2020-21 State Of The Habs

[BigTed3]

Weber is clearly more valuable to the team than Mete, I don't think that was the point. I think it was saying if you could lose Mete and get 800k+ in cap space this year or lose Weber and get 7.8M in cap space for the next 5 years, you would rather clear the cap space related to Weber. I think also clear that neither one of them has trade value with their current contracts, so the only way we're dumping Weber is waivers, expansion draft, retirement, or trading him but giving up assets for someone to take his contract on.

Apparently John Lu asked Weber today if he thought the team would be better off managing his ice time and cutting back on how they use him, and he answered that he was actually hoping to play more... again, it is what it is, but that whole idea that you just keep pushing and trying and that effort is all you need is a bit of an antiquated idea. Yes, you want guys with big hearts and effort, and you can't have Sergei Kostitsyn's and Donald Brashear's bringing bad attitudes to the room, but on the other hand, you also hope guys know their limits and recognize that they're hurting the team. It's not helpful for Weber to think he can play his way out of this by getting more ice time, and it's not helpful for MB and the coaches drooling over him and offering that to him. Someone here has to take charge and say enough is enough, Weber can be useful as a #4 D man but he can't be getting 20+ minutes a night.

[habsisme]

1 minute ago, BigTed3 said:

Weber is clearly more valuable to the team than Mete, I don't think that was the point. I think it was saying if you could lose Mete and get 800k+ in cap space this year or lose Weber and get 7.8M in cap space for the next 5 years, you would rather clear the cap space related to Weber. I think also clear that neither one of them has trade value with their current contracts, so the only way we're dumping Weber is waivers, expansion draft, retirement, or trading him but giving up assets for someone to take his contract on.

Apparently John Lu asked Weber today if he thought the team would be better off managing his ice time and cutting back on how they use him, and he answered that he was actually hoping to play more... again, it is what it is, but that whole idea that you just keep pushing and trying and that effort is all you need is a bit of an antiquated idea. Yes, you want guys with big hearts and effort, and you can't have Sergei Kostitsyn's and Donald Brashear's bringing bad attitudes to the room, but on the other hand, you also hope guys know their limits and recognize that they're hurting the team. It's not helpful for Weber to think he can play his way out of this by getting more ice time, and it's not helpful for MB and the coaches drooling over him and offering that to him. Someone here has to take charge and say enough is enough, Weber can be useful as a #4 D man but he can't be getting 20+ minutes a night.

well, I mean I expect good charcther guys to want to play more. Playing him less is on coaching, not Weber himself

[habsisme]

apparently we have Jon Merril https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/canadiens-acquire-defenceman-jon-merrill-red-wings/

I'm calling it now, we win the cup!

[richard464]

Saw that. Verbeek & a fifth round pick 2021 for Merril. Anybody know this player? 

[Delirium79]

Regarding Jon Merrill

https://www.habseyesontheprize.com/analysis/2021/4/11/22378589/jon-merrill-trade-analysis-habs-red-wings-canadiens-trade-deadline-2021-romanov-mete-weber

[habby67]

Can we fire the owner too? How many years of these kind of acquisitions do we have to put up with. 

[H_T_L]

MB is so predictable. Just as i speculated awhile back,,,, another 3rd pairing D.

[caperns61]

5 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

Agreed with all of this. We posted the exact same D pairings. Up front, I think it's clear that Staal and Perry need to be 4th liners. Staal is a good face-off man and Perry is great on the PP, but they don't have the legs to keep up at ES for big minutes. Much more effective in limited roles. Kotkaniemi needs to play at center, he was making great progress there and it is stupid to derail that to try and satisfy at 35+ year old rental who will likely play a total of 20 games for the Habs in his entire career.

As for the rest of the line-up, I think the premises for building it have to be

- Suzuki and JK are your top two centers (in terms of getting the best offensive wingers and best zone starts)

- Danault should get your tough match-ups but gets third-best winger set. He and Lehkonen make a great duo and should be on the same line.

- Staal and Perry on the 4th.

- Drouin needs to have a big body power winger on the other side. It could be Anderson, it could be Armia. I find he's been more effective when he has that.

And one last thought, but if we're not going to use Mete as a defenceman over Leskinen, I wonder if it isn't worth at least a look at him on the wing of the 4th line. I still think Evans would benefit from sitting in the press box or a stint in the AHL to refine things and simplify his game. He looks lost. I don't know that putting a puck-carrier like Mete out there with less defensive responsibility would necessarily be any worse.

 

 

I like the Mete idea, never considered it, he is certainly a great skater. He could certainly compensate for Perry and Staal. 

Third line right now should be Danault, Lekonen and Byron, Byron can go back to the fourth when Armia returns

Second should be Toffoli, JK and Tatar. 

