State Of The Habs 2018-19

[Larry-Launstein-Jr]

I started the last State Of The Habs about this time last year. The Habs are now in a clear forced rebuild - brought upon by an aging roster and the need to rebuild their entire organization. I know we all want to see the Habs win the Stanley Cup. But I'm afraid it's not happening anytime soon. There are some very rough days ahead. I'm afraid a new GM and coaching staff are going to be needed. This team got blasted from the top. Maybe the new arrivals and the stockpiling of draft choices will help at least build some depth. And maybe a couple of them will someday emerge as stars. But it's not going to happen anytime soon.

[Regis22]

State Of The Habs 2018-19 = worse than the 2017-2018 Habs

[BigTed3]

RDS has an article up about Bergevin's best July 1st signings. #1 is Radulov by a long shot. They list Prust as #2, which it might be (and which shows how bad a day it is for signing people). What's laughable is that they list Tom Gilbert, Al Montoya, and Francis Bouillon as being "the good" signings. When you look at MB's record on July 1st, he should just not make any moves that day. But also laughing at how dumb the list is to call those signings good. They were all bad outside of Radulov.

[PuckPundit]

Falling for Hughes. 

[Graeme-1]

42 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

RDS has an article up about Bergevin's best July 1st signings. #1 is Radulov by a long shot. They list Prust as #2, which it might be (and which shows how bad a day it is for signing people). What's laughable is that they list Tom Gilbert, Al Montoya, and Francis Bouillon as being "the good" signings. When you look at MB's record on July 1st, he should just not make any moves that day. But also laughing at how dumb the list is to call those signings good. They were all bad outside of Radulov.

Not that I'm one to defend Bergevin, but you can basically say the same about any GM in the league (other than Dubas). July 1st has basically turned into a day of regret across the league (DBG did a good article on the different types of deals and how almost all are "bad" in some sense: https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/free-agency-deals-fit-hit-term-scale/ - interestingly one of the few in the "good" column was Radulov). 

All things considered, I don't blame Bergevin much for lack of success finding UFAs since there simply have been so few available on non-ridiculous terms, and those weren't exactly impact players - even if they wanted to sign here. Given the lack of impact players available, I'm really not upset that we didn't take on bad contracts to get a mid-tier player or two.   Even in the bad column, most were low-risk gambles that didn't work out but didn't actively hurt us (Alzner a clear exception).

Drafting, development, trades, and managing our own signings & cap are all areas I'll criticize Bergevin, but for UFAs I just don't think there was much he could have done that would have made a major difference.

[truehabs]

In order for this to be a true rebuild, we must first change the culture of this organization.  It is time to get rid of the "must speak french" mentality when true habs fans care about winning and not what language the GM and Coach speak.  By having this mentality you are limiting your options on who you can hire as a coach and GM, would you rather hire a coach/GM who would bring you a cup or several or would you rather hire a coach/GM that can speak the language.

[jennifer_rocket]

I think a culture change would have to come from the very top. It starts with Molson. He had his display during the end-of-season news conference. He tried to make us believe the culture would change. But it's just more nonsense so far. "Attitude," etc. I'm also highly skeptical that Molson would ever put winning before certain French language requirements. And the only way Molson and his co-ownership group sell the Montreal Canadiens is if it's no longer a worthwhile investment. And we'll never know if new owners would be better or worse than Molson and co.

[BigTed3]

The Gazette has a poll right now, as to whether fans feel optimistic about the upcoming season. 91% of people currently say no and that a rebuild of some sort is necessary. So much for a chance in culture. People know it's needed. It just hasn't happened and likely won't as long as Bergevin remains in charge. I think that question could pretty much read "should Bergevin be fired" and it would likely be over 90% too in favor of sacking him.

[Graeme-1]

It's really amazing given how hockey fans can agree on next to nothing, everyone seems to agree Bergevin needs to go and how bleak Montreal's future is.  The Weber trade had its defenders, MT had his defenders, but I'm just not hearing anyone defend MB's overall performance now.

[Habs=stanleycup]

41 minutes ago, Graeme-1 said:

It's really amazing given how hockey fans can agree on next to nothing, everyone seems to agree Bergevin needs to go and how bleak Montreal's future is.  The Weber trade had its defenders, MT had his defenders, but I'm just not hearing anyone defend MB's overall performance now.

Molson is ultimately responsible. First of all for keeping this guy on, and secondly for the false promises to the fans about a new openness in communication and a commitment to bring us an on ice product that is competitive enough for the playoffs, let alone for the Stanley Cup.

It's all lip service as far as I'm concerned, that much is blatantly obvious.

I wouldn't be surprised if ,not spending the cap, is the actual goal this year in order to offset the income loss Molson will suffer due to fan outrage and dissatisfaction over this sad sac team which is so poorly managed.

