State of the Habs

[Regis22]

20 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

 

Forwards with speed and skill? Check.

 

Im not ready to "Check " this yet

[BigTed3]

6 minutes ago, Regis22 said:

Im not ready to "Check " this yet

You're entitled to that opinion, but I think you're probably harder to convince than the average fan.

[Regis22]

9 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

You're entitled to that opinion, but I think you're probably harder to convince than the average fan.

That's cause im old and I was fortunate to see the Habs actually win a few Stanley Cups . Todays team just doesn't have  " it " whatever " it " is .

 

[Habs=stanleycup]

7 minutes ago, Regis22 said:

That's cause im old and I was fortunate to see the Habs actually win a few Stanley Cups . Todays team just doesn't have  " it " whatever " it " is .

 

[habs1952]

59 minutes ago, Regis22 said:

That's cause im old and I was fortunate to see the Habs actually win a few Stanley Cups . Todays team just doesn't have  " it " whatever " it " is .

 

[East_Coast_Juggalo_13]

1 hour ago, Regis22 said:

Im not ready to "Check " this yet

I think Drouin is a step in the right direction.  I think the youth movement should be on in MTL.  I thought that 2 years ago.  Our veteran core (With the exception of Patches) is underwhelming at best.  Our only hope is in the youth core we're supposed to have been developing the past 6 years.  The sad truth is, the guy who refuses to admit this team is in rebuild mode, is the guy in charge of player movement and development.  Due to the breakdown in either drafting or development (or both), MTL is a perennial pretender.  Our assets sold off for the most complete collection of 4th liners and 7th defense-men.

[BigTed3]

I'll put this another way... in past years, we've seen a lot of guys get jobs because of grit. It's refreshing this year to see the forward group built mainly around skill. It's not to say the skill is fantastic up and down the line-up, but when I look at the 12 guys who started the first two games, I'd say 9 of the 12 are there for skill, not for grit. The exceptions would be Shaw, Danault, and DLR, and I think the latter two still provide good skill for the roles they're being used in. So it's a nice change from the Therrien era and even from last year's trade deadline thought process.

[ChiLla]

20 hours ago, habs1952 said:

*8 or 9 "new" faces in the lineup sounds like rebuilding to me. 

MB tried to rebuild his defence on the fly and failed miserably, making us much slower and even less mobile. Deadline rentals aside, the only meaningful changes on offence were Drouin/Radulov and Hudon/Desharnais though. Then he signed Price and Alzner to massive long-term deals. Regardless of the number of new players in the lineup, this doesn't look like a rebuild to me – the core remains essentially the same. And if this truly is MB's idea of how to properly rebuild a franchise and set it up for long-term success, he needs to be shown the door right now.

 

[RuudNuij]

On 6-10-2017 at 10:26 PM, Habs=stanleycup said:

I view our problems quite differently as you know, I think we suffer horribly up front. The problem is that losing Radulov and replacing him with Drouin was not the answer IMO. We should have kept Radulov AND added Drouin thereby making our offence much stronger. Radulov got us almost a point per game last season.

Of course it remains to be seen how things go as the season develops but I remain skeptical. My opinion is that we have too weak an offence and that is the first priority which needs to be addressed.

i have to agree, these are my thoughts as well, the Washington loss shows again that 40 shots on goal gave us 1 goal .. and only the one goal.

i have seen many stat facts here, yet have not heard the optimists drop this fact, as it happens in many games the Canadiens play.

We have no offense, and skilled players score, so I argue the fact that we excel in skill as some others here suggest.

but we can`t go back and simply have lost Radulov, and although Drouin is very promising, we did not gain much BECAUSE we gave up Radulov.

Drouin and Pacioretty will put up the numbers, .. as for the rest, it`s sort of a wait and see, for in scoring, the Canadiens lack consistency.

 

[archey]

I don't play Pokémon go so any reference to how our defense is ever going stop anyone....Talk about having to listen to the coaches...Man!  This is like kid stuff though....

It might work out but Gally A and B AND Pleks really need to find the handle cause Druin won't and the new guys I don't trust with such awesome responsibility as like a Markov took...even a Gorges.

[jeff33]

from H I/O, RightNyder:

I find it fascinating that people believe that removing 55-pointish Radulov and replacing him with 55-pointish Drouin equals a giant leap in offence.

