State Of The Habs 2018-19

[habsisme]

3 minutes ago, CaptWelly said:

I would much rather make the playoffs. The intensity the crowds , playoff hockey is all a great experience. Usually games are played tougher and generally less penalties no 3 on 3 OT . The HAB's have been one of the best 5on5 teams in the league so playoff hockey actually gives us a better chance. Price gets hot you never know. Upsets happen. 

 

Montreal will not beat tampa, it will not even be competitive. If it was competitive, i would still want to do it, but it simply won't be.

With the lottery you never know, look at Carolina. Plus I want to save this team the embarrassment of being swept

[maas_art]

41 minutes ago, habsisme said:

I'd rather miss the playoffs then face Tampa because there is no chance of winning and giving the experience to the young kid. We would likely get swept, maybe win one game. I'd rather enter the lottery, even with a small chance of winning 

 

3 minutes ago, CaptWelly said:

I would much rather make the playoffs. The intensity the crowds , playoff hockey is all a great experience. Usually games are played tougher and generally less penalties no 3 on 3 OT . The HAB's have been one of the best 5on5 teams in the league so playoff hockey actually gives us a better chance. Price gets hot you never know. Upsets happen. 

 

Id definitely be torn. I think even losing in the first round is worthwhile to some of our young players. This is actually a very young team. I dont think any playoff experience would hurt and while its incredibly unlikley we beat TB there's always a (infinitesimally) small chance we can win and there's a decent chance we win one or two.  Those can go a long way with a young team.

If we finish say 9th in the conference, the change of us moving up in the draft is pretty slim. I dont think the increase in quality from a pick of a few spots at mid-level first round will make too much of a difference. Not as much as getting some PO experience. 

[habsisme]

34 minutes ago, maas_art said:

 

Id definitely be torn. I think even losing in the first round is worthwhile to some of our young players. This is actually a very young team. I dont think any playoff experience would hurt and while its incredibly unlikley we beat TB there's always a (infinitesimally) small chance we can win and there's a decent chance we win one or two.  Those can go a long way with a young team.

If we finish say 9th in the conference, the change of us moving up in the draft is pretty slim. I dont think the increase in quality from a pick of a few spots at mid-level first round will make too much of a difference. Not as much as getting some PO experience. 

see for me its not an experience if its not even competitive. And while i think we can win one game, it would take at least two to make it competitive and I don't think we can beat Tampa twice if five game that would allow for a 6th game. They are just too good

[maas_art]

14 minutes ago, habsisme said:

see for me its not an experience if its not even competitive. And while i think we can win one game, it would take at least two to make it competitive and I don't think we can beat Tampa twice if five game that would allow for a 6th game. They are just too good

Its a tough call. you're probably right that it would most likely end up 4-0 or 4-1 but funny things happen in the playoffs.  Both Domi and Drouin I think will elevate their game.  Guys like Price and Weber have also had huge playoff performances in the past (as well as some stinkers mind you).  Of course they can match our firepower (and then some) but weird bounces can make a huge difference.  I certainly wouldnt bet on us winning but I also wouldnt be surprised to see us take it to 6 games. 

In the end I know the team is going to try to make the post season so its moot - its not like they are going to say "oh best we can finish is 2nd WC so lets throw some games.   I have a feeling we are going to actually end up higher than that. Either 2nd WC or (slim but still possible)  #3 in our division.   I dont feel like its likely we get the 2nd WC. At least I hope we dont. 

[H_T_L]

There are no pushover teams in the playoffs. I'd like to think we'd be a tough draw for any team out there. If it's Tampa,,,, so be it. We would have to get through them eventually anyways, if we have any visions of a Cup run.

[campabee82]

22 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Its a tough call. you're probably right that it would most likely end up 4-0 or 4-1 but funny things happen in the playoffs.  Both Domi and Drouin I think will elevate their game.  Guys like Price and Weber have also had huge playoff performances in the past (as well as some stinkers mind you).  Of course they can match our firepower (and then some) but weird bounces can make a huge difference.  I certainly wouldnt bet on us winning but I also wouldnt be surprised to see us take it to 6 games. 

In the end I know the team is going to try to make the post season so its moot - its not like they are going to say "oh best we can finish is 2nd WC so lets throw some games.   I have a feeling we are going to actually end up higher than that. Either 2nd WC or (slim but still possible)  #3 in our division.   I dont feel like its likely we get the 2nd WC. At least I hope we dont. 

