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2017-18 The Rumors Thread


BigTed3
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Elliotte Friedman suggesting the Oilers should call the Habs about Pacioretty and ask what the price tag is.

Also suggestions from the TSN insider group that all of Ana, LA, and NYR could/would be in on Pacioretty if he were available.

You have an elite goal-scorer on a very friendly contract for two more years. This is a player who could command a very big price tag in a trade. As I said before, a contender would probably give up more assets because they know they can squeeze him under the cap and get very good value for the cap hit, which helps a lot in a Cup run. A team that is all in now to try and win might pay dearly for Pacman.

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48 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Elliotte Friedman suggesting the Oilers should call the Habs about Pacioretty and ask what the price tag is.

Also suggestions from the TSN insider group that all of Ana, LA, and NYR could/would be in on Pacioretty if he were available.

You have an elite goal-scorer on a very friendly contract for two more years. This is a player who could command a very big price tag in a trade. As I said before, a contender would probably give up more assets because they know they can squeeze him under the cap and get very good value for the cap hit, which helps a lot in a Cup run. A team that is all in now to try and win might pay dearly for Pacman.

I wonder if we could unload patches and weber for RNH, Darnell Nurse and Jesse Puljujarvi

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1 hour ago, Ravadak said:

I wonder if we could unload patches and weber for RNH, Darnell Nurse and Jesse Puljujarvi

We might get more if we split it into two different trades. I think you could easily ask for Nurse and Puljujarvi for Pacioretty. And Weber is worth more than RNH in my opinion. Much harder to find a #1 defenceman than a 2nd-3rd string center.

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3 hours ago, habsisme said:

I don't think they will ever do a rebuild so we are just spinning our wheels. At this point, how can you rebuild with Price's contract? With Weber? If we could get rid of those guys, then you can start really rebuilding 

:2008122810303:

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19 hours ago, habsisme said:

I don't think they will ever do a rebuild so we are just spinning our wheels. At this point, how can you rebuild with Price's contract? With Weber? If we could get rid of those guys, then you can start really rebuilding 

the leafs traded phaneuf, so anythings possible 

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19 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

Elliotte Friedman suggesting the Oilers should call the Habs about Pacioretty and ask what the price tag is.

Also suggestions from the TSN insider group that all of Ana, LA, and NYR could/would be in on Pacioretty if he were available.

You have an elite goal-scorer on a very friendly contract for two more years. This is a player who could command a very big price tag in a trade. As I said before, a contender would probably give up more assets because they know they can squeeze him under the cap and get very good value for the cap hit, which helps a lot in a Cup run. A team that is all in now to try and win might pay dearly for Pacman.

 

17 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

We might get more if we split it into two different trades. I think you could easily ask for Nurse and Puljujarvi for Pacioretty. And Weber is worth more than RNH in my opinion. Much harder to find a #1 defenceman than a 2nd-3rd string center.

Totally agree on both.  I dont see MB making any smart moves (meaning, he'll be more likely to trade guys like Galchenyuk, Scherbak or Juulsen than players who will see declining value asap.  

Even though I dont believe MB will, If i was GM I would trade:
Pacioretty (would be good for 2 more years most likely but then command a big raise & will be poor value)
Weber (i am one of the few who actually likes him but id be shocked if he doesnt see a steep decline pretty soon - need to get value for him before that)
Gallagher (I LOVE Gally but lets face it, his body cannot keep up with his heart)
Petry (A good fit on this team but at his age decline will start so might as well maximize return while you can)
Shaw (not sure what value he'd bring back, but he's not a core piece despite being youngish)
Alzner (like shaw, dont know about value but i would move him for basically anything. He's not helping our defense so he has no place on it)
Benn (as above)
Schlemko(as above)

I would consider trading:
Price
(if we got the right package, im fine with it, but here's a guy who could possibly keep us respectable during a rebuild. We'll have the money if we rebuild properly anyway)
Byron (he's a nice complimentary piece.  Im not giving him away for nothing but if we get decent value, im ok with moving him)
Anyone else not on one of these 3 lists.

I would NOT consider trading under almost any circumstance:
Drouin 
Galchenyuk
Lehkonen
Hudon 
Mete 
Danault 
Anyone in Laval who hasnt been given a chance yet

 

 

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8 minutes ago, maas_art said:

 

Totally agree on both.  I dont see MB making any smart moves (meaning, he'll be more likely to trade guys like Galchenyuk, Scherbak or Juulsen than players who will see declining value asap.  

Even though I dont believe MB will, If i was GM I would trade:
Pacioretty (would be good for 2 more years most likely but then command a big raise & will be poor value)
Weber (i am one of the few who actually likes him but id be shocked if he doesnt see a steep decline pretty soon - need to get value for him before that)
Gallagher (I LOVE Gally but lets face it, his body cannot keep up with his heart)
Petry (A good fit on this team but at his age decline will start so might as well maximize return while you can)
Shaw (not sure what value he'd bring back, but he's not a core piece despite being youngish)
Alzner (like shaw, dont know about value but i would move him for basically anything. He's not helping our defense so he has no place on it)
Benn (as above)
Schlemko(as above)

I would consider trading:
Price
(if we got the right package, im fine with it, but here's a guy who could possibly keep us respectable during a rebuild. We'll have the money if we rebuild properly anyway)
Byron (he's a nice complimentary piece.  Im not giving him away for nothing but if we get decent value, im ok with moving him)
Anyone else not on one of these 3 lists.

