Former & Retired Habs

[maas_art]

16 minutes ago, H_T_L said:

Is Max injured? Didn't see him in the Vegas lineup tonight.

Yeah Upper Body Injury.  #GoalSlumpArritis. 

[HabsAlways]

Ron Hainsey, we let slip away on waivers back in 2005 .. just played his 1000th career game

[BigTed3]

If we're going to vaunt Max Domi's performance thus far, let's also talk about how good Alex Galchenyuk has been in Arizona. The Coyotes went 2-5 without AG wile he was hurt and got out-scored 17 to 10 in those games, including being shutout 3 times. Since AG's return, the Yotes are 4-0 and have outscored their opponents 20-4. Galchenyuk has 4 pts in 4 games, is playing center, and is apparently doing well defensively as well, according to media reports.

So again, I'm pleased with what we've gotten from Domi but let's give this time to assess who won the trade and let's also acknowledge that if AG had been given the shot at center Domi's been getting that he too might have done well in the role.

[ramcharger440]

or not

 

[maas_art]

50 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

If we're going to vaunt Max Domi's performance thus far, let's also talk about how good Alex Galchenyuk has been in Arizona. The Coyotes went 2-5 without AG wile he was hurt and got out-scored 17 to 10 in those games, including being shutout 3 times. Since AG's return, the Yotes are 4-0 and have outscored their opponents 20-4. Galchenyuk has 4 pts in 4 games, is playing center, and is apparently doing well defensively as well, according to media reports.

So again, I'm pleased with what we've gotten from Domi but let's give this time to assess who won the trade and let's also acknowledge that if AG had been given the shot at center Domi's been getting that he too might have done well in the role.

Yeah i think its entirely possible both players end up doing well and having great careers in their new roles.  Im not positive either would have thrived in their old ones though so it may just be one of those great win-win trades. There arent many over the history of the NHL but ones like Jones for Johansen or Muller for Richer back in the day come to mind. 

[BigTed3]

8 hours ago, maas_art said:

Yeah i think its entirely possible both players end up doing well and having great careers in their new roles.  Im not positive either would have thrived in their old ones though so it may just be one of those great win-win trades. There arent many over the history of the NHL but ones like Jones for Johansen or Muller for Richer back in the day come to mind. 

The thing about Jones for Johansen is that both guys were good young players and likely would have had success staying with their original teams (maybe with a coaching change in Columbus for Johansen though). The trade was more about teams finding guys for different positions of need.

In Bergevin's case, he's made trades like Subban for Weber and AG for Domi where he's simply swapped one guy for another guy playing the same role. The funny thing here is that Ari feels like they traded a winger for a center and Mtl feels like they traded a winger for a center, so both teams could get a win out of this by filling a need simply because they're willing to give a guy a chance when another team wouldn't. Again, I'm very impressed with what Domi's done this year so far. He's been way better defensively than AG was for us and he's scoring goals. But I'm also cautious about extrapolating the data, because AG is a more proven goal scorer. I've said it before, but whether we traded AG or not, the biggest disappointment in his handling was that we could have easily played him at center for 3/4 of last season when we knew we weren't going anywhere and had nothing to lose, and his trade value likely would have been way higher than we got for him.

[jennifer_rocket]

11 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

If we're going to vaunt Max Domi's performance thus far, let's also talk about how good Alex Galchenyuk has been in Arizona. The Coyotes went 2-5 without AG wile he was hurt and got out-scored 17 to 10 in those games, including being shutout 3 times. Since AG's return, the Yotes are 4-0 and have outscored their opponents 20-4. Galchenyuk has 4 pts in 4 games, is playing center, and is apparently doing well defensively as well, according to media reports.

So again, I'm pleased with what we've gotten from Domi but let's give this time to assess who won the trade and let's also acknowledge that if AG had been given the shot at center Domi's been getting that he too might have done well in the role.

It makes you wonder... Could we have acquired Domi for someone other than Galchenyuk? Could we have both AG and Domi playing in Montreal this season?

[Habs_Hockey_Nutz]

1 hour ago, jennifer_rocket said:

It makes you wonder... Could we have acquired Domi for someone other than Galchenyuk? Could we have both AG and Domi playing in Montreal this season?

It is still hard to understand the logic of Habs management regarding how they seem to diminish returns for players of value. And continue to reward players of less value like Deslaurier and Shaw etc.

Perhaps they could have traded Shaw and a prospect for Domi... then your question would be answered positively

[maas_art]

4 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

I've said it before, but whether we traded AG or not, the biggest disappointment in his handling was that we could have easily played him at center for 3/4 of last season when we knew we weren't going anywhere and had nothing to lose, and his trade value likely would have been way higher than we got for him.

