of how Datsyuk was handled in Detroit (albeit for only the first 2 or 3 years).  It was like they felt he was uber skilled but not meeting his potential & that frustrated the team.  As he went into contract negotiations he was almost dealt away (good sources said we had a deal in principle involving Souray and Zednik (plus a first i think) for him. 

of course something changed, he scored 87 points the next season  & the rest, as they say, is history.

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