I would NOT consider trading under almost any circumstance:
Drouin 
Galchenyuk
Lehkonen
Hudon 
Mete 
Danault 
Anyone in Laval who hasnt been given a chance yet

 

 

The issue I have with keeping Price during a rebuild if you subscribe to the theory that a successful rebuild will take 3 to 5 years .... he may be well past his best before shelf life and absolutely unmovable at that point. We would then have a sub par goaltending scenario with a boat anchor salary with which to deal. Better to move him now if possible in my opinion and develop Lindgren or whoever will constitute the next waive of younger and cheaper talent .....

If Carey knows the team is going into a full rebuild mode, I would be surprised if he himself would not want to be moved to a contender.

 

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30 minutes ago, maas_art said:

 

Totally agree on both.  I dont see MB making any smart moves (meaning, he'll be more likely to trade guys like Galchenyuk, Scherbak or Juulsen than players who will see declining value asap.  

Even though I dont believe MB will, If i was GM I would trade:
Pacioretty (would be good for 2 more years most likely but then command a big raise & will be poor value)
Weber (i am one of the few who actually likes him but id be shocked if he doesnt see a steep decline pretty soon - need to get value for him before that)
Gallagher (I LOVE Gally but lets face it, his body cannot keep up with his heart)
Petry (A good fit on this team but at his age decline will start so might as well maximize return while you can)
Shaw (not sure what value he'd bring back, but he's not a core piece despite being youngish)
Alzner (like shaw, dont know about value but i would move him for basically anything. He's not helping our defense so he has no place on it)
Benn (as above)
Schlemko(as above)

I would consider trading:
Price
(if we got the right package, im fine with it, but here's a guy who could possibly keep us respectable during a rebuild. We'll have the money if we rebuild properly anyway)
Byron (he's a nice complimentary piece.  Im not giving him away for nothing but if we get decent value, im ok with moving him)
Anyone else not on one of these 3 lists.

I would NOT consider trading under almost any circumstance:
Drouin 
Galchenyuk
Lehkonen
Hudon 
Mete 
Danault 
Anyone in Laval who hasnt been given a chance yet

 

 

I think most of us like Weber. It's just that we LOVED Subban>

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1 hour ago, eldag said:

The issue I have with keeping Price during a rebuild if you subscribe to the theory that a successful rebuild will take 3 to 5 years .... he may be well past his best before shelf life and absolutely unmovable at that point. We would then have a sub par goaltending scenario with a boat anchor salary with which to deal. Better to move him now if possible in my opinion and develop Lindgren or whoever will constitute the next waive of younger and cheaper talent .....

If Carey knows the team is going into a full rebuild mode, I would be surprised if he himself would not want to be moved to a contender.

 

I understand that theory also and like i said, I wouldnt be opposed to keeping him, but I do think that the risk holding onto him long-term is not as great as any other older player on our roster.  Goal is traditionally the one position that you can play well longer, so I think its worth the risk.  I just dont see us getting a phenomenal deal for him, so Id rather keep him and take on that (in my opinion) smaller risk. 

1 hour ago, habs1952 said:

I think most of us like Weber. It's just that we LOVED Subban>

Totally - and im in that camp too - would MUCH rather have kept Subban - but there are some who are sooooo upset they cant see any of the value Weber brings.  Having said that, we need to get out from under him NOW because i think his value is likely the same as it was last year when we acquired him, but it wont be for long. 

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2 hours ago, maas_art said:

 

Totally agree on both.  I dont see MB making any smart moves (meaning, he'll be more likely to trade guys like Galchenyuk, Scherbak or Juulsen than players who will see declining value asap.  

Even though I dont believe MB will, If i was GM I would trade:
Pacioretty (would be good for 2 more years most likely but then command a big raise & will be poor value)
Weber (i am one of the few who actually likes him but id be shocked if he doesnt see a steep decline pretty soon - need to get value for him before that)
Gallagher (I LOVE Gally but lets face it, his body cannot keep up with his heart)
Petry (A good fit on this team but at his age decline will start so might as well maximize return while you can)
Shaw (not sure what value he'd bring back, but he's not a core piece despite being youngish)
Alzner (like shaw, dont know about value but i would move him for basically anything. He's not helping our defense so he has no place on it)
Benn (as above)
Schlemko(as above)

I would consider trading:
Price
(if we got the right package, im fine with it, but here's a guy who could possibly keep us respectable during a rebuild. We'll have the money if we rebuild properly anyway)
Byron (he's a nice complimentary piece.  Im not giving him away for nothing but if we get decent value, im ok with moving him)
Anyone else not on one of these 3 lists.