Thing is, really just the opening game of the season series was totally controlled by the lightening which was only a 4-1 loss. Game 2 was a 6-5 loss in the last minute of the third and game 3 was a 3-0 loss but all three goals came in the third which means we can play competitively with them and if we compete for 3 periods we could potentially beat them in a 7 game series. 

18 minutes ago, H_T_L said:

There are no pushover teams in the playoffs. I'd like to think we'd be a tough draw for any team out there. If it's Tampa,,,, so be it. We would have to get through them eventually anyways, if we have any visions of a Cup run.

Agreed

37 minutes ago, habsisme said:

see for me its not an experience if its not even competitive. And while i think we can win one game, it would take at least two to make it competitive and I don't think we can beat Tampa twice if five game that would allow for a 6th game. They are just too good

Any playoff experience no matter how good the other team is is good experience. Your not going to see the level of intensity and competitiveness of other teams in the regular season that you do in the playoffs whether its game 1 or game 82 especially from the league leaders because every team entering the playoffs knows that they can be eliminated by ANY team through player loss, lucky bounces and even just good old fashioned hard work. We may not have the same level of talent which to me sounds ridiculous when you look at our record against the top teams in the league which we have either beaten or put up a decent fight in most games only to break down in the final period or to just simply lose in OT, but we can beat any team in a 7 game series as long as we play entire games and to our strengths not theirs.

[habsisme]

41 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Its a tough call. you're probably right that it would most likely end up 4-0 or 4-1 but funny things happen in the playoffs.  Both Domi and Drouin I think will elevate their game.  Guys like Price and Weber have also had huge playoff performances in the past (as well as some stinkers mind you).  Of course they can match our firepower (and then some) but weird bounces can make a huge difference.  I certainly wouldnt bet on us winning but I also wouldnt be surprised to see us take it to 6 games. 

In the end I know the team is going to try to make the post season so its moot - its not like they are going to say "oh best we can finish is 2nd WC so lets throw some games.   I have a feeling we are going to actually end up higher than that. Either 2nd WC or (slim but still possible)  #3 in our division.   I dont feel like its likely we get the 2nd WC. At least I hope we dont. 

yes I am in no way saying that we should try to lose under any circumstances, nor do I think the team will. WC1 is sill in reach too which would be perfect for us; it should be at least a competitive series

[campabee82]

2 minutes ago, habsisme said:

yes I am in no way saying that we should try to lose under any circumstances, nor do I think the team will. WC1 is sill in reach too which would be perfect for us; it should be at least a competitive series

I agree with the first part and understand you weren't saying we shouldn't try my issue is your saying we can't play competitively against the Lightening when we clearly have been all year. I mean if you look at games 2 and 3 alone we could have easily won them. game 3 was a 3rd period breakdown otherwise we were competitive the whole night. and Game 2 was going shot for shot against the leagues highest scoring team and only losing in the last 1:02 of the 3rd ie winnable game. 7 game series we play like we did for those 5 periods alone and we could easily take down the Lightening. The real problem is the team isn't consistently playing 3 periods.

[maas_art]

8 minutes ago, campabee82 said:

I agree with the first part and understand you weren't saying we shouldn't try my issue is your saying we can't play competitively against the Lightening when we clearly have been all year. I mean if you look at games 2 and 3 alone we could have easily won them. game 3 was a 3rd period breakdown otherwise we were competitive the whole night. and Game 2 was going shot for shot against the leagues highest scoring team and only losing in the last 1:02 of the 3rd ie winnable game. 7 game series we play like we did for those 5 periods alone and we could easily take down the Lightening. The real problem is the team isn't consistently playing 3 periods.

Yeah I think it would be highly unlikely that we could beat the lightning but in the event of us meeting them in the first round I think the team would go into it believing they could.

I have a feeling we will turn it up a notch as a team in the post season. There's a few guys on the roster that I think are built for the playoffs. 

 

[jennifer_rocket]

18 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Yeah I think it would be highly unlikely that we could beat the lightning but in the event of us meeting them in the first round I think the team would go into it believing they could.

I have a feeling we will turn it up a notch as a team in the post season. There's a few guys on the roster that I think are built for the playoffs. 

