2021-22 State of the Habs

[electron58]

Hearing Bob Gainey to help out with the GM search. Not really a big fan of this. Just leave it to Jeff Gorton.  He has to work with the person.

[electron58]

A look at the bottom of the overall NHL standings Dec. 07/2021, Only 4 days later.

25.  Chicago         24       9     13      2      20

26.   Seattle          25       9     14      2      20

27. Vancouver      26       9     15      2      20

28.  Buffalo           24       8      13     3      19

29.  N.Y.I.             20       5      10     5       15

30.    Ottawa         23       7     15     1       15

31.  Montreal       26       6      17    3       15

32.   Arizona         25       5     18      2      12

 

Buffalo dropping down to join the party. Islanders with 6 games in hand.  Habs now 14 points out of a wild card spot. Bruins have 5 games in hand. Red Wings & Penguins - the two wild card teams each have one game in hand. Gonna be hard to catch the Yotes.

Fight for the Wright!

[jennifer_rocket]

11 hours ago, electron58 said:

Hearing Bob Gainey to help out with the GM search. Not really a big fan of this. Just leave it to Jeff Gorton.  He has to work with the person.

I don't mind this. I actually liked Gainey when he was our GM. No problem with him assisting in the search.

[habsisme]

14 minutes ago, jennifer_rocket said:

I don't mind this. I actually liked Gainey when he was our GM. No problem with him assisting in the search.

I liked him too until the moron made what I believe to be the worst trade in our history and there was no excuse for it 

[campabee82]

13 minutes ago, habsisme said:

I liked him too until the moron made what I believe to be the worst trade in our history and there was no excuse for it 

agreed, even though Houle caused the situation Gainey should have fired him and tried to keep Roy. Coaches can't embarrass players and expect to be backed by the GM. 

[Regis22]

Sorry , but I thought Gainey got fired and Ronald Corey brought in Houle as GM . And Houle brought in Tremblay , Shutt etc as his coaching staff

It was Houle  who made the ROY trade to Colorado . 

[campabee82]

51 minutes ago, Regis22 said:

Sorry , but I thought Gainey got fired and Ronald Corey brought in Houle as GM . And Houle brought in Tremblay , Shutt etc as his coaching staff

It was Houle  who made the ROY trade to Colorado . 

Right my bad lol

[maas_art]

1 hour ago, jennifer_rocket said:

I don't mind this. I actually liked Gainey when he was our GM. No problem with him assisting in the search.

I liked gainey too. i think he was playing the long game which is tricky for a GM because he clearly didnt get the time to see it come to fruition (I know he resigned but i think it was a "quit or you're fired" scenario). The team MB inherited was mostly Gainey/Gauthier and i think we're worse off today then we were then. 

1 hour ago, habsisme said:

I liked him too until the moron made what I believe to be the worst trade in our history and there was no excuse for it 

I assume you mean gomez for mcdonaugh etc.   It wasnt a great trade but it was a shift in culture and signified the first real break from the spinning we had done for the previous decade or so.   GMs gotta be ok with taking risks - that was really one of MB's biggest downfalls. 

At least with this "bad" trade Gainey followed it up with good moves like adding Gionta, Cammaleri etc.  He transformed the team in one season & we were finally on the right track.  MB would make a good trade but then do nothing to follow it up.  I'll take the GM with the big plan over the guy who is scared to screw up so all he does is tinker.

 

43 minutes ago, Regis22 said:

Sorry , but I thought Gainey got fired and Ronald Corey brought in Houle as GM . And Houle brought in Tremblay , Shutt etc as his coaching staff

It was Houle  who made the ROY trade to Colorado . 

Yeah im not sure what that was all about but Houle was the GM responsible for the Roy Fiasco - and, imho the worse move: Turgeon for spare parts - as well as Recchi for Zubrus, Linden for a 1st, Bure for spare parts - and some terrible drafting like Higgins, Chouinard, Hossa with high picks. 

Gainey, while not perfect, looks like Sam Pollock compared with Houle and even MB 

[electron58]

2 hours ago, Regis22 said:

Sorry , but I thought Gainey got fired and Ronald Corey brought in Houle as GM . And Houle brought in Tremblay , Shutt etc as his coaching staff

It was Houle  who made the ROY trade to Colorado . 

Yes. It was Rejean Dafool.

[Regis22]

Remember Houle,  Tremblay, Shutt , Cournoyer were brought in as GM, coach and assistant coaches because they all knew what it took to win the Stanley Cup  ...lol 

[electron58]

Can you imagine if the Habs would not have lottery protected there first pick?

The Yotes could have had the first 2 picks in the '22 draft.