Or removing 40-pointish Markov and replacing him with 25-pointish Schlemko/Streit equals another leap.

It remains a team with a winger, two third-liners and a scoreless fourth-liner down the middle; and a pillowy soff captain, a couple of injury-prone little dudes, two young guys with a combined 18 career goals, a lost No. 3 overall pick and various retreads and puds on the wing.

We remain exactly what we’ve been for years under Bergevin – a poorly constructed team with a fantastic goalie. And when said goalie isn’t fantastic or available (see 2015-16), there’s not enough Compound W in the pharmacy to cover all the warts.

Not to mention 10 dudes 30+ on the roster and teams like Toronto in the division with a plethora of young talent.

This isn’t me whining about one game. This is the same tired argument I’ve been making for a couple of years now. And I’m tired of making it.

[Habs=stanleycup]

HIO Show:

 

[Regis22]

1 hour ago, BigTed3 said:

I'll put this another way... in past years, we've seen a lot of guys get jobs because of grit. It's refreshing this year to see the forward group built mainly around skill.

Agree

That's the way the league is going . But this organization appears to be late to acknowledge or accept that  and I don't if the skill on this group is good enough .

[habs1952]

1 hour ago, RuudNuij said:

i have to agree, these are my thoughts as well, the Washington loss shows again that 40 shots on goal gave us 1 goal .. and only the one goal.

i have seen many stat facts here, yet have not heard the optimists drop this fact, as it happens in many games the Canadiens play.

We have no offense, and skilled players score, so I argue the fact that we excel in skill as some others here suggest.

but we can`t go back and simply have lost Radulov, and although Drouin is very promising, we did not gain much BECAUSE we gave up Radulov.

Drouin and Pacioretty will put up the numbers, .. as for the rest, it`s sort of a wait and see, for in scoring, the Canadiens lack consistency.

 

Bingo!! We basically stayed the same as last year.

[BigTed3]

9 hours ago, jeff33 said:

from H I/O, RightNyder:

I find it fascinating that people believe that removing 55-pointish Radulov and replacing him with 55-pointish Drouin equals a giant leap in offence.

Or removing 40-pointish Markov and replacing him with 25-pointish Schlemko/Streit equals another leap.

It remains a team with a winger, two third-liners and a scoreless fourth-liner down the middle; and a pillowy soff captain, a couple of injury-prone little dudes, two young guys with a combined 18 career goals, a lost No. 3 overall pick and various retreads and puds on the wing.

We remain exactly what we’ve been for years under Bergevin – a poorly constructed team with a fantastic goalie. And when said goalie isn’t fantastic or available (see 2015-16), there’s not enough Compound W in the pharmacy to cover all the warts.

Not to mention 10 dudes 30+ on the roster and teams like Toronto in the division with a plethora of young talent.

This isn’t me whining about one game. This is the same tired argument I’ve been making for a couple of years now. And I’m tired of making it.

Drouin and Radulov are not equivalent. Radulov played about as well as he is ever going to play last year and when you sign a  guy for 4-5 years, you have to account for how he'll play over the length of that contract. Drouin is considerably younger and getting better. He hasn't peaked yet, whereas Radulov has. There is a much higher likelihood Drouin will be better going forward. Same reasons Subban >> Weber.

As for Drouin being a winger playing center, it's an issue, but it's only an issue if he doesn't make the adjustment. So far, he's looked pretty good down the middle. So if he can continue that way, then Drouin is even more valuable than Radulov, because a good center is almost always more impactful than a good winger.

I think Danault is an excellent 3rd line center, and DLR or Mitchell are acceptable as 4th line centers. The big issue down the middle is the 2C but thus far, Plekanec is playing well on his current line, so it's less of a pressing issue than the mess that is our defence.

 

9 hours ago, Regis22 said:

Agree

That's the way the league is going . But this organization appears to be late to acknowledge or accept that  and I don't if the skill on this group is good enough .

Well at least we're starting with the right philosophy. Forward group is far from perfect, but if we're comparing it to last year's group, it's a decent improvement. No Ott, King, Martinsen, DSP, Desharnais... all addition by subtraction.

