campabee82 Posted July 11, 2019 Report Share Posted July 11, 2019 1 hour ago, habsisme said: I would be shocked if they moved Theodore. Their best player at their weakest position. They don't need to do anything. Just sign Gusev Not entirely true, They do only have 5 dmen as well but will most likely promote from within unless a reasonable trade offer comes in. I also think it is a long shot for them to trade Theodore although I would like to get him and have even added my opinion on what the return should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habsisme Posted July 11, 2019 Report Share Posted July 11, 2019 I think everyone is on this because they are misreading their cap situation. They are about 2.5 million UNDER the cap once Clarkson goes on IR. They can sign Gusev but Gusev wants more money then they can afford. Gusev is available, Shea Theodore is absolutely not going anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
campabee82 Posted July 11, 2019 Report Share Posted July 11, 2019 25 minutes ago, habsisme said: I think everyone is on this because they are misreading their cap situation. They are about 2.5 million UNDER the cap once Clarkson goes on IR. They can sign Gusev but Gusev wants more money then they can afford. Gusev is available, Shea Theodore is absolutely not going anywhere. Like I stated above they are 2 players short of a full roster, there is an expectation that Glass makes the team this year that takes off like 925000 and they would like to also sign England probably looking around a minimum of 2-2.5 Mil and Schultz is an RFA they still need to deal with as well so there goes another 925000. That puts them over the cap even when factoring in Clarkson's 35250000. So no-one is misreading anything except maybe you, they are in a cap crunch not as bed as the Laffs but still not in a good position. They simply cant sign everyone and are currently only carrying 5 D so I would expect them to sign England and Schultz first and bring up Glass before even thinking about signing Gusev. If they don't bring up Glass then maybe they can sign Gusev but they would still need to trade someone. Probably Holden or Reaves or both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maas_art Posted July 11, 2019 Report Share Posted July 11, 2019 2 hours ago, jennifer_rocket said: We have some other decent prospects at RD (Fleury, Brook) that make Juulsen a little more expendable, IMO. It would hurt, but it would probably be worth it. Yeah I am a big Juulsen fan but considering the strength we have at RD (and the chance of MB trading Weber or Petry is basically Nil) then i guess he is somewhat expendable. All you need is to find a team with a player like him at LD, who requires RD. 2 hours ago, habsisme said: I would be shocked if they moved Theodore. Their best player at their weakest position. They don't need to do anything. Just sign Gusev Its definitely unlikely they trade Theodore but they seem content to load up on forward talent & then leave Fleury to stand on his head. I would imagine the chances of them moving him are extremely low but this management team has proven they do lots of weird things. As for them "not needing to do anything" thats just not true. They're over the cap currently - obviously Clarkson's money will come off so they are something like: $85m - $81m + $4m over - $5.25 (clarkson) so they should have something like $1.2-1.5M in available cap space. But Gusev wants $4m (which is probably fair for the leading scorer in the KHL). Additionally they only have 5dmen under contract (3L 2R) and some of their forward slots are a bit suspect. Malcom Subban resigning for so cheap definitely helped (arbitration may well have given him more) but they still have players and positions they need to figure out. They have work to do. They would be better served by trading a few higher priced players & bringing in quality young (ie cheaper) replacements but Its anybody's guess what they will do... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennifer_rocket Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 James Neal for Karl Alzner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maas_art Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 1 hour ago, jennifer_rocket said: James Neal for Karl Alzner? not that im sure id do it, but I dont think Calgary would. They would save a little on the cap but have zero use for Alzner. We could probably find a home for Neal (although our bottom six is pretty crowded and i dont think he's top 6 anymore). Although im pretty sure you were joking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caperns61 Posted July 18, 2019 Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 20 hours ago, maas_art said: not that