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State Of The Habs 2018-19


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1 hour ago, jennifer_rocket said:

Damn. I really want Poehling to sign. What happens if he doesn't sign with us this season? Does the potential exist that he can become a free agent in a year or so if he doesn't sign an ELC with us?

yes i believe he becomes a UFA in July of 2020. So there is very little incentive for him not to become a UFA if he goes to college another year. All we would get is a second round pick

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3 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

Nick Suzuki, Ryan Poehling, Jake Evans, Jesperi Kotkaniemi... Not a bad pool of forward prospects to make an impact in the next few years.

absolutely, and much our forward core is currently young as well. We need to draft D early and often this year. Of course, it always best to draft best player available but all things being equal, we need to fill our pantry with defensemen 

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2 minutes ago, habsisme said:

absolutely, and much our forward core is currently young as well. We need to draft D early and often this year. Of course, it always best to draft best player available but all things being equal, we need to fill our pantry with defensemen 

Agreed. I have no idea if the likes of Cale Fleury, Josh Brook, or Noah Juulsen will be difference makers at the NHL level. They all seem really interesting, and Juulsen has established himself as being very close to breaking through full-time, but I think we're going to see a major decline in Weber and Petry soon... We'll need some solid prospects to make the jump in the next few seasons.

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On 3/31/2019 at 0:53 PM, jennifer_rocket said:

Agreed. I have no idea if the likes of Cale Fleury, Josh Brook, or Noah Juulsen will be difference makers at the NHL level. They all seem really interesting, and Juulsen has established himself as being very close to breaking through full-time, but I think we're going to see a major decline in Weber and Petry soon... We'll need some solid prospects to make the jump in the next few seasons.

I think that between Juulsen, Romanov, Brook, Mete, Fleury and even guys like Jordan Harris or Scott Walford might be a solid foundation.  Petry, Weber, Kulak, Folin, Olaffson - these are all pieces that will probably be with us for a bit too.   So I dont feel like our defensive need is dire... but man could you imagine having a top LHD prospect in that group, like say Dahlin, or Heiskanen or Werenski in the mix?    We're really only 1 top flight LHD away from having a solid blueline but trying to add one is nigh impossible.

I almost feel like the best course of action would be to look for an older LHD who is still a good skater - a Jeff Petry at LHD if you will - and then bring a guy like that in & spend our time drafting and/or trading for some top LHD prospects.    I dont think you're adding a top young LHD over the summer but I didnt think MB would have made as many positive changes as he did this last summer so who knows.  

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16 hours ago, maas_art said:

I think that between Juulsen, Romanov, Brook, Mete, Fleury and even guys like Jordan Harris or Scott Walford might be a solid foundation.  Petry, Weber, Kulak, Folin, Olaffson - these are all pieces that will probably be with us for a bit too.   So I dont feel like our defensive need is dire... but man could you imagine having a top LHD prospect in that group, like say Dahlin, or Heiskanen or Werenski in the mix?    We're really only 1 top flight LHD away from having a solid blueline but trying to add one is nigh impossible.

I almost feel like the best course of action would be to look for an older LHD who is still a good skater - a Jeff Petry at LHD if you will - and then bring a guy like that in & spend our time drafting and/or trading for some top LHD prospects.    I dont think you're adding a top young LHD over the summer but I didnt think MB would have made as many positive changes as he did this last summer so who knows.  

Yeah... I think finding that elusive LD piece will be very, very difficult in the off-season. I think we're more likely to get lucky with an internal solution. Kind of how Mete has stepped into an important role with the team. However... that also seems very unlikely. We'll see what MB can manage in the summer. I'm not hopeful our defense will be vastly improved to begin 2019-2020, but maybe we'll be pleasantly surprised. 

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From Berkshire:

- Habs would be 6th in the West right now and in playoffs

- Habs took 8 of 22 pts from games against TB, Bos, and Tor. Played .614 hockey against the rest of the league. So if we had been in any other division other than the toughest one in hockey, we probably safely cruise into the playoffs.

Bottom line is that this team had a very good season overall. Can't do anything about the format of the divisions or playoffs, sometimes it helps you and sometimes it hurts you. There's a lot to build on here, but Habs need to fix the back-up goalie, the left defence, and the PP.

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10 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

From Berkshire:

- Habs would be 6th in the West right now and in playoffs

- Habs took 8 of 22 pts from games against TB, Bos, and Tor. Played .614 hockey against the rest of the league. So if we had been in any other division other than the toughest one in hockey, we probably safely cruise into the playoffs.