First Suzuki, Droun and Anderson. 

If you cannot win with that for now.

Welll sucks, but there our best options. 

I love CC but i would leave him in the AHL for at least ten games..

 

[MALMACIAN_CRUNCH]

3 hours ago, richard464 said:

Saw that. Verbeek & a fifth round pick 2021 for Merril. Anybody know this player? 

I can’t say I know a whole lot. I remember his name from his draft year, his profile caught my eye at the time (shows how good my judgment is eh?).

But one thing is for sure, he has some fantastic “hockey hair”! (At least in the mugs I saw when I looked’em up)

[CaptWelly]

49 minutes ago, caperns61 said:

I like the Mete idea, never considered it, he is certainly a great skater. He could certainly compensate for Perry and Staal. 

Third line right now should be Danault, Lekonen and Byron, Byron can go back to the fourth when Armia returns

Second should be Toffoli, JK and Tatar. 

First Suzuki, Droun and Anderson. 

If you cannot win with that for now.

Welll sucks, but there our best options. 

I love CC but i would leave him in the AHL for at least ten games..

 

The Suzuki , Anderson, Drouin line was pretty consistently good. (Hope Anderson can stay healthy) I like 

Toffoli,JK,CC (Give it a try) Toffoli and CC can shoot and Toffoli and JK can set up. 

Tatar, Danault , Armia/CC (I'd even try CC with these two. Before Gallagher got injured that was our best line. 

Byron, Stahl , Perry 

 

If CC looks out of place Lehks can come in. Give CC some PP time though! 

[MALMACIAN_CRUNCH]

3 minutes ago, CaptWelly said:

The Suzuki , Anderson, Drouin line was pretty consistently good. (Hope Anderson can stay healthy) I like 

Toffoli,JK,CC (Give it a try) Toffoli and CC can shoot and Toffoli and JK can set up. 

Tatar, Danault , Armia/CC (I'd even try CC with these two. Before Gallagher got injured that was our best line. 

Byron, Stahl , Perry 

 

If CC looks out of place Lehks can come in. Give CC some PP time though! 

If Caufield keeps scoring like he has so far, I think we’ll see him sooner than later. And with him, I actually believe we might finally have a player (1st rounder) that lives up to his potential. I can’t really think of one since Price.

[maas_art]

5 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

Apparently John Lu asked Weber today if he thought the team would be better off managing his ice time and cutting back on how they use him, and he answered that he was actually hoping to play more... again, it is what it is, but that whole idea that you just keep pushing and trying and that effort is all you need is a bit of an antiquated idea. Yes, you want guys with big hearts and effort, and you can't have Sergei Kostitsyn's and Donald Brashear's bringing bad attitudes to the room, but on the other hand, you also hope guys know their limits and recognize that they're hurting the team. It's not helpful for Weber to think he can play his way out of this by getting more ice time, and it's not helpful for MB and the coaches drooling over him and offering that to him. Someone here has to take charge and say enough is enough, Weber can be useful as a #4 D man but he can't be getting 20+ minutes a night.

 

5 hours ago, habsisme said:

well, I mean I expect good charcther guys to want to play more. Playing him less is on coaching, not Weber himself

Yeah i would have been surprised if Weber had said he needs his ice time managed but I do fully think the coaches should be doing just that. 

[BigTed3]

1 hour ago, maas_art said:

 

Yeah i would have been surprised if Weber had said he needs his ice time managed but I do fully think the coaches should be doing just that. 

He could have said he was happy with his ice time, he could have said it was up to the coaches to decide, he could have said that players in general sometimes have to play through fatigue or pain as they get older. But instead, he said he didn't see it as a problem and that he actually wants more ice time. It just sends the message that either

 

1. He is completely oblivious to the way he's playing, that he's hurting the team, and that he can be more helpful to the team when rested.

or

2. He recognizes he's played poorly but doesn't think it's because he's worn down and really thinks that he can just grind this out and that that's the honorable thing to do.

I don't care for either explanation.

[electron58]

Drouin & Weber explaining the problems with the Habs. What an oxymoron. Truly oblivious. Can we trade both of them already? Geez.....

[habs1952]

4 hours ago, MALMACIAN_CRUNCH said:

If Caufield keeps scoring like he has so far, I think we’ll see him sooner than later. And with him, I actually believe we might finally have a player (1st rounder) that lives up to his potential. I can’t really think of one since Price.

With the way this team is playing are you sure you want CC exposed to it this year? Let him continue learning in Laval and hope we get a new GM soon.

[claremont]

40 minutes ago, habs1952 said:

With the way this team is playing are you sure you want CC exposed to it this year? Let him continue learning in Laval and hope we get a new GM soon.