How much lower can we go with these two?

A once respected team, the Habs have become the laughingstock of the NHL because of Bergevin & Molson IMO.

[jennifer_rocket]

29 minutes ago, Habs=stanleycup said:

Molson is ultimately responsible. First of all for keeping this guy on, and secondly for the false promises to the fans about a new openness in communication and a commitment to bring us an on ice product that is competitive enough for the playoffs, let alone for the Stanley Cup.

It's all lip service as far as I'm concerned, that much is blatantly obvious.

I wouldn't be surprised if ,not spending the cap, is the actual goal this year in order to offset the income loss Molson will suffer due to fan outrage and dissatisfaction over this sad sac team which is so poorly managed.

How much lower can we go with these two?

A once respected team, the Habs have become the laughingstock of the NHL because of Bergevin & Molson IMO.

Oddly enough, I think people will be less upset about spending to the cap this year than last year. I honestly believe fans will just be uninterested this year. If the team continues to commit to rebuilding and picks up some exciting young stars in the coming years, that's when fans will come back. Hopefully, for the time being, a lack of interest will continue to hit Molson in his bank account when people don't turn up to buy concessions and apparel and so on.

[Habs=stanleycup]

4 hours ago, truehabs said:

In order for this to be a true rebuild, we must first change the culture of this organization.  It is time to get rid of the "must speak french" mentality when true habs fans care about winning and not what language the GM and Coach speak.  By having this mentality you are limiting your options on who you can hire as a coach and GM, would you rather hire a coach/GM who would bring you a cup or several or would you rather hire a coach/GM that can speak the language.

100% Agree. Politics has hobbled our team for far too long and it's time for Molson to grow some cajonas and say no more. Either that, or sell because we are going nowhere fast with our current state of affairs.

[Habs=stanleycup]

43 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

Oddly enough, I think people will be less upset about spending to the cap this year than last year. I honestly believe fans will just be uninterested this year. If the team continues to commit to rebuilding and picks up some exciting young stars in the coming years, that's when fans will come back. Hopefully, for the time being, a lack of interest will continue to hit Molson in his bank account when people don't turn up to buy concessions and apparel and so on.

Agreed, fans WILL lose interest this upcoming season, having the desired financial effect on Molson. However, said rebuild MUST happen without Bergevin, period. He is the face of our team, the face of failure.

[BigTed3]

2 hours ago, Graeme-1 said:

It's really amazing given how hockey fans can agree on next to nothing, everyone seems to agree Bergevin needs to go and how bleak Montreal's future is.  The Weber trade had its defenders, MT had his defenders, but I'm just not hearing anyone defend MB's overall performance now.

I think most people felt we had a very promising young core when Bergevin took over. He blew that window. He put his personal vendettas against certain players ahead of the team, he put his friendships with his coaches and staff ahead of team success by choosing not to fire them in a timely manner. He's lied to the media and fans over and over and over. He's showed bad judgment. He's shown he hasn't learned from his mistakes by continuing to go back to the grit/character/attitude well. So I think people are just sick of Bergevin. He's going into his 7th year as GM, and the team's outlook is bleaker than it has been at any other point in his regime. So I don't think anyone thinks he's the man to turn it around, and as long as he's here, no one believes we have the ability to build a cup contender.

 

1 hour ago, jennifer_rocket said:

Oddly enough, I think people will be less upset about spending to the cap this year than last year. I honestly believe fans will just be uninterested this year. If the team continues to commit to rebuilding and picks up some exciting young stars in the coming years, that's when fans will come back. Hopefully, for the time being, a lack of interest will continue to hit Molson in his bank account when people don't turn up to buy concessions and apparel and so on.

If we had promising young stars and a will to play them, I'd be interested. What I don't want to see is our continuing to pretend Price and Weber and Shaw and Plekanec and Schlemko and Alzner and so on are all suddenly going to find another gear that they haven't had for the past couple of years. I'm fed up of being fed lies, I'm fed up of the dishonesty about injuries and reasons for trades and transparency and so on, and I'm fed up of not feeling like we're making any progress. There's the old saying, if you're not going forward, you're going backwards. Bergevin is stuck in the past and his beliefs that we'll simply play the same line-up and be better is foolish.

 

[Habs=stanleycup]

29 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

I think most people felt we had a very promising young core when Bergevin took over. He blew that window. He put his personal vendettas against certain players ahead of the team, he put his friendships with his coaches and staff ahead of team success by choosing not to fire them in a timely manner. He's lied to the media and fans over and over and over. He's showed bad judgment. He's shown he hasn't learned from his mistakes by continuing to go back to the grit/character/attitude well. So I think people are just sick of Bergevin. He's going into his 7th year as GM, and the team's outlook is bleaker than it has been at any other point in his regime. So I don't think anyone thinks he's the man to turn it around, and as long as he's here, no one believes we have the ability to build a cup contender.