I don't think we could beat the Bolts or Leafs if we meet them in the play-offs. However, that doesn't mean I don't want to see them try!  I think any experience would be better than no experience. At this point, I'm off the "lose for Hughes" bandwagon and the difference between 10th and 20th overall in draft order probably won't make a huge difference to our team in 2019-2020 anyway. I vote that the team busts it butt to make it in and we enjoy 4-7 games of play-off hockey!

[CaptWelly]

2 hours ago, habsisme said:

Montreal will not beat tampa, it will not even be competitive. If it was competitive, i would still want to do it, but it simply won't be.

With the lottery you never know, look at Carolina. Plus I want to save this team the embarrassment of being swept

The year we beat Washington and Pittsburgh both anyone would of said the exact same for either match up especially Washington that year they were as dominant as Tampa is this year. I would say we would have a better chance at beating Tampa than getting a high draft pick. I believe the most you can move up is 5 places and we would probably end up at # 15 or 16 if we just miss the playoffs, so we can only move up to maybe pick # 10 or 11.  We would have to completely bottom out at this point to get a draft of 5 or less and the team is going to be trying to make it. 

[CaptWelly]

I will say again that in the playoffs usually the games aren't called the same. There are usually less penalties which actually works in our favor as we have been one of the top teams in the league 5 on 5 all year. I do really think that this team if (hopefully when) will really rally amongst themselves. We also have a fairly young team that will have a lot of energy and enthusiasm. I don't think we'd get totally blown out by anyone and I'm sure it'll be fun to watch!  Much more fun to watch than a draft choice of 10-12. Just missing in our conference it's still draft by overall standings in the league. The eastern so far has been the better conference points wise so either way it's not going to be a high draft pick. Hughes will probably go to Colorado .

[maas_art]

Its official: 

 

Noah Juulsen won’t play again this season. Is scheduled to be back at training camp in September @CanadiensMTL

— Renaud Lavoie (@renlavoietva) March 4, 2019

 

 

 

[jennifer_rocket]

Hopefully he's back and healthy in September!

[maas_art]

33 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

Hopefully he's back and healthy in September!

Lets hope.  It sounds like they are confident he will be but its not like we've been lied to before...

[BigTed3]

On finishing 8th vs 9th? Absolutely you go for 8th. If we were talking a bottom 5 finish vs. 8th, that's different because then you're getting a great pick, but if it's a matter of 16th overall draft choice vs. 15th, that's a bit of a wash. The playoff side of the coin is better for several reasons, some stated above:

1. You get your young team playoff experience

2. It gives you more data to evaluate your current roster on and figure out where your real deficiencies lie and how bad they are

3. You never know what can happen in the playoffs. Maybe TB is better on paper and from the standings, but what if Vasilevskiy hits a cold streak at the worst possible time for them? Or what if Stamkos or Kucherov goes down with a significant injury?

4. We're getting to the point where we have cap space and may need to use it to take the next step. If it comes down to a summertime decision and a key UFA sees us as a playoff team and contender, maybe that's a better thing than seeing us as a team that missed the post-season two years in a row.

5. In particular, maybe if Clb is the team that misses, it leads to the sudden availability of guys like Panarin, Duchene, and Bobrovsky, whereas maybe they stay if they make the playoffs and go on a run. We also have Clb's 2nd rd pick this year, so the worse they do in the standings, the better for that 2nd rounder.

 

That said, if we miss the post-season or if we go out in the first round on account of losing the special teams battle, not sure how you don't fire Kirk Muller in the off-season. Everything else has worked as good as could be expected or better this year, but the PP has been dreadful and without a doubt cost us games. That needs to be fixed. We saw how much the breathe of fresh air with new coaches like Ducharme and Richardson helped, so maybe Muller needs to go too.

[tony5775]

Kirk just signed a new two year deal, doubt he will be let go. Even though I agree 100%. Your 4th reason is the best one. That never occurred to me. Price will need to get over that flu and play all three games in California. Then we have none until next Tuesday. He can get some rest then.

[habs1952]

5 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

 

2. It gives you more data to evaluate your current roster on and figure out where your real deficiencies lie and how bad they are

 

 

If, after an 82 game schedule, you haven't figured out your deficiencies you need to find another line of work. 