I would NOT consider trading under almost any circumstance:
Drouin 
Galchenyuk
Lehkonen
Hudon 
Mete 
Danault 
Anyone in Laval who hasnt been given a chance yet

 

 

I like this scenario very much. Too bad we have a GM who is intransigent, politically motivated and with a lack of understanding with today's NHL.

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28 minutes ago, maas_art said:

I understand that theory also and like i said, I wouldnt be opposed to keeping him, but I do think that the risk holding onto him long-term is not as great as any other older player on our roster.  Goal is traditionally the one position that you can play well longer, so I think its worth the risk.  I just dont see us getting a phenomenal deal for him, so Id rather keep him and take on that (in my opinion) smaller risk. 

Totally - and im in that camp too - would MUCH rather have kept Subban - but there are some who are sooooo upset they cant see any of the value Weber brings.  Having said that, we need to get out from under him NOW because i think his value is likely the same as it was last year when we acquired him, but it wont be for long. 

THIS - IMO these fans hatred towards MB is directed towards Weber because he's the guy that replaced Subban, which is an obvious thing to do. However it becomes monotonous when everything he does wrong is so magnified because of the trade.  

However, trade aside, we need to get out from under this contract sooner than later. Unfortunately the only way will be for MB to get fired. "fingers crossed" There's no way it happens while he is the manager of this team. He will never admit it was a mistake. He will never admit it was because of PK's personality. 

 

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22 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

We might get more if we split it into two different trades. I think you could easily ask for Nurse and Puljujarvi for Pacioretty. And Weber is worth more than RNH in my opinion. Much harder to find a #1 defenceman than a 2nd-3rd string center.

I think Weber value has really dimished, at 32 now, 7.8 million cap..Yikes. If Edmonton offered RNH at a cap hit of 6 million I would be all over that. I would have preferred than droiun for Sergachev.

I think including him with patches gives you a better return on the investment. 

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3 minutes ago, Ravadak said:

I think Weber value has really dimished, at 32 now, 7.8 million cap..Yikes.

I would disagree. I think the number of GMs who would value him highly would be lower but i bet you could get very strong offers from 7-8 teams. Yes he's a year older from when we landed him but he also passed the test of performing for 2 different clubs (Which is always a risk for a 1 team player).  His age/contract isnt so scary - since there's a very good chance he'll retire if his play drops off - although it should be to Nashville as they'll be on the hook for most of it. 

When we traded for him over half the GMs polled felt we won.  Now even if that number is  1/3 or 1/4 you still have a decent market in a league of 31 teams. 

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2 hours ago, maas_art said:

I understand that theory also and like i said, I wouldnt be opposed to keeping him, but I do think that the risk holding onto him long-term is not as great as any other older player on our roster.  Goal is traditionally the one position that you can play well longer, so I think its worth the risk.  I just dont see us getting a phenomenal deal for him, so Id rather keep him and take on that (in my opinion) smaller risk. 

Totally - and im in that camp too - would MUCH rather have kept Subban - but there are some who are sooooo upset they cant see any of the value Weber brings.  Having said that, we need to get out from under him NOW because i think his value is likely the same as it was last year when we acquired him, but it wont be for long. 

If the cap goes up I don't think Price's contract will be much of a hindrance until he's about 36 years old. Getting rid of Plekanec , Alzner and Shaw could also free up another 14 mil in cap space. But we need to get some youth in those spots.  

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In order of ease of moving contracts (accounting for salary, term, age, and skill of player):

1. Pacioretty

2. Galchenyuk

3. Gallagher

4. Price

5. Weber

6. Shaw

7. Alzner

 

Even with the huge money and term afforded to Weber and Price, they're still game changers that other teams will take on if they feel it can put them over the top for a Cup. If Edmonton or Pittsburgh or Washington or Chicago or Anaheim or so on can add this player and make themselves a top-3 contender for the Cup for the next couple of years, they will bite the bullet on what it costs them at the end of the deal. I'd have been fine with adding Weber to our team to make a Cup run, just not doing it by subtracting our best position player in Subban. Pittsburgh will add Weber if given the chance, but they won't do it by giving us Malkin. Edmonton won't give up Draisaitl or McDavid to acquire Price. Chicago isn't trading Kane for Pacioretty. That was our mistake. MB went "all in" to make a Cup run, but he subtracted a bigger piece than he got back, so it just didn't make any sense. Instead, he shortened the Cup window for nothing.

 

 

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1 hour ago, BigTed3 said:

Agreed. Bergevin's obviously getting bad advice from somewhere. He's got a big team and it doesn't seem to be helping him.

I am not sure if he is getting bad advice or if he has just become the Donald trump of the hockey world.

When he traded Subban, the analytics guy they hired showed him that it was a bad trade so not only did he make the trade anyway he also canned the analytics guy

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11 hours ago, Ravadak said:

 

I am not sure if he is getting bad advice or if he has just become the Donald trump of the hockey world.

When he traded Subban, the analytics guy they hired showed him that it was a bad trade so not only did he make the trade anyway he also canned the analytics guy

The analytics guy probably couldn't account for leadership and grit, so MB HAD let him go.

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