BigTed3 Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 Would you deal one problem for another? Lucic is 30 and has 5 years left at 6M per season. Alzner is 29 (but will be 30 at the start of the season) and has 4 years left at 4.625M. Both players have some form of no trade clauses, so let's assume each guy approves the trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs1952 Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 Why dig yourself a bigger hole to get out of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maas_art Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 3 hours ago, BigTed3 said: Would you deal one problem for another? Lucic is 30 and has 5 years left at 6M per season. Alzner is 29 (but will be 30 at the start of the season) and has 4 years left at 4.625M. Both players have some form of no trade clauses, so let's assume each guy approves the trade. Not straight up. We take on the bigger contract and we get the (slightly) older player signed for longer. From a roster standpoint i think it makes sense - we could use Lucy anywhere from 2nd - 4th line, and he shouldnt actively hurt us. Alzner is worse than almost any other option we have and is only viable as a 3rd pairing guy. But i have to think that Lucic is a bigger burden, contract wise, than Alzner. I dont know if they'd give us a lot more although you could try a multiple piece deal, like: Lucic + 10ova for Alzner, Shaw + 35ova or Lucic + Kleftbom for Alzner, Shaw & a 4th Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windoe Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 Montreal and Edmonton have so many trade possibilities that would benefit both clubs, personally I'd make that trade straight up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs_Hockey_Nutz Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 I voted against this because of contract and term... however there can be some merit to doing this providing an additional asset (i.e. - prospect or draft pick) offered by Edmonton can offset taking on the higher contract. Lucic can at least bring muscle, size and scoring more than Alzner and could rebound in the right circumstance. I'm almost convincing myself this would be a good trade for the Habs... yeesch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maas_art Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 1 hour ago, Habs_Hockey_Nutz said: I voted against this because of contract and term... however there can be some merit to doing this providing an additional asset (i.e. - prospect or draft pick) offered by Edmonton can offset taking on the higher contract. Lucic can at least bring muscle, size and scoring more than Alzner and could rebound in the right circumstance. I'm almost convincing myself this would be a good trade for the Habs... yeesch! haha. yeah, i was thinking the same thing!! Part of me wants to see what Alzner can do with a new defensive coaching staff. He wasnt always terrible & even with us he had a few reasonably good games. Maybe we can turn him into a serviceable #4-6 guy. In that case he's more valuable to us than yet another LW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noob616 Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 Probably no unless it comes with a great sweetner. I do think just in a vacuum Lucic is the more valuable player and the cap space isn't super important since the Habs have so much and will be bad for a while, but I think it just digs the hole deeper and deeper. I'm at the point where I'm kinda just taking stock of what the next GM will have to take over and it's not pretty, adding Lucic would just make that an even deeper hole to climb out of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manatee-X Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 I don't want either one, but I think that with Lucic's reputation it would be easier to get rid of him compared to Alzner. Hence, I'd make the trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maas_art Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 13 minutes ago, Manatee-X said: I don't want either one, but I think that with Lucic's reputation that it would be easier to get rid of him compared to Alzner. Hence, I'd make the trade. Thats an interesting point. I hadnt really considered the idea of moving one of them for someone of value in a year or 2. With Lucic its certainly conceivable he rebounds to a 20g 50pt season in the next year or 2. At that point you may actually be able to move him for a young asset. I dont see Alzner's value ever going back up much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs1952 Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 Maybe we should just trade all our youth for 30 year old veterans on the downside of their careers. Geesus......we're supposed to be getting younger and faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennifer_rocket Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 I would make that trade because I think Milan Lucic would provide more value at LW for the Montreal Canadiens than Karl Alzner would at LD. It also may help the team by maintaining a depth at LW should Max Pacioretty be traded in the off-season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANADIENS27 Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 Why do we need a goon like Lucic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habituallity Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 We don’t but it would be great to get the tenth overall pick to go with number 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maas_art Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 10 minutes ago, CANADIENS27 said: Why do we need a goon like Lucic? We dont. The question is whether we need a lucic more than we need an alzner (and what the oilers would include, if anything, to sweeten the pot) The other valid point is whether we could flip either for an asset down the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff33 Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 2 minutes ago, maas_art said: We dont. The question is whether we need a lucic more than we need an alzner (and what