[electron58]

next.

[electron58]

2 minutes ago, Regis22 said:

Remember Houle,  Tremblay, Shutt , Cournoyer were brought in as GM, coach and assistant coaches because they all knew what it took to win the Stanley Cup  ...lol 

I don't remember Shutt or Cournoyer. Maybe because the other 2 fools left a lasting impression?

[ramcharger440]

Houle was here before Gainey then Gauthier then I think Gainey for a little bit then MB. I don't know anymore it is retread central around here!

[electron58]

1 minute ago, ramcharger440 said:

Houle was here before Gainey then Gauthier then I think Gainey for a little bit then MB. I don't know anymore it is retread central around here!

Rehashing the dark days.

[ramcharger440]

1 hour ago, maas_art said:

I liked gainey too. i think he was playing the long game which is tricky for a GM because he clearly didnt get the time to see it come to fruition (I know he resigned but i think it was a "quit or you're fired" scenario). The team MB inherited was mostly Gainey/Gauthier and i think we're worse off today then we were then. 

I assume you mean gomez for mcdonaugh etc.   It wasnt a great trade but it was a shift in culture and signified the first real break from the spinning we had done for the previous decade or so.   GMs gotta be ok with taking risks - that was really one of MB's biggest downfalls. 

At least with this "bad" trade Gainey followed it up with good moves like adding Gionta, Cammaleri etc.  He transformed the team in one season & we were finally on the right track.  MB would make a good trade but then do nothing to follow it up.  I'll take the GM with the big plan over the guy who is scared to screw up so all he does is tinker.

 

Yeah im not sure what that was all about but Houle was the GM responsible for the Roy Fiasco - and, imho the worse move: Turgeon for spare parts - as well as Recchi for Zubrus, Linden for a 1st, Bure for spare parts - and some terrible drafting like Higgins, Chouinard, Hossa with high picks. 

Gainey, while not perfect, looks like Sam Pollock compared with Houle and even MB 

Higgins was not that bad we had Ryder there too when he first started out. I think they were part of the horrible development our team had at that time. Gainey was not bad and neither was Gauthier but they did nothing to improve the team from a drafting and development standpoint or at least nothing that stuck!

[habsisme]

1 hour ago, maas_art said:

I liked gainey too. i think he was playing the long game which is tricky for a GM because he clearly didnt get the time to see it come to fruition (I know he resigned but i think it was a "quit or you're fired" scenario). The team MB inherited was mostly Gainey/Gauthier and i think we're worse off today then we were then. 

I assume you mean gomez for mcdonaugh etc.   It wasnt a great trade but it was a shift in culture and signified the first real break from the spinning we had done for the previous decade or so.   GMs gotta be ok with taking risks - that was really one of MB's biggest downfalls. 

At least with this "bad" trade Gainey followed it up with good moves like adding Gionta, Cammaleri etc.  He transformed the team in one season & we were finally on the right track.  MB would make a good trade but then do nothing to follow it up.  I'll take the GM with the big plan over the guy who is scared to screw up so all he does is tinker.

 

Yeah im not sure what that was all about but Houle was the GM responsible for the Roy Fiasco - and, imho the worse move: Turgeon for spare parts - as well as Recchi for Zubrus, Linden for a 1st, Bure for spare parts - and some terrible drafting like Higgins, Chouinard, Hossa with high picks. 

Gainey, while not perfect, looks like Sam Pollock compared with Houle and even MB 

I liked Gainey, second best GM we've had since 93 (I think MB was our best). But that Gomez trade was just sbaolutely ridiculous. We were doing them a favor taking on that contract and we gave a bunch, including McDonagh for the right to do it. 

[Regis22]

21 minutes ago, electron58 said:

I don't remember Shutt or Cournoyer. Maybe because the other 2 fools left a lasting impression?

From 1993 to 1997, he worked on the Canadiens coaching staff as an assistant coach to Mario Tremblay.

https://www.habseyesontheprize.com/history/2020/9/7/21376245/the-story-of-canadiens-assistant-coaches-part-v-laperrieres-impressive-run-comes-to-end-habs-legend

 

The 1995-96 season was tumultuous. Four games into the season Demers, Thiffault, and General Manager Serge Savard were re-assigned or fired in a massive, poorly-timed, hockey operations reboot. Team President Ronald Corey relied on the past to guide the present team towards future success. Réjean Houle was named the new General Manager, Mario Tremblay the new head coach, and Canadiens’ legend Yvan Cournoyer the new assistant coach. None of them had any previous experience in their roles.