Totally, unequivocally and completely agree.   As you and i have said before - ANYONE - is tradable. Would it make sense to trade Connor McDavid? Probably not, but if colorado offers you MacKinnon, Landeskog, Rantanen and Barrie for him, you'd say no?   

My problem is not that we traded AG (even though i liked him a lot). My problem is that we devalued him so much prior to doing it.   

[maas_art]

1 hour ago, jennifer_rocket said:

It makes you wonder... Could we have acquired Domi for someone other than Galchenyuk? Could we have both AG and Domi playing in Montreal this season?

I honestly dont think so. I dont think they were looking to dump Domi. I just think they felt that Galchenyuk was a better fit for them.  Domi was still one of their very best young prospects/players and I dont think you could have gotten him for anything other than Galchenyuk or maybe Drouin, Gallagher etc.   Maybe you could have offered Mete + Poehling but I think that would have been worse because we want to get younger, not older at this stage. 

[Habs=stanleycup]

20 hours ago, BigTed3 said:

If we're going to vaunt Max Domi's performance thus far, let's also talk about how good Alex Galchenyuk has been in Arizona. The Coyotes went 2-5 without AG wile he was hurt and got out-scored 17 to 10 in those games, including being shutout 3 times. Since AG's return, the Yotes are 4-0 and have outscored their opponents 20-4. Galchenyuk has 4 pts in 4 games, is playing center, and is apparently doing well defensively as well, according to media reports.

So again, I'm pleased with what we've gotten from Domi but let's give this time to assess who won the trade and let's also acknowledge that if AG had been given the shot at center Domi's been getting that he too might have done well in the role.

I think that the decision to trade Galchenyuk was political and was done for the benefit of the coaching staff, in the sense that they didn't appreciate his father's interference.

By springtime we'll see who won this trade.

[BigTed3]

2 hours ago, Habs=stanleycup said:

I think that the decision to trade Galchenyuk was political and was done for the benefit of the coaching staff, in the sense that they didn't appreciate his father's interference.

By springtime we'll see who won this trade.

I don't even think we'll be able to tell who won the trade for a few years. Maybe both teams will feel like winners.

But it's funny you talk about AG's father meddling because Tinordi's dad Mark was also rumored to be pushing the Habs' buttons, yet the team was perfectly content to acquire a guy like Domi with a hockey dad and a guy like Peca with a hockey dad, where there's potential for meddling too. Personally, I think a good coach can block out that interference. And even then, you look at a guy like Eric Lindros, who's parents meddled so much they advised him to hold out on Quebec, and the Nords traded him for a huge haul that resulted in Cup wins for them down the line. We didn't get any type of haul for AG, and we gave up a goal scorer on a team that had few goal scorers going into the season (and yes, I still question whether Domi will keep up his pace and whether Gallagher will stay healthy with his playing style and I still question who's supposed to be shooting the puck on the PP). I'm not even bringing into question Domi's performance at this point, I'm simply sure that the Habs' handling of Galchenyuk caused his value to plummet when he could have easily been showcased as a top-line offensive center capable of scoring 30 goals a year.

[caperns61]

On 11/1/2018 at 10:37 PM, BigTed3 said:

If we're going to vaunt Max Domi's performance thus far, let's also talk about how good Alex Galchenyuk has been in Arizona. The Coyotes went 2-5 without AG wile he was hurt and got out-scored 17 to 10 in those games, including being shutout 3 times. Since AG's return, the Yotes are 4-0 and have outscored their opponents 20-4. Galchenyuk has 4 pts in 4 games, is playing center, and is apparently doing well defensively as well, according to media reports.

So again, I'm pleased with what we've gotten from Domi but let's give this time to assess who won the trade and let's also acknowledge that if AG had been given the shot at center Domi's been getting that he too might have done well in the role.

Lets see how he is doing after 11 or 12 games. - 1 last night 0 shots on net. Where are the reports he is playing well defensively. Oh and by the way CF % is at 44% second worst on the team next to Josh Archibald. 

[BigTed3]

3 hours ago, caperns61 said:

Lets see how he is doing after 11 or 12 games. - 1 last night 0 shots on net. Where are the reports he is playing well defensively. Oh and by the way CF % is at 44% second worst on the team next to Josh Archibald. 

Sure, let's see... Galchenyuk's CF was 52% going into last night's game and he had a bad game possession-wise last night (keeping in mind the Canes are the top team in the league at shot generation so far this year, so it wasn't just him), which killed his season totals because of the small sample size. He was a positive possession player 4 of 6 seasons with us FWIW. In any case, Yotes are 5-0 with him in the line-up (vs. 2-5 without him), so we'll see if they keep rolling... Brian Wilde stated that he had watched Galchenyuk playing center for the Coyotes and that he was having no issues defensively, and someone else reported they had spoken to local Arizona media, who said they didn't think Galchenyuk was hurting them defensively. Not to say he's a standout, just that what he brings on offence wasn't being brought down by poor defence.