im sure id do it, but I dont think Calgary would. They would save a little on the cap but have zero use for Alzner. We could probably find a home for Neal (although our bottom six is pretty crowded and i dont think he's top 6 anymore). Although im pretty sure you were joking Calgary would probably certainly look at it, they have 3 UFA on defence at the end of this season, they get back a shorter term with Alsner and they free up just over 1 million in cap space. However Neal could always score and I think he will have a bounce back year for Calgary. At 31 i dont think he is done yet. He was averaging almost 3.5 shots per game his last 8 seasons and a shooting percent between 11 and 12 % This past season only 2.2 shots per game and a measly 5%. Those numbers are not typical, and at 31 your not exactly over the hill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maas_art Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 Just for fun, lets imagine that Ken Holland would entertain the idea of trading Connor McDavid. I actually dont think he would, but as each year goes by, McDavid seems more and more bitter about the state of the oilers. He's almost passive agressive in his interviews because clearly the OIl sold him on something (some kind of plan) when he signed his 8 year deal & they do not seem to be living up to that. So lets just imagine they would actually listen to an offer for him. What would you give up? Obviously we'd have to include one of our big three youth (JK, Poehling or Suzuki). I think you'd have to include a top end dman (Weber?) and a solid young dman prospect (Fleury, Juulsen, Brook?). Normally you'd include a pick too but I think in this case Edmonton would want bodies so maybe one more forward. The deal could look something like this: To Montreal Connor McDavid Pick To Edmonton: Max Domi Shea Weber Ryan Poehling Arturi Lehkonen Cale Fleury What do you think? is it enough? Too much? Would edmonton do it? Would montreal? Obviously its never happening but whenever i see a disgruntled player I start thinking "what would they look like on my team?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennifer_rocket Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 1 hour ago, maas_art said: To Montreal Connor McDavid Pick To Edmonton: Max Domi Shea Weber Ryan Poehling Arturi Lehkonen Cale Fleury What do you think? is it enough? Too much? Would edmonton do it? Would montreal? Obviously its never happening but whenever i see a disgruntled player I start thinking "what would they look like on my team?" I feel like, if I were the G.M. in Edmonton, and I had to trade McDavid, I would probably be thinking rebuild... I wouldn't be interested in Weber at all. I think I'd be asking for Montreal's most promising prospect, Kotkaniemi. Domi, Lehkonen, Poehling, and Fleury are all interesting. But I don't think Poehling or Fleury would bring much as an incentive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTed3 Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 7 hours ago, maas_art said: Just for fun, lets imagine that Ken Holland would entertain the idea of trading Connor McDavid. I actually dont think he would, but as each year goes by, McDavid seems more and more bitter about the state of the oilers. He's almost passive agressive in his interviews because clearly the OIl sold him on something (some kind of plan) when he signed his 8 year deal & they do not seem to be living up to that. So lets just imagine they would actually listen to an offer for him. What would you give up? Obviously we'd have to include one of our big three youth (JK, Poehling or Suzuki). I think you'd have to include a top end dman (Weber?) and a solid young dman prospect (Fleury, Juulsen, Brook?). Normally you'd include a pick too but I think in this case Edmonton would want bodies so maybe one more forward. The deal could look something like this: To Montreal Connor McDavid Pick To Edmonton: Max Domi Shea Weber Ryan Poehling Arturi Lehkonen Cale Fleury What do you think? is it enough? Too much? Would edmonton do it? Would montreal? Obviously its never happening but whenever i see a disgruntled player I start thinking "what would they look like on my team?" 6 hours ago, jennifer_rocket said: I feel like, if I were the G.M. in Edmonton, and I had to trade McDavid, I would probably be thinking rebuild... I wouldn't be interested in Weber at all. I think I'd be asking for Montreal's most promising prospect, Kotkaniemi. Domi, Lehkonen, Poehling, and Fleury are all interesting. But I don't think Poehling or Fleury would bring much as an incentive. Agreed with JR... if you're trading McDavid, you're likely asking for JK as the focal point in a deal. If I were Edmonton, I'd be pretty much re-tooling at