Bottom line is that this team had a very good season overall. Can't do anything about the format of the divisions or playoffs, sometimes it helps you and sometimes it hurts you. There's a lot to build on here, but Habs need to fix the back-up goalie, the left defence, and the PP.

agreed on everything and I'm going to hope we win the lottery if we can't get in. 

One thing I do want to say is that despite many players complaining about it, I actually like this playoff format. In fact, I would like to see the wild card spots removed and have 1 to 4 from each division make it. At the point, making it to the 3rd round of the playoff means you won your division, and I think that would actually mean something and really help foster rivalry 

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We did have an improved season. And it's nice to think that were the playoff formatting different we could have made it. However, the worst part about missing out (assuming we do miss out) is going to be Molson and Bergevin touting the season as a massive success. "Look how much better we did!" We could easily regress as a team and miss the post-season AGAIN next year. Our recent seasons look like this:

  • 2015-2016: Did not qualify.
  • 2016-2017: Lost in round one.
  • 2017-2018: Did not qualify.
  • 2018-2019: Did not qualify (assumption).

We have to be skeptical about management again. I don't care that the season was better than last year. It was hard not to be. And yes, Bergevin made some good moves. But you have to evaluate based on the team's overall success... and we haven't had any in the last four seasons. I don't expect Bergevin to get fired... but he HAS to be fired if we miss out again next year.

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3 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

We did have an improved season. And it's nice to think that were the playoff formatting different we could have made it. However, the worst part about missing out (assuming we do miss out) is going to be Molson and Bergevin touting the season as a massive success. "Look how much better we did!" We could easily regress as a team and miss the post-season AGAIN next year. Our recent seasons look like this:

  • 2015-2016: Did not qualify.
  • 2016-2017: Lost in round one.
  • 2017-2018: Did not qualify.
  • 2018-2019: Did not qualify (assumption).

We have to be skeptical about management again. I don't care that the season was better than last year. It was hard not to be. And yes, Bergevin made some good moves. But you have to evaluate based on the team's overall success... and we haven't had any in the last four seasons. I don't expect Bergevin to get fired... but he HAS to be fired if we miss out again next year.

I dont think they are out of the woods. They MUST make the playoffs next year. But its not just that we improved, we have a very young team outside of Price and Weber. And really Bergevin has made all the right moves. We have good young prospects coming up too. I am way happier this year than i was last

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3 minutes ago, habsisme said:

I dont think they are out of the woods. They MUST make the playoffs next year. But its not just that we improved, we have a very young team outside of Price and Weber. And really Bergevin has made all the right moves. We have good young prospects coming up too. I am way happier this year than i was last

I am happier too.

However, prospects are just that until they make a difference at the NHL level. I've heard "The future is bright" about 1,000 times (sorry, yes, exaggeration) since 2005 and we've not been considered a contender in that time frame. Not once.

Kotkaniemi seems legit. Mete too.

However, beyond that... no one has made an iota of difference at the NHL level and until they do... I'm not going to give any praise to Bergevin or his management team. Develop those kids, let's see them make an impact for the Canadiens and not the Rocket. Then I'll give you my cash.

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58 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

I am happier too.

However, prospects are just that until they make a difference at the NHL level. I've heard "The future is bright" about 1,000 times (sorry, yes, exaggeration) since 2005 and we've not been considered a contender in that time frame. Not once.

Kotkaniemi seems legit. Mete too.

However, beyond that... no one has made an iota of difference at the NHL level and until they do... I'm not going to give any praise to Bergevin or his management team. Develop those kids, let's see them make an impact for the Canadiens and not the Rocket. Then I'll give you my cash.

Agreed but at the bare minimum I really think Poehling and Romanov are top 9 F and top 6 D (respectively) players as early as next year (if we can get Romanov out of the KHL, and in his case I'm not positive but I think there is a good chance he could be a top 4 guy, which gives Mete, Weber, Romanov, Petry). I really think we need to find an LD to really take a step forward though. 

One thing that I think you're not including is how good Domi has been, to me, he changed everything on this team (and I hated the trade). He's not only younger but he can legitimately play C, so while we don't have a true "# 1" elite center, with Domi and Kotkaniemi added to Danault, we now have actual center depth. This is night and day compared to last year. Of course we can improve everywhere, but we only have ONE glaring hole, and that's at LD. If we fix that and get an adequate back up (which we may have in the system already but I'd like to sign a veteran as well).

Just buying out Alzner and signing Gardiner, giving Romanov and Poehling an  opportunity to compete, would almost guaranteed a playoff spot next year. 

AND because we really do have so many good young forwards, we could package someone like drouin and this years first (should we not win lottery) and try to get a good LD. 