And if we're going to compare, Domi is 4th worst on the team and 2nd worst among forwards for us in terms of CF too, so not like there's much difference between him and Galchenyuk there. And Domi's been a negative Corsi player every season he's been in the NHL, albeit on a bad team. Again, I'm not declaring a winner or loser in the trade by any means, just saying that if people are going to talk up Domi for playing 8-10 strong games, Galchenyuk has had just as good a start for Arizona.

[CaptWelly]

Is this the only forum or "team" fan page that is concerned about players after they're no longer on their team? 

[caperns61]

50 minutes ago, BigTed3 said:

Sure, let's see... Galchenyuk's CF was 52% going into last night's game and he had a bad game possession-wise last night (keeping in mind the Canes are the top team in the league at shot generation so far this year, so it wasn't just him), which killed his season totals because of the small sample size. He was a positive possession player 4 of 6 seasons with us FWIW. In any case, Yotes are 5-0 with him in the line-up (vs. 2-5 without him), so we'll see if they keep rolling... Brian Wilde stated that he had watched Galchenyuk playing center for the Coyotes and that he was having no issues defensively, and someone else reported they had spoken to local Arizona media, who said they didn't think Galchenyuk was hurting them defensively. Not to say he's a standout, just that what he brings on offence wasn't being brought down by poor defence.

And if we're going to compare, Domi is 4th worst on the team and 2nd worst among forwards for us in terms of CF too, so not like there's much difference between him and Galchenyuk there. And Domi's been a negative Corsi player every season he's been in the NHL, albeit on a bad team. Again, I'm not declaring a winner or loser in the trade by any means, just saying that if people are going to talk up Domi for playing 8-10 strong games, Galchenyuk has had just as good a start for Arizona.

Actually Galchenyk's start has not been as good. Domi has played in 12 games this season and Galchenyk only 5, Domi is still a point per game player, Galchenyk is not. Domi CF at 47.6 compared to 44%, you cannot filter out games to pad his numbers. Domi is 3.6 points better. One  could also easily argue Domi is playing with our worst defensive forward on our team. It was a toss up between Droiun and Galchenyk last season.  And we dont have to insulate Domi like Glachenyk. 52.3% offensive zone starts compared to Galchenyk at 62.5 % offensive zone starts. And everyone complaining about Domi not shooting enough he averages 4 shots per game Galchenyk, 3.4 shots. Expected  +/- where shots a are taken from for and against when  player is on the ice Domi +0.8 Galchenyk - 2.4. Apples to apples Domi has still out played Galchenyk. And one other notes Domi plays for the hab's, Galchenyk doesn't

[kinot-2]

The Winnipeg Jets agreed to terms with forward Logan Shaw on a one-year, two-way contract on Sunday.

The deal is worth an average annual value of $675,000 in the NHL.

[HabsAlways]

On 11/3/2018 at 1:37 PM, CaptWelly said:

Is this the only forum or "team" fan page that is concerned about players after they're no longer on their team? 

Some love to argue, for years in some cases, that X player should never have been traded for Y.      

[ramcharger440]

2 hours ago, HabsAlways said:

Some love to argue, for years in some cases, that X player should never have been traded for Y.      

Yep.

[habs1952]

9 hours ago, HabsAlways said:

Some love to argue, for years in some cases, that X player should never have been traded for Y.      

Do you mean like the Chelios for Savard trade? That one really sucked.

[HabsAlways]

Just now, habs1952 said:

Do you mean like the Chelios for Savard trade? That one really sucked.

lol that's one

I also remember a guy who kept bringing up Alexander Perezoghin and how he never got a shot.  The Sekac trade recently (where Sekac didn't even make it in the NHL in the end), etc etc

[jennifer_rocket]

Subban off to a great start in Nashville. 17 games played, 12 points, +9, 23:38 ATOI. Miss this guy!

[ChiLla]

Fun fact: Darren Dietz sits just behind the top of the scoring race amongst defenders in the KHL with 26 points in 25 games.

https://en.khl.ru/stat/players/671/defenses/

[tony5775]

Daniel Carr is 2nd in scoring in the AHL this year 9G 11A in 14 games. Plus 18 and 6 PP goals. Always liked that guy, hope he gets a call up to Vegas soon.

[habs1952]

5 hours ago, tony5775 said:

Daniel Carr is 2nd in scoring in the AHL this year 9G 11A in 14 games. Plus 18 and 6 PP goals. Always liked that guy, hope he gets a call up to Vegas soon.

He's probably wondering why he is in the AHL and Pacioretty is in the NHL.