that point and trying to acquire as many youngsters and futures as possible. I wouldn't have any interest in Weber in that deal, and Lehkonen and Fleury would largely be throw-ins rather than providing much value. McDavid's one of the few players in the league that you could argue could/should garner four 1st rounders and I think there would be teams agreed to paying that, so I think any offer would have to parallel that. Not to say I would do it, but I think the ask from Edmonton would be more along the lines of Kotkaniemi Suzuki Brook Primeau 1st round pick 2020 1st round pick 2021 It's a lot of key pieces to our future, but I think that's what it would take to make a deal interesting to the Oilers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs1952 Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 8 hours ago, maas_art said: Just for fun, lets imagine that Ken Holland would entertain the idea of trading Connor McDavid. I actually dont think he would, but as each year goes by, McDavid seems more and more bitter about the state of the oilers. He's almost passive agressive in his interviews because clearly the OIl sold him on something (some kind of plan) when he signed his 8 year deal & they do not seem to be living up to that. So lets just imagine they would actually listen to an offer for him. What would you give up? Obviously we'd have to include one of our big three youth (JK, Poehling or Suzuki). I think you'd have to include a top end dman (Weber?) and a solid young dman prospect (Fleury, Juulsen, Brook?). Normally you'd include a pick too but I think in this case Edmonton would want bodies so maybe one more forward. The deal could look something like this: To Montreal Connor McDavid Pick To Edmonton: Max Domi Shea Weber Ryan Poehling Arturi Lehkonen Cale Fleury What do you think? is it enough? Too much? Would edmonton do it? Would montreal? Obviously its never happening but whenever i see a disgruntled player I start thinking "what would they look like on my team?" Wouldn't do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinot-2 Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 29 minutes ago, habs1952 said: Wouldn't do it. Ditto, too many, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windoe Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 I would do that deal as Montreal GM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windoe Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 Drouin-McDavid-Byron Tatar-Danault-Gallagher Cousins-Kotkaniemi-Armia Peca-Thompson-Weal with Suzuki and Caufield still in development Chiarot-Petry Mete-Folin Kulak-Juulsen with Brook and Romanov still in development 12.5 to McDavid, but 3.150 Domi 2.400 Lehkonen 7.857 Weber, 0.925 Poehling...so the cap space is basically a wash Having the best player in the world (arguably) with the best goalie in the world (arguably) would be fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
campabee82 Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 2 hours ago, Windoe said: Drouin-McDavid-Byron Tatar-Danault-Gallagher Cousins-Kotkaniemi-Armia Peca-Thompson-Weal with Suzuki and Caufield still in development Chiarot-Petry Mete-Folin Kulak-Juulsen with Brook and Romanov still in development 12.5 to McDavid, but 3.150 Domi 2.400 Lehkonen 7.857 Weber, 0.925 Poehling...so the cap space is basically a wash Having the best player in the world (arguably) with the best goalie in the world (arguably) would be fun. I like the idea of having speed on McDavid's line but I just think that IF you don't give him guys that can consistently finish he will be asking for a trade in a couple of years again. I also think you gave up too much and that would leave us with a buch more holes. Maybe Weber and Domi plus a 1st and Suzuki would be enough. I don't think you could be a contender giving up Lehkonen Domi and Peoling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennifer_rocket Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 I would entertain Ted's offer if I were Bergevin. Two first rounders, Kotkaniemi, Suzuki, Brook, and Primeau would be a lot to sacrifice, but McDavid is McDavid. It's worth considering. You'd have to find a way to exchange salary as well. We'd need to send something back to Edmonton to even out the cap hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