[campabee82]

6 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

On finishing 8th vs 9th? Absolutely you go for 8th. If we were talking a bottom 5 finish vs. 8th, that's different because then you're getting a great pick, but if it's a matter of 16th overall draft choice vs. 15th, that's a bit of a wash. The playoff side of the coin is better for several reasons, some stated above:

1. You get your young team playoff experience

2. It gives you more data to evaluate your current roster on and figure out where your real deficiencies lie and how bad they are

3. You never know what can happen in the playoffs. Maybe TB is better on paper and from the standings, but what if Vasilevskiy hits a cold streak at the worst possible time for them? Or what if Stamkos or Kucherov goes down with a significant injury?

4. We're getting to the point where we have cap space and may need to use it to take the next step. If it comes down to a summertime decision and a key UFA sees us as a playoff team and contender, maybe that's a better thing than seeing us as a team that missed the post-season two years in a row.

5. In particular, maybe if Clb is the team that misses, it leads to the sudden availability of guys like Panarin, Duchene, and Bobrovsky, whereas maybe they stay if they make the playoffs and go on a run. We also have Clb's 2nd rd pick this year, so the worse they do in the standings, the better for that 2nd rounder.

 

That said, if we miss the post-season or if we go out in the first round on account of losing the special teams battle, not sure how you don't fire Kirk Muller in the off-season. Everything else has worked as good as could be expected or better this year, but the PP has been dreadful and without a doubt cost us games. That needs to be fixed. We saw how much the breathe of fresh air with new coaches like Ducharme and Richardson helped, so maybe Muller needs to go too.

Don't think firing Muller is the answer as it is the head coach's job to ensure all systems are in place and being executed as designed besides what has it been now 10 or 12 games since CJ took over the PP and they still are doing nothing.

 

57 minutes ago, habs1952 said:

If, after an 82 game schedule, you haven't figured out your deficiencies you need to find another line of work. 

An 82 game schedule is a good evaluation of what a team needs to get INTO the playoffs but the only way you can evaluate a teams needs to win in the playoffs is by playing play off games. We know we need a LHD and a top 6 winger who can actually score but that's just what we know we need to make the playoffs and HOPE to contend but maybe our biggest need to win a series is a middle 6 power forward to stand in front of the net on the PP cause everyone else on the team is able to elevate their game considerably during the playoffs. Drouin and Lehkonen could go on a scoring run in the playoffs and Mete could elevate his play as well. Maybe you can convince Armia to drive the net and use his size and turn him into a power forward, maybe Weal comes in and plays lights out there are a lot of variables in playoff hockey that no matter how many regular season games you play you just can't replicate.

[jennifer_rocket]

So... I was thinking about it a few days ago, but Muller should definitely be removed from powerplay responsibilities if not fired. I mean, I think he should be fired... I don't think you can run a powerplay that badly all season and not face consequences for it. And if it ends up being the reason you miss the post-season... That said, maybe it's not all on Muller. I don't know how much control he has over the PP. Is it 100%? Is it 75%? Is it 50%?

[maas_art]

54 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

 That said, maybe it's not all on Muller. I don't know how much control he has over the PP. Is it 100%? Is it 75%? Is it 50%?

Yeah that's my question too... 

[jennifer_rocket]

34 minutes ago, maas_art said:

Yeah that's my question too... 

Either way, it's one thing I hope the team analyzes and makes a decision on. You can't fail that hard on special teams all season long and not make changes. 

[habsisme]

whoever is in control of the PP, I always think that special teams is on the coaches not the players. We have the right personnel for at least an average PP, this makes no sense to me. They need to fix this 

[maas_art]

1 hour ago, habsisme said:

whoever is in control of the PP, I always think that special teams is on the coaches not the players. We have the right personnel for at least an average PP, this makes no sense to me. They need to fix this 

I agree wholeheartedly. 

Weber, Petry, Reilly at the point?

Drouin, Domi, Kotkaneimi  dishing the puck?

Gallagher, Tatar, Byron etc finishing?

There should be no reason this is not - at very least - a middle of the road PP. 

[jennifer_rocket]

Curiously, have we even had stretches this season (5+ games) where the PP was average or good? I'm not sure how easy/difficult it would be to figure that out. I feel like it's just been putrid all season long. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe there's been weeks where it's been okay.