I would rather have Cole learning how to win with Laval than toss him into a potentially losing scenario with a ton of pressure to perform. Bouchard will tell us when he's ready. Cole would be taking ice time from some vets like Armia, Byron, even Lehkonen. One could argue the vets have had plenty of time to perform and haven't delivered and hockey is about the business of winning, but I wonder if morale gets impacted by that type of treatment. I think Cole needs a good 10-15 games in Laval and if he is really earning that opportunity over a long stretch, then we bring him up. 

[kinot-2]

25 minutes ago, claremont said:

I would rather have Cole learning how to win with Laval than toss him into a potentially losing scenario with a ton of pressure to perform. Bouchard will tell us when he's ready. Cole would be taking ice time from some vets like Armia, Byron, even Lehkonen. One could argue the vets have had plenty of time to perform and haven't delivered and hockey is about the business of winning, but I wonder if morale gets impacted by that type of treatment. I think Cole needs a good 10-15 games in Laval and if he is really earning that opportunity over a long stretch, then we bring him up. 

He's been on a winning team in U of W, and they're winning in Laval. We have been losing. Leave him in Laval until we have a winning streak, (might be a while tho). 

[electron58]

Man, I can't believe with all these trades going down, bergevin keeps sitting on his hands. The Leafs have gotten hugely better.  I admit, that it would be hugely satisfying if we were to upset them in the playoffs, but the way we're playing, we're going to be lucky to just back in to the playoffs.

[electron58]

2 hours ago, claremont said:

I would rather have Cole learning how to win with Laval than toss him into a potentially losing scenario with a ton of pressure to perform. Bouchard will tell us when he's ready. Cole would be taking ice time from some vets like Armia, Byron, even Lehkonen. One could argue the vets have had plenty of time to perform and haven't delivered and hockey is about the business of winning, but I wonder if morale gets impacted by that type of treatment. I think Cole needs a good 10-15 games in Laval and if he is really earning that opportunity over a long stretch, then we bring him up. 

Yeah.  I have to agree as well.  We don't want to bring CC up to a losing environment, so hopefully, the Habs can turn this thing around, and CC keeps performing beyond expectations and then maybe, bring him up.  Although, you gotta like what he brings, so let him do it a little longer.

[CaptWelly]

8 hours ago, electron58 said:

Yeah.  I have to agree as well.  We don't want to bring CC up to a losing environment, so hopefully, the Habs can turn this thing around, and CC keeps performing beyond expectations and then maybe, bring him up.  Although, you gotta like what he brings, so let him do it a little longer.

I can understand , but then in any rebuild or tear down as many have advocated. You are bring young players into a losing environment. 

[richard464]

8 hours ago, electron58 said:

Yeah.  I have to agree as well.  We don't want to bring CC up to a losing environment, so hopefully, the Habs can turn this thing around, and CC keeps performing beyond expectations and then maybe, bring him up.  Although, you gotta like what he brings, so let him do it a little longer.

Dosen't really matter when you bring him up as it will be to a losing enviroment. He already has three goals for Laval in two games. That is more than Drouin has in the entire season! I do not want to see him get hurt but removing Drouin from the lineup will be a positive and who knows it could just be the spark we need? I do not see that spark coming from anyone currently on the bench!

[electron58]

2 hours ago, CaptWelly said:

I can understand , but then in any rebuild or tear down as many have advocated. You are bring young players into a losing environment. 

Sure. That is correct.  I was thinking of that too. Was just hoping we could turn it around,  but it's getting harder to be optimistic. 

[electron58]

1 hour ago, richard464 said:

Dosen't really matter when you bring him up as it will be to a losing enviroment. He already has three goals for Laval in two games. That is more than Drouin has in the entire season! I do not want to see him get hurt but removing Drouin from the lineup will be a positive and who knows it could just be the spark we need? I do not see that spark coming from anyone currently on the bench!

Unfortunately,  that is the concern. But yes, I agree. As for getting hurt, there are more goons in the AHL, as our finesse players are finding out. Not that player safety is doing anything to protect the players in the NHL. And, I guess that we are part of the few, that agree, that Drouin has to go.

[HabsAlways]

This team is going nowhere as long as coaching insists on playing Weber and Staal as if they were still elite.   Perry I can stomach, his high hockey IQ seems to let him get around his skating deficiencies ... but Staal is just brutal, and getting top icetime with two of our best wingers.   

Other example both Suzuki and JK have struggled last 20 games, JK however has picked it up huge in the last 5-6 games and gets 2 assists the other night and is still put out as a winger or as a C with bottom pairing wingers.  Suzuki? Nah, just keep throwing him out there with two good players.

[Regis22]

Mete claimed by Ottawa