campabee82 Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 2 hours ago, jennifer_rocket said: I would entertain Ted's offer if I were Bergevin. Two first rounders, Kotkaniemi, Suzuki, Brook, and Primeau would be a lot to sacrifice, but McDavid is McDavid. It's worth considering. You'd have to find a way to exchange salary as well. We'd need to send something back to Edmonton to even out the cap hit. That would be a huge HELL NO from me no way I give up KK, Suzuki, Brook, Primeau and 2 1st's that would kill our future. I would however send a mix for McDavid something like Domi (5500000) Suzuki (863333) Kulak (1850000) 2020 1st Lottery protected 2021 1st 2020 2nd Alzner (they would have to take Alzner as part of the package to free up cap space) (4625000) total out = 12838333 for McDavid (12500000) + 2020 3rd then we line up Tatar-McDavid-Gallagher Drouin-Kotkaniemi-Lehkonen Cousins-Danault-Hudon Byron-Peohling-Armia extras - Weal, Thompson Mete-Weber Chiarot-Petry Reilly-Juulsen Extra - Folin Price Kinkade still missing that #1 LHD but it makes us contenders and also helps the rebuild of the Oilers they would line up something like Draisaitl-Domi-Kassian Neal-Nugent-Hopkins-Chiasson Grandlund-Suzuki-Gagner Khaira-Brodziak-Puljujarvi Klefblom-Larsson Nurse-Russell Kulak-Bouchard Alzner Koskinen Smith both teams would be contenders IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
campabee82 Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 16 minutes ago, campabee82 said: That would be a huge HELL NO from me no way I give up KK, Suzuki, Brook, Primeau and 2 1st's that would kill our future. I would however send a mix for McDavid something like Domi (5500000) Suzuki (863333) Kulak (1850000) 2020 1st Lottery protected 2021 1st 2020 2nd Alzner (they would have to take Alzner as part of the package to free up cap space) (4625000) total out = 12838333 for McDavid (12500000) + 2020 3rd then we line up Tatar-McDavid-Gallagher Drouin-Kotkaniemi-Lehkonen Cousins-Danault-Hudon Byron-Peohling-Armia extras - Weal, Thompson Mete-Weber Chiarot-Petry Reilly-Juulsen Extra - Folin Price Kinkade still missing that #1 LHD but it makes us contenders and also helps the rebuild of the Oilers they would line up something like Draisaitl-Domi-Kassian Neal-Nugent-Hopkins-Chiasson Grandlund-Suzuki-Gagner Khaira-Brodziak-Puljujarvi Klefblom-Larsson Nurse-Russell Kulak-Bouchard Alzner Koskinen Smith both teams would be contenders IMHO Sorry realized Domi is at 3150000 LOL total out = 10488333 so essentially we get McDavid for 2 mil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennifer_rocket Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 22 minutes ago, campabee82 said: Sorry realized Domi is at 3150000 LOL total out = 10488333 so essentially we get McDavid for 2 mil At this point in time, I cannot imagine there's any way you could swing a trade for McDavid (hypothetical or not) without including Kotkaniemi. He's, by far, our most promising young player and I feel like Edmonton would just hang up the phone if he wasn't included in the deal. Which is fine. McDavid is worth more than Kotkaniemi. It's just a matter of finding the right balance of parts to make a trade (hypothetical) worthwhile for both teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennifer_rocket Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 Here would be my fantasy proposal for McDavid. Fun. To Montreal: Connor McDavid ($12.500) 3rd Round Draft Choice (2021) To Edmonton: Jesperi Kotkaniemi ($0.925) Paul Byron ($3.400) Dale Weise ($2.350) (Yes, yes, I know. It's a salary dump with one year remaining on his deal) Josh Brook ($0.795) Cayden Primeau ($0.881) 1st Round Draft Choice (2020) 4th Round Draft Choice (2020 - Anaheim) 4th Round Draft Choice (2020 - Winnipeg) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maas_art Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 19 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said: At this point in time, I cannot imagine there's any way you could swing a trade for McDavid (hypothetical or not) without including Kotkaniemi. He's, by far, our most promising young player and I feel like Edmonton would just hang up the phone if he wasn't included in the deal. Which is fine. McDavid is worth more than Kotkaniemi. It's just a matter of finding the right balance of parts to make a trade (hypothetical) worthwhile for both teams. 8 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said: Here would be my fantasy proposal for McDavid. Fun. For sure. And honestly the chances of Edmonton moving McDavid have to be like 1% but its still fun to play. I guess the question is: why does edmont make this move? Is it to blow up the team or is it to make the team better NOW. Its rare, but there have been times when a team will trade one player for a bucket load of depth (Joe Thornton, Lindros, etc). So maybe the pressure is on edmonton so much to actually field a competitive team now that they move a superstar for a whole bunch of players. I dont necessarily think any of the proposals are out to lunch (although I dont think Edmonton would actually move him) but its an interesting