Last year I saw no options, this year, I'm having trouble ending this post because I have so many ideas

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33 minutes ago, habsisme said:

Agreed but at the bare minimum I really think Poehling and Romanov are top 9 F and top 6 D (respectively) players as early as next year (if we can get Romanov out of the KHL, and in his case I'm not positive but I think there is a good chance he could be a top 4 guy, which gives Mete, Weber, Romanov, Petry). I really think we need to find an LD to really take a step forward though. 

One thing that I think you're not including is how good Domi has been, to me, he changed everything on this team (and I hated the trade). He's not only younger but he can legitimately play C, so while we don't have a true "# 1" elite center, with Domi and Kotkaniemi added to Danault, we now have actual center depth. This is night and day compared to last year. Of course we can improve everywhere, but we only have ONE glaring hole, and that's at LD. If we fix that and get an adequate back up (which we may have in the system already but I'd like to sign a veteran as well).

Just buying out Alzner and signing Gardiner, giving Romanov and Poehling an  opportunity to compete, would almost guaranteed a playoff spot next year. 

AND because we really do have so many good young forwards, we could package someone like drouin and this years first (should we not win lottery) and try to get a good LD. 

Last year I saw no options, this year, I'm having trouble ending this post because I have so many ideas

I like many of your proposals/considerations.

Potentially trading Drouin. I think that could be an interesting move if we could add someone in free agent that we're certain can replace those 50-60 points. Perhaps a Jeff Skinner. I'm sure Bergevin will inquire if Duchene or Panarin are interested in Montreal, but I'm skeptical he could get them to sign here. Jake Gardiner might be the only left-handed defender I would consider giving money and term to. However, I don't think he's a top-two defender. He fits in as a top-four. So... does it really help us given how much he might cost? We'll see, I guess.

Our center depth is definitely improved.

I'm not sold on Romanov being a solution to our defensive worries. He's not yet 20 years old and had four points for CSKA Moscow this season, I think. I am excited for Poehlng, but he may very well be in Laval next year.

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1 minute ago, jennifer_rocket said:

 

I'm not sold on Romanov being a solution to our defensive worries. He's not yet 20 years old and had four points for CSKA Moscow this season, I think. I am excited for Poehlng, but he may very well be in Laval next year.

Romanov was the best D at the WJ with 8pts in 7 games ... his 4pts in KHL are misleading as he's playing 3rd pairing, no PP and their tactical system is a bit different.   D tend to get less points there with the exception of a handful of players.

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6 hours ago, jennifer_rocket said:

We did have an improved season. And it's nice to think that were the playoff formatting different we could have made it. However, the worst part about missing out (assuming we do miss out) is going to be Molson and Bergevin touting the season as a massive success. "Look how much better we did!" We could easily regress as a team and miss the post-season AGAIN next year. Our recent seasons look like this:

  • 2015-2016: Did not qualify.
  • 2016-2017: Lost in round one.
  • 2017-2018: Did not qualify.
  • 2018-2019: Did not qualify (assumption).

We have to be skeptical about management again. I don't care that the season was better than last year. It was hard not to be. And yes, Bergevin made some good moves. But you have to evaluate based on the team's overall success... and we haven't had any in the last four seasons. I don't expect Bergevin to get fired... but he HAS to be fired if we miss out again next year.

And therein lies the problem. The team is without a doubt better than the one we had last year. Younger, more exciting, and with less dead weight. But the problem is that the overall trajectory MB has put us on has been unimpressive. He took over a team at rock bottom but one where frankly any idiot could have turned things around... guys coming back from injury, a great young core, and a 3rd overall pick. He walked into a virtual no-lose situation. He blew it by hiring Therrien and hanging onto him for too long and he has completely re-vamped the roster. Despite this, the team got worse.

This season was the first one in maybe 3-4 years where you actually felt there was an upwards trajectory to our course, but then one could just as easily ask who put us at rock bottom in the first place? Bergevin. And while he's finally got players who can potentially play the top 6 at center, he's failed to address the holes on the left side of the D and he arguably made that hole worse by ridding himself of Sergachev, Markov, Emelin, and Beaulieu and losing all of those players essentially with only Drouin coming inas a return - a player who ended up not being a good center and moving to a position at LW where we weren't desperate in the first place. So that was a serious misstep in itself. Like I've said before, you could also easily argue that if MB had addressed the back-up goalie issue, even internally by promoting Lindgren or McNiven ahead of Niemi, that we would have made the playoffs. You could argue that if MB had fired MT and Lefebvre earlier, we'd be ahead in our plan. You could argue that if he just hadn't added players like Alzner, Murray, Bouillon, Deslauriers, King, Ott, Martinsen, Nesterov, Folin, Streit, Plekanec (the return), Schlemko, etc. that we'd be better off. Not because we couldn't fill a hole but because we chose to add players who made us worse when we didn't have to add those players in the first place. I would simply wonder if we'd have been better off playing the likes of Hudon, Andrighetto, Beaulieu, Pateryn, Barberio, Evans, etc. instead of the constant tweaking of our 4th line and D corps in the name of grit and character.