Although Tremblay retained Shutt and Laperrière on his bench, Cournoyer struggled to develop a rapport with the players, and they often spoke negatively about him to the media. So bad was the situation around Cournoyer, that he began doing scouting trips over coaching less than a year into his nomination.

Meanwhile, Shutt struggled to pull the team’s power play out of the basement.

At the conclusion of the 1996-97 season, Tremblay resigned as head coach, leaving the fate of his assistants in the hands of newcomer head coach Alain Vigneault.

[electron58]

10 minutes ago, Regis22 said:

From 1993 to 1997, he worked on the Canadiens coaching staff as an assistant coach to Mario Tremblay.

https://www.habseyesontheprize.com/history/2020/9/7/21376245/the-story-of-canadiens-assistant-coaches-part-v-laperrieres-impressive-run-comes-to-end-habs-legend

 

The 1995-96 season was tumultuous. Four games into the season Demers, Thiffault, and General Manager Serge Savard were re-assigned or fired in a massive, poorly-timed, hockey operations reboot. Team President Ronald Corey relied on the past to guide the present team towards future success. Réjean Houle was named the new General Manager, Mario Tremblay the new head coach, and Canadiens’ legend Yvan Cournoyer the new assistant coach. None of them had any previous experience in their roles.

Although Tremblay retained Shutt and Laperrière on his bench, Cournoyer struggled to develop a rapport with the players, and they often spoke negatively about him to the media. So bad was the situation around Cournoyer, that he began doing scouting trips over coaching less than a year into his nomination.

Meanwhile, Shutt struggled to pull the team’s power play out of the basement.

At the conclusion of the 1996-97 season, Tremblay resigned as head coach, leaving the fate of his assistants in the hands of newcomer head coach Alain Vigneault.

Interesting.   Dark days indeed.

[Regis22]

I remember Corey saying how many Stanley Cups each player won ; and how they all know what it takes to win because of the amount of Cups they had between them -  lol - but they couldnt coach at all 

[claremont]

14 minutes ago, Regis22 said:

I remember Corey saying how many Stanley Cups each player won ; and how they all know what it takes to win because of the amount of Cups they had between them -  lol - but they couldnt coach at all 

Yes - many times the best coaches are not the best players. Gretzky and Orr could not coach I believe because their talent came with natural ability and they couldn’t understand or communicate to players who didn’t possess some of their natural talents 

[claremont]

https://www.habseyesontheprize.com/platform/amp/ahl-laval-rocket/2021/12/7/22822164/montreal-canadiens-send-mattias-norlinder-to-laval-recall-corey-schueneman-prospect-habs-rocket
 

norlinder eligible for the Rocket 

I believe better to get accustomed to North America style of hockey vs sending him back to Sweden 

[maas_art]

1 hour ago, ramcharger440 said:

Higgins was not that bad we had Ryder there too when he first started out. I think they were part of the horrible development our team had at that time. Gainey was not bad and neither was Gauthier but they did nothing to improve the team from a drafting and development standpoint or at least nothing that stuck!

I think you're thinking of Chris Higgins?  (Who was drafted during the Andre Savard days I believe).  Im talking about Matt Higgins (drafted in the top 20 by Houle). And that year there were a few prominent Quebec born talent that we passed on (making it worse) like Briere ;) 

 

1 hour ago, habsisme said:

I liked Gainey, second best GM we've had since 93 (I think MB was our best). But that Gomez trade was just sbaolutely ridiculous. We were doing them a favor taking on that contract and we gave a bunch, including McDonagh for the right to do it. 

I know what you're saying and Im not saying it was a good trade but I think it was a complete shift in thinking about the roster.  Again, big picture, and i think if Gainey had stuck around we would have continued to improve the whole roster but we'll never know. 

[electron58]

Just now, claremont said:

https://www.habseyesontheprize.com/platform/amp/ahl-laval-rocket/2021/12/7/22822164/montreal-canadiens-send-mattias-norlinder-to-laval-recall-corey-schueneman-prospect-habs-rocket
 

norlinder eligible for the Rocket 

Boy,  did they ever screw up Norlinder's season.

[ramcharger440]

7 minutes ago, maas_art said:

I think you're thinking of Chris Higgins?  (Who was drafted during the Andre Savard days I believe).  Im talking about Matt Higgins (drafted in the top 20 by Houle). And that year there were a few prominent Quebec born talent that we passed on (making it worse) like Briere ;) 

 

I know what you're saying and Im not saying it was a good trade but I think it was a complete shift in thinking about the roster.  Again, big picture, and i think if Gainey had stuck around we would have continued to improve the whole roster but we'll never know. 

Yes Chris Higgins! I forgot about Matt Higgins completely.