exercise. Remember, if they move McDavid, they still have Draitsaitl & RNH - so they have a 1-2 punch as good as most teams in the nhl. So do they focus on getting better in other areas (like defense and wing) or do they want a superstar like Price as part of the deal? Anyway, fun to speculate. I dont think anything would actually come of it but it sure seems like Connor is unhappy in Edmonton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennifer_rocket Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 21 minutes ago, maas_art said: Anyway, fun to speculate. I dont think anything would actually come of it but it sure seems like Connor is unhappy in Edmonton. Maybe Neal will make him happy! I wonder how he feels if Edmonton continues to miss the post-season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
campabee82 Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 3 hours ago, jennifer_rocket said: At this point in time, I cannot imagine there's any way you could swing a trade for McDavid (hypothetical or not) without including Kotkaniemi. He's, by far, our most promising young player and I feel like Edmonton would just hang up the phone if he wasn't included in the deal. Which is fine. McDavid is worth more than Kotkaniemi. It's just a matter of finding the right balance of parts to make a trade (hypothetical) worthwhile for both teams. See and if I am MB and the ask is KK I would hang up. I think that KK plus for McDavid is too much. IMO KK will one day very soon be close to McDavid so giving up a younger player for an older one with almost equal talent isn't worth it. Again this comes back to the Subban-Weber deal a little less of an age gap but while McDavid probably has another 10 years in him maybe 6 at elite status KK has like 15-20 and maybe 10-15 at elite status no way I give that up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptWelly Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 37 minutes ago, campabee82 said: See and if I am MB and the ask is KK I would hang up. I think that KK plus for McDavid is too much. IMO KK will one day very soon be close to McDavid so giving up a younger player for an older one with almost equal talent isn't worth it. Again this comes back to the Subban-Weber deal a little less of an age gap but while McDavid probably has another 10 years in him maybe 6 at elite status KK has like 15-20 and maybe 10-15 at elite status no way I give that up. As much as I like JK even up for McDavid absolutely! McDavid for Mcinnon maybe not. I don't see JK as an elite scoring super star. Can he possibly a star yes , but I don't see him developing into a Crosby or McDavid . A Bergereon type or a young Toews I can see. Which I still think hopefully will be great , a player you can play in all situations. As for a generational talent , I hope I'm wrong but I don't see that....and I do like the kid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maas_art Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 1 hour ago, campabee82 said: See and if I am MB and the ask is KK I would hang up. I think that KK plus for McDavid is too much. IMO KK will one day very soon be close to McDavid so giving up a younger player for an older one with almost equal talent isn't worth it. Again this comes back to the Subban-Weber deal a little less of an age gap but while McDavid probably has another 10 years in him maybe 6 at elite status KK has like 15-20 and maybe 10-15 at elite status no way I give that up. 52 minutes ago, CaptWelly said: As much as I like JK even up for McDavid absolutely! McDavid for Mcinnon maybe not. I don't see JK as an elite scoring super star. Can he possibly a star yes , but I don't see him developing into a Crosby or McDavid . A Bergereon type or a young Toews I can see. Which I still think hopefully will be great , a player you can play in all situations. As for a generational talent , I hope I'm wrong but I don't see that....and I do like the kid. Yeah, i love JK and i think he's going to be a terrific, legitimate top line centre but a) McDavid is a Generational talent. 2 ) JK is still a prospect, McDavid has 3 straight 100 point seasons and his career scoring is 1.27 points per game. 1 hour ago, campabee82 said: Again this comes back to the Subban-Weber deal a little less of an age gap but while McDavid probably has another 10 years in him maybe 6 at elite status KK has like 15-20 and maybe 10-15 at elite status no way I give that up. Im not sure about your math here. McDavid is 2 1/2 years older than JK so im not sure how JK has 10-15 elite status years but McDavid only has 6? Plus JK hasnt actually made it to 'elite status' yet so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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