the oilers would include, if anything, to sweeten the pot) The other valid point is whether we could flip either for an asset down the road. Thats what I was gonna say. Id do it because 1. Alzner is the worst guy on the team arguably and he wont get sat out with that contract so its like constant black hole 2. the samemight be true of lucic, but i think he is still tradeable. Id trade him at the deadline for whatever I could get and have neither of them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habberwacky Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 Lucic's cap hit is worse than his annual payout as he receives 3.5 signing bonus July 1 but I still think Alzner would be easier to move, manage or support in hope that he can have a better season. Lucic has been let go due to poor performance, signed long term and now second year in to his new contract bottomed out again. Between watching him and Alzner I much prefer watching Alzner and believe he is more likely to have a bounce back season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTed3 Posted June 12, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 Here's why I wouldn't, despite the fact Lucic is the better player today: 1. Lucic is signed for the extra year and at a higher cap hit. His trade value has got a higher negative value IMO, and I don't think he would have a positive trade value for another 2-3 years minimum. Maybe none until the last year of his contract, at which point he may be utterly useless as a player. 2. Lucic is also more expensive to buy out. With Alzner, if you buy him out this year or next, you have one year where you pay a cap penalty of about 4M. With Lucic, you pay that penalty of more than 4M for 3-4 years. It's just harder to buy out Lucic. 3. The Habs aren't competitive for a Cup right now, but they could be (or at least the plan should be) in 2-3 years. So eating more cap hit for that extra year hurts us at a time when we'll need to save all our pennies to make a run. Yes, we have cap space to spare this year to eat a bad contract, but we should be eating a contract that's bad short-term, not one that hurts us long-term. 4. I'd definitely talk about taking Lucic if we also get the #10 pick. But that's a different trade than Lucic for Alzner straight up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regis22 Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 No What for , so another younger forward doesn't' get an opportunity . The vicious cycle continues of getting over the hill players to take up a roster spot of a young guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caperns61 Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 No No NO. Even the thought of adding a player like Lucic with his contract makes no sense at all... If we really want Edmontons tenth pick i am sure there are other ways to get that other then then adding an over he hill over paid player like Lucic. Just the thought of it scares the bi geezes out of me.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs_Hockey_Nutz Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 after reading further comments I am definitely back to my vote against this trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTed3 Posted June 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2018 Elliotte Friedman says he believes Edmonton will find a way to move Lucic but adds that he thinks they will have to toss in a sweetener to make the deal happen. This is in contrast to the Edmonton media, who seem to think they're getting a prospect or good pick back in exchange for Lucic. Based on a few things the Oilers media has written recently though, it really seems like they're working for the team and writing unreasonable things they think should happen based on overrating their own players. Friedman added that Lucic has a NMC and that he wonders if Lucic would refuse a trade to another Canadian team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs1952 Posted June 13, 2018 Report Share Posted June 13, 2018 50 minutes ago, BigTed3 said: Elliotte Friedman says he believes Edmonton will find a way to move Lucic but adds that he thinks they will have to toss in a sweetener to make the deal happen. This is in contrast to the Edmonton media, who seem to think they're getting a prospect or good pick back in exchange for Lucic. Based on a few things the Oilers media has written recently though, it really seems like they're working for the team and writing unreasonable things they think should happen based on overrating their own players. Friedman added that Lucic has a NMC and that he wonders if Lucic would refuse a trade to another Canadian team. All Edmonton needs to do to trade Lucic is eat some of that salary. I think Lucic might accept a trade to Vancouver but I don't think the Canucks are in the market of getting older. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs=stanleycup Posted June 13, 2018 Report Share Posted June 13, 2018 6 hours ago, habs1952 said: All Edmonton needs to do to trade Lucic is eat some of that salary. I think Lucic might accept a trade to Vancouver but I don't think the Canucks are in the market of getting older. Correct, but with Bergevin at the helm over here, there's a better chance that we get more of the old, overpaid players to fill our roster as that seems to be his preference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry-Launstein-Jr Posted June 13, 2018 Report Share Posted June 13, 2018 I don't like this one at all. Lucic was a big pest in Boston and was penalized quite often. For a team who will need to stay out of the penalty box to have any chance of winning, Lucic does not make sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennifer_rocket Posted June 13, 2018 Report Share Posted June 13, 2018 How about the argument that Lucic's expression of anger and brashness on the ice will probably reflect the exact way we feel as fans with the direction of the organization, thus Lucic appearing empathetic to the plight of the fans, thus likely becoming a fan favorite? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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