 

If we had promising young stars and a will to play them, I'd be interested. What I don't want to see is our continuing to pretend Price and Weber and Shaw and Plekanec and Schlemko and Alzner and so on are all suddenly going to find another gear that they haven't had for the past couple of years. I'm fed up of being fed lies, I'm fed up of the dishonesty about injuries and reasons for trades and transparency and so on, and I'm fed up of not feeling like we're making any progress. There's the old saying, if you're not going forward, you're going backwards. Bergevin is stuck in the past and his beliefs that we'll simply play the same line-up and be better is foolish.

 

Couldn't have said it better myself Ted.

Totally fed up and tired of the lies, incompetence and politics.

[habby67]

1 hour ago, Habs=stanleycup said:

Couldn't have said it better myself Ted.

Totally fed up and tired of the lies, incompetence and politics.

Trump cannot be president forever. Oh wait...

[Habs=stanleycup]

32 minutes ago, habby67 said:

Trump cannot be president forever. Oh wait...

[jennifer_rocket]

15 hours ago, Habs=stanleycup said:

Agreed, fans WILL lose interest this upcoming season, having the desired financial effect on Molson. However, said rebuild MUST happen without Bergevin, period. He is the face of our team, the face of failure.

I agree that Bergevin should NOT be apart of our rebuild. I would rather have Timmins as our G.M. now than Bergevin. Unfortunately, I believe Molson is going to keep him on for another few years. It's a slap in the face to the fans.

[26NCounting]

MB will be gone before Christmas, the team is going to be sooo bad that the fickle fans in Montreal will not attend the games.  

[jennifer_rocket]

12 minutes ago, 26NCounting said:

MB will be gone before Christmas, the team is going to be sooo bad that the fickle fans in Montreal will not attend the games.  

The team was already so bad. That Molson has kept him this long, in my mind, seems to indicate he plans to keep him through rebuilding. Or "retooling." I wouldn't be surprised to see Bergevin here in 2-3 seasons from now.

[maas_art]

On 7/8/2018 at 11:10 AM, BigTed3 said:

The Gazette has a poll right now, as to whether fans feel optimistic about the upcoming season. 91% of people currently say no and that a rebuild of some sort is necessary. So much for a chance in culture. People know it's needed. It just hasn't happened and likely won't as long as Bergevin remains in charge. I think that question could pretty much read "should Bergevin be fired" and it would likely be over 90% too in favor of sacking him.

This.

Look MB had his chance and he took a promising team and messed it up. Its time to move on.   Its entirely possible that if he stays we will become a winning team in a couple of years but thats probably more due to dumb luck at this point.  Its time to move on and let someone else have a chance.  

[maas_art]

14 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

The team was already so bad. That Molson has kept him this long, in my mind, seems to indicate he plans to keep him through rebuilding. Or "retooling." I wouldn't be surprised to see Bergevin here in 2-3 seasons from now.

Same.  I think Molson has drunk the Kool Aid.   MB points to guys like Poile and says "look how long it took him to build a winner" and Molson buys it. I hope im wrong but I fully expect MB to remain in charge for a while. 

[jennifer_rocket]

33 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Same.  I think Molson has drunk the Kool Aid.   MB points to guys like Poile and says "look how long it took him to build a winner" and Molson buys it. I hope im wrong but I fully expect MB to remain in charge for a while. 

Yep.

And the big problem I have is... well, just watch... Imagine we actually start to put together a promising young team with exciting prospects. But MB's still here and he just tears it all apart again in 3-4 years, leaving us in another conundrum.

[jeff33]

1 minute ago, jennifer_rocket said:

Yep.

And the big problem I have is... well, just watch... Imagine we actually start to put together a promising young team with exciting prospects. But MB's still here and he just tears it all apart again in 3-4 years, leaving us in another conundrum.

kotkaniemi comes up and does a spinerama. oh my god another hot dog. trade him for toews

[Larry-Launstein-Jr]

On 7/8/2018 at 1:08 PM, truehabs said:

In order for this to be a true rebuild, we must first change the culture of this organization.  It is time to get rid of the "must speak french" mentality when true habs fans care about winning and not what language the GM and Coach speak.  By having this mentality you are limiting your options on who you can hire as a coach and GM, would you rather hire a coach/GM who would bring you a cup or several or would you rather hire a coach/GM that can speak the language.

Ken Dryden said it best when he said in his book "The Game," about the choice the Canadiens have - do they want to win or stay French-Canadian? And this was all the way back to 1984!  This is not meant to offend the French Canadian members of this board - this is what Dryden actually said.