So sure, this year was invariably a success in seeing so many players exceed expectations, but those expectations were low because of Bergevin and the overall concern is that he is still relying on a number of key players (Weber, Price, Petry) whose window is closing (or already partially closed if you look at Weber's miserable second half). By the time MB sorts out the left side of the defence, you have to wonder if he's just going to have new holes to fill and we'll be right back at square one. I highly doubt anything happens to MB or CJ this off-season, even though - as I've posted about before- the Habs are in the middle of one of their biggest periods of failure in club history. I do wonder if they will be in trouble early next season though if the team gets off to a bad start, but by then, it's another season wasted if we get that far. I'd personally rather see Trevor Timmins as GM and Dominique Ducharme as head coach and move forward from there. Unfortunately, MB has Molson wrapped around his finger and Molson is simply not proactive enough as an owner to do anything as long as he's making money.

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31 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

So sure, this year was invariably a success in seeing so many players exceed expectations, but those expectations were low because of Bergevin and the overall concern is that he is still relying on a number of key players (Weber, Price, Petry) whose window is closing (or already partially closed if you look at Weber's miserable second half). By the time MB sorts out the left side of the defence, you have to wonder if he's just going to have new holes to fill and we'll be right back at square one. I highly doubt anything happens to MB or CJ this off-season, even though - as I've posted about before- the Habs are in the middle of one of their biggest periods of failure in club history. I do wonder if they will be in trouble early next season though if the team gets off to a bad start, but by then, it's another season wasted if we get that far. I'd personally rather see Trevor Timmins as GM and Dominique Ducharme as head coach and move forward from there. Unfortunately, MB has Molson wrapped around his finger and Molson is simply not proactive enough as an owner to do anything as long as he's making money.

Geoff Molson's patience will eventually have to run out if the team misses the post-season AGAIN next season. I mean, could the man handle missing the playoffs in 4/5 seasons? That's gotta be a significant amount of revenue and profit lost.

I would also be fine with giving the reigns to Timmins as GM. I feel like he's probably better at evaluating talent than Bergevin is.

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1 hour ago, CANADIENS27 said:

Good goaltending by Holtby and another one of Bergevin's mistakes coming back to haunt us.  

 

 

Eller's goal?

Naaaah. That one was for Kinot.

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7 hours ago, jennifer_rocket said:

Geoff Molson's patience will eventually have to run out if the team misses the post-season AGAIN next season..

It's not that far fetched . Bob Mckenzie was saying there is no guarantees  that Domi and Tatar are going to have  career years AGAIN . People are raving about Poehling but he's a third line C with the potential to be a 2nd line C -  two way C that  give you some goals .

People always assume that a players  trajectory is straight  up but that's not always the case .

The D still sucks . Aside from Weber and Petry none of the other guys would be top 4 on any other nHL team and to expect Romanov to jump in and be top four is stretching it .

 

When TP was traded for Kerby Rychel, defenseman Rinat Valiev , people assumed these two guys would step right in . They didn't even make it to training  camp

 

 

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9 hours ago, Regis22 said:

It's not that far fetched . Bob Mckenzie was saying there is no guarantees  that Domi and Tatar are going to have  career years AGAIN . People are raving about Poehling but he's a third line C with the potential to be a 2nd line C -  two way C that  give you some goals .

People always assume that a players trajectory is straight up but that's not always the case.

The D still sucks . Aside from Weber and Petry none of the other guys would be top 4 on any other nHL team and to expect Romanov to jump in and be top four is stretching it .

When TP was traded for Kerby Rychel, defenseman Rinat Valiev , people assumed these two guys would step right in . They didn't even make it to training  camp

Agreed. A lot fans also assume a team's trajectory is always that the team will get better, and better, and better, until contender status is attained. Which is also not true. We've been trying to attain contender status for what feels like FOREVER. It might be time to let another GM give it a shot if the Habs fail to make any post-season noise next year.

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I think MB has earned himself at least another year. Let's wait to see what he is able to do in the off season. We need an answer at LD, either Gardiner or through trade. MB is gone if we don't make the playoffs next year but you have to give him credit for this year. 

Also, please everyone, I want you all to imagine winning the #1 or #2 pick, if we all collectively do it, the ball will bounce our way. 

Finally, can you please imagine me with Margot Robbie, as well? Thanks!

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