 

 

[BigTed3]

3 games, 3 goals for, 2 of which were short-handed... offence is a problem, but a lot of it has to do with the poor support from the defence. Something has to change. If I'm grading the Habs' defencemen on their performances thus far

- Mete: A-

- Weber: B

- Davidson: C-

- Petry: D

- Alzner: F

- Benn: F

- Streit: F

Can't win with that.

 

[GreekHockeyCoach]

1 hour ago, BigTed3 said:

3 games, 3 goals for, 2 of which were short-handed... offence is a problem, but a lot of it has to do with the poor support from the defence. Something has to change. If I'm grading the Habs' defencemen on their performances thus far

- Mete: A-

- Weber: B

- Davidson: C-

- Petry: D

- Alzner: F

- Benn: F

- Streit: F

Can't win with that.

 

Agreed. It's going to be a long season with those defensemen. So basically, no defense and no offense. Eventually
Carey will stop caring, which I'm hoping he'll do so that MB gets the boot and we can maybe get a GM that can assemble something that looks like an NHL team.

[jeff33]

3 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

Drouin and Radulov are not equivalent. Radulov played about as well as he is ever going to play last year and when you sign a  guy for 4-5 years, you have to account for how he'll play over the length of that contract. Drouin is considerably younger and getting better. He hasn't peaked yet, whereas Radulov has. There is a much higher likelihood Drouin will be better going forward. Same reasons Subban >> Weber.

As for Drouin being a winger playing center, it's an issue, but it's only an issue if he doesn't make the adjustment. So far, he's looked pretty good down the middle. So if he can continue that way, then Drouin is even more valuable than Radulov, because a good center is almost always more impactful than a good winger.

I think Danault is an excellent 3rd line center, and DLR or Mitchell are acceptable as 4th line centers. The big issue down the middle is the 2C but thus far, Plekanec is playing well on his current line, so it's less of a pressing issue than the mess that is our defence.

I was going to make this post individually but it ties in here.

for the record, I think getting drouin was the best move we have made in a while, im happy with him so far, and he has a ceiling to improve to unlike radulov so I'm with you on all of that.

I agree with the 2c assessment, which was what I came in here to write. danault plays left with plek and shaw, chuck has to go play with hudon and lehkonen. as far as what we got....thats the obvious thing. 

 

3 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

 

 

 

[vegasrick]

58 minutes ago, GreekHockeyCoach said:

Agreed. It's going to be a long season with those defensemen. So basically, no defense and no offense. Eventually
Carey will stop caring, which I'm hoping he'll do so that MB gets the boot and we can maybe get a GM that can assemble something that looks like an NHL team.

*sigh* If only we had a Norris-caliber defenseman who could really move the puck.  Oh, wait......

[jeff33]

7 minutes ago, vegasrick said:

*sigh* If only we had a Norris-caliber defenseman who could really move the puck.  Oh, wait......

too bad we cant get one, GM's never trade a guy like that if they got one. 

I watched the game with Dad ( a  lifelong habs fan, 75 years old) amd the fam today after thanksgiving dinner.

 We got those 2 goals disallowed and I said well thats our quota, game is over.....and everyone laughed. I didn't.

After my nostradamus-like prophecy came to pass, dad says...heres the thing Jeff....if you put a for sale sign on this team....who would anyone want?

let that marinate

 

[PuckPundit]

Who predicts 2-8-0 after the first 10 games?

[jwlk]

15 minutes ago, jeff33 said:

too bad we cant get one, GM's never trade a guy like that if they got one. 

I watched the game with Dad ( a  lifelong habs fan, 75 years old) amd the fam today after thanksgiving dinner.

 We got those 2 goals disallowed and I said well thats our quota, game is over.....and everyone laughed. I didn't.

After my nostradamus-like prophecy came to pass, dad says...heres the thing Jeff....if you put a for sale sign on this team....who would anyone want?

let that marinate

 

i like this

[jwlk]

10 minutes ago, PuckPundit said:

Who predicts 2-8-0 after the first 10 games?

wont be that bad

[jeff33]

Just now, jwlk said:

i like this

thank you ill be here all year lol

[jeff33]

11 minutes ago, PuckPundit said:

Who predicts 2-8-0 after the first 10 games?

i dunno but i DID predict if we dont get out of the gate hot like last year....or have any sort of significant cold streak... theres a real possibility we miss the playoffs. 

my exact words were i see us losing 3 of 5 more often than